Nazi memorabilia at gun shows

[no_problem]

Do too many Nazi memorabilia dealers at gun shows give the sport a bad name? What if you were new to the shooting hobby, and you come to a gun show to broaden your horizons...and you see a bunch of big Nazi flags and stuff like that, would that put you off of the shooting sports or give you a negative impression of gun owners?

 

[JWarren]

You really don't see Nazi memorabilia at gun shows down here. Dunno why... it seems that you will other places.

I don't think it would bother me, however-- provided that we are talking about a dealer in War memorbilia and not Hans' House of Nazis looking to recruit the 4th Reich.

Ironically, I've actually got an original Nazi helmet in my jeep as we speak. I was going through some things in Dad's attic and found one that my grandfather brought back from France and gave to me.



-- John

 

[mgregg85]

Its all in how the stuff is presented I imagine. I stay away from nazi stuff just because I don't like symbols of hate but some people really aren't racist and just like to collect the stuff. To each his own.

 

[Lurp]

I think it may be a slight turn off to some people, but I also think that a sensible person would realize thats not how all gun owners are. Their will always be an extreme group setting a bad example in almost any culture/organization. It's' kind of like not all vegitarians throw paint of fur coats or spike trees and not all metal heads worship the devil, etc...

 

[Eric F]

There are a few guys around these parts that have a few articles here and there but the things that really pisses me off are the t-shirts jars of sauces toys and coin collectors that keep comming around

Their will always be an extreme group setting a bad example in almost any culture/organization.

Yeah look at some of the extreeme jokers on THR

 

[220_Swift]

Lately I have been seeing a lot more KKK crap than nazi memorabilia.

 

[Nix]

kkk crap is just that... crap

nazi stuff is extremely cool. to say that the nazi stuff is pushing hate is the same as saying that guns kill people not people. I could walk around with a nazi flag as a bandana and it wouldnt make me hate. I could walk around in full officer uniform and it wouldnt motivate me to turn my bedroom into a concentration camp.

 

[Limeyfellow]

You get alot of militaria sales at gunshows around here, and the Nazi stuff generally sells under that type of sale. It doesn't bother me too much, such as buying a German WW2 mauser doesn't bother me.

 

[JWarren]

I stay away from nazi stuff just because I don't like symbols of hate but some people really aren't racist and just like to collect the stuff.

Intrestingly enough, the swastika wasn't a "symbol" of hate until Hitler got his hands on it. Many cultures used the swastika with various meanings. My mother has a quilt that pre-dates National Socialism by probably 50 years that has swastika-ish symbols in its patterns.


Regardless of a person's position, there is no denying that the period of time in question was an intersting one on many levels. In my Public Relations Masters, a lot of our studies went back to the propaganda machine ran by Geobbels. It is a fascinating study of "Engineering Consent" and the "Spiral of Silence."

But at the same time, I can't imagine anyone who would actually want to live in that world, nor can I imagine anyone defending that regime.


-- John

 

[Eric F]

I find it interesting that some think the KKK is crap but Nazi stuff is cool?(and not just the poster here) I see the diffrence in the two as only who they hate and want removed from socioety. There is no room for either in my world!

 

[Vaarok]

I find it objectionable only when that's all a guy has at his table and it's as much a giant "look-what-shocking-objects-I-got" display as an actual buy/sell/appraise or informative exhibit.

There's one dealer locally who does that a lot, and it bothers me a bit, considering he has SS runes and things on his business card. Most other dealers that have some Nazi items typically also have Japanese items and present their wares in a fashion that shows they are interested in non-weapon historical artifacts.

 

[wolf13]

There is nazi stuff at the gun shows in CA, but it just goes along with all the other WWII history stuff. The way it is shown has nothing to do with hate, it is more history than anything else. I personally am into history and look at all the things people have. I wont buy a nazi flag, but like someone else said, Hitler changed the meaning of the whole thing.

 

[JWarren]

There is no room for either in my world!

But what are you going to do? The last time I checked, people can believe what they want to believe. And you see... its not just your world. It's that person's as well.

There are lots of things I disagree with in this world, but no one asked me whether or not they had my approval.

It all goes back to the "I may disagree with what you say, but I will die for your right to say it."


We don't need any "Thought-Police." As long as no one is trying to harm anyone, people can believe what they want.


-- John

 

[jerkface11]

They always say they do it for the historical value. Makes you wonder why none of them set up tables with Japanese flags or Viet-Cong stuff.

 

[wolf13]

Actually, the places that have it at the gun shows I go to have Japanese things as well.

 

[The Lone Haranguer]

On the one hand, it is undeniable that this was and is a fascinating period of history. Trying to reach an understanding of their motivations is not the same as approving of or endorsing them. On the other hand, I want to see it presented as historical interest - preferably with Allied memorabilia to balance it out - not as glorification. Most of these displays, unfortunately, seem to convey the latter impression.

 

[yesit'sloaded]

Kinda funny this came up as I had a talk with my girlfriend about this stuff a while back. She had family in the Holocaust and isn't too fond of nazis or the kkk. The stuff itself she sees as proof that evil lost out and now it is sold as trinkets. The people selling it are another matter. Attitude is everything. Sell it as a piece of history and she doesn't mind and might even look at non ss stuff. Talk about it like "isn't all this nazi stuff cool because they were the best ever and we need to do as they did and get these money grubbing Jews out of here" and your lucky if you don't get an earful at the least.

 

[mp510]

From a historical perspective, it's nothing more than relics of one of the worlds most spanning conflicts. Nothing more, nothing less. If you want to politicize it- either as a NAZI sympothiser or from some other perspective, that's your thing.

 

[JWarren]

One thing just occured to me.

I doubt you'd see all that many Nazi-only memorbilia tables at gun shows if it wasn't worth their time to set up.

Well, maybe not. I didn't consider a recruiting angle. After all, I think there still is a National Socialist Party in the US. I may be wrong though.

Still... makes you wonder as to how many Brown Shirts are standing next to you while you look at overpriced crap.


-- John

 

[siglite]

I kind of had the same thoughts as the OP. Sort of. At least the suspicion or question was there. Then I walked into a gun show recently and recognized a guy running a booth with nazi paraphernalia. I hadn't seen this guy in quite some time. But I know him. Served with him in the corps. Hell, I played baseball with the guy as a kid. He's always been a stand up guy of good character.

As I scanned the both, I realized there was Japanese stuff there, and a LOT of US Army stuff there from the same period. There were probably a dozen fairly neat USN items too. He had a pretty well rounded historical display (presumably all for sale).

Now, I was offended by one thing, and I felt it absolutely necessary to call him on it.

"Hey man! Long time no see!"
"Whoa, where'd you come from?"
"Dude, I'm noticing a conspicuous lack of Marine Corps insignia and items here and I demand an explanation."
"Hahahah, that's all in my PRIVATE collection."

He then proceeded to show me some pretty damned cool USMC artifacts.

Hell, he's probably a member here. But regardless, it's my opinion that him, and most folks that collect period stuff like that are into it for the historic cool factor.

 

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

Unfortunately, some of the dealers DO politicize it. I am not a big fan of gun shows already since i can usually get a better deal on a guaranteed product online, and give my local gun shop some money using them as an FFL. But when I do go to a show, I am there to look at guns, and gun gear, preferably new/modern. I like history, I just don't like buying historical items. I don't mind others buying Nazi stuff, this is America after all, they can do what they want. I don't have the right to not be offended. But I don't gotta give them my money, even if they have something I want. I don't want to take part in their world of hate. If they are just selling some history stuff for the sake of history, and have Japanese and American as well, or stuff from other wars, great for them. But the guys who hang up the big Nazi flag and start talking to you about their type of politics...I'll pass.

 

[AZTOY]

The swastika is the symbol for a Buddhist temple. It is a symbol of love - not hate.
The symbol. The swastika is used on maps of Korea to indicate a temple.

The swastika can be seen throughout Korea.

 

[MachIVshooter]

The local shows here often have some such artifacts. I personally have no desire to own a Nazi Flag or Uniform, etc. but firearms with such markings are neat.

 

[trickyasafox]

JWarren-

I am getting a masters in Public Comm- and we also talk a lot about the WWII German propoganda machine. Small world-

I think geobbles (no idea how to spell his name) was quoted as saying something to the effect that you can't tell people something new- you have to tell them something they know

He was referencing the hatred of the Jews and other 'undesirables'. I wish i could remember it properly

haven't been to a gun show in years- the one by me occurs after i leave for college so havent had a chance to go. I'm torn on the nazi propoganda though- its history, it should never be forgotten or ignored, but i don't want to see something that stood as a symbol for a horrific ideal treated as a cheap thing to be traded on a whim.

 

[JWarren]

Tricky,

Yep... we studied the same things. It is really amazing in a totally terrifying way how he engineered and guided the people into accepting-- if not embracing-- Hitler's Germany.

I think it is a powerful statement as to his own understanding of his impact on the rise of Nazism that he chose to commit suicide at the end. He knew that his chickens would come home to roost.

it should never be forgotten or ignored, but i don't want to see something that stood as a symbol for a horrific ideal treated as a cheap thing to be traded on a whim.

I can definately sympathize with that view. At the same time, as yesit'sloaded pointed out on this thread.... what a better way for it to be illustrated that the Nazi's lost than to see those that defeated them treating their possessions as novelty trinkets? If anything, I'd see it as an insult.


It reminds me somewhat of a practice among the Victorian Brits that involved ingesting the powdered bodies of mummies as a "potion" for long life. I can't think of a more powerful statement as to the collapse of the ancient Egyptians than to have the bodies of their Pharoh's ingested as a potion.

Incidently, that disgusts me on many, and deep levels.


-- John