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If I run across that I stop doing business with them, less any locations where firearms are prohibited by law.

And THAT is the point - RESPECT the property owner's rights and if you disagree, go elsewhere. Get enough folks to agree with you and maybe they'll change their mind or view; but until then, their house, their rules. This really isn't hard to comprehend.
 
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Scattylobo, I think former cops in good standing should have a free pass to carry EVERYWHERE, as long as they still have their wits about them.

REALLY? Why is that? Is there some form of automatic assumption that because someone WAS a cop at one time they get a free pass? Are you one of those screaming about your 2A rights? (except for certain folks like judges, politicians, movie stars, and now former LEOs?)

Should those former LEOs also be allowed to carry in gov't buildings, airports, on planes etc. as well?

Why is that? Because if we are referring to retired officers, they earned it! And retired LEO's do enjoy the authority to ccw in the US. Living life in the glass house comes with benefits, jealousy wont change it.
 
And how did they "earn" a "right" over non-Leos?

WOW, now we have separate classes for those who supposedly "earned" it. What about cops who worked simple traffic duty and never pulled their gun? What about Secret Service vs street cops? How many classes and grades get he "privilege"?
Try smelling what you're shoveling

What a bunch of crap

And BTW, my dad was retired NYC street cop for 33 years in the worst neighborhood for a white cop to work in........
 
I was a cop,and I have been to court hundreds of time so I know full well the outcome of a good shoot.

As a former cop who has been to court hundreds of times, I should hope that you know that the charges brought about in your "good shoot" would be separate from the potential felony charges brought about from your "had a gun where the law said you shouldn't have".

And please...don't go on about "rather be tried by 12 than carried by 6". What we're talking about here are personal choices in our every day carry routine, not what we'd do in a self-defence situation. Making a choice on what to do when you encounter a "no guns" sign is hardly a "rather be tried by 12" good shoot scenario.

Part of what we all are supposed to do as responsible firearms owners who choose to carry is NOT deliberately place ourselves in harms way. If you feel that strongly about needing your firearm, to the utter exclusion of the law and, potentially, the revocation of your RKBA by blatently ignoring the law, then I submit that you're better off putting in the effort to deliberately avoid those places entirely.


Scattylobo, I think former cops in good standing should have a free pass to carry EVERYWHERE, as long as they still have their wits about them.

I'm a retired Sailor, served 20 years and honorably so. Does this apply to me on that basis? If so, then why am I placed on a pedestal above so many of my fellow citizens?

Here's my position: I did not serve in the military in order to place myself above anyone else. I don't ask for special rights above those of any other citizen. I served for my country in support of the U.S. Constitution and the rights of ALL our citizens.

I think ANY citizen should have a "free pass" (spoken "right") to carry EVERYWHERE unless that RIGHT has been removed via due process.


The RKBA is to be mitigated ONLY where the rights of other PRIVATE CITIZENS are concerned, in my opinion. Private citizens are not the government.

But until we get to that point, my opinion must be weighed against the actual laws and the consequences involved.

People would do well to remember who the enemy actually is, here. It's not our fellow private citizens, it's the government. That's why the limitations of the Second Amendment are placed on the government.
 
Load, I consider former cops in good standing to be worthy of full time carry. I think some actually need to carry full time. I have family that are retired cops that carry per the law. They are at risk of being recognized everywhere while in town. They risked their lives to protect and serve. All doughnut jokes aside, they paid their dues.

I don't understand your post I guess.

FYI, I don't scream about 2A rights.
There are some people out there that should not own guns.
 
Chief, you should get the free pass as well within the current system.

I have never been a cop, and I am not a veteran. I am OK with the CHL process in Texas, and my limitations.

These are all opinions BTW.
 
SORRY, NO one gets a "free ride" based on their former job. Either a "right" as folks scream about is the same for all, or it is a privilege for the few. Stop your crap and either be for all or be for none; and if you are for privileges for a few, then stop whining about my right as a property owner to restrict things.

Nothing but hypocrites it seems. Bring it on........;) because a serious discussion where we won't get banned is cool............
 
SORRY, NO one gets a "free ride" based on their former job. Either a "right" as folks scream about is the same for all, or it is a privilege for the few. Stop your crap and either be for all or be for none; and if you are for privileges for a few, then stop whining about my right as a property owner to restrict things.

Nothing but hypocrites it seems. Bring it on........;) because a serious discussion where we won't get banned is cool............
What? Splain in detail please. No, actually don't.

Are you an outlaw if caught in possession of a gun?

So, as long as somebody is not incarcerated at the time, they should be allowed to carry? Is that your point?

It is hard to communicate with people on these boards without writing a novel.
 
SORRY, NO one gets a "free ride" based on their former job. Either a "right" as folks scream about is the same for all, or it is a privilege for the few. Stop your crap and either be for all or be for none; and if you are for privileges for a few, then stop whining about my right as a property owner to restrict things.

Nothing but hypocrites it seems. Bring it on........;) because a serious discussion where we won't get banned is cool............

Name calling is inappropriate whether it gets you banned or not. Try this tact instead... my brother in law (who btw is too careless with firearms for me to allow him to have one in his possession on the property) tells me frequently and with great heat that he (as an LEO) works for the state not the citizen. Since this occupation carries weapons to benefit the state once retired their carry is no longer that stated benefit and needs to be put under the same restriction as the average citizen.
 
Yeah, right.............try reading it again................I'd type it more slowly but that goes into banned territory

NO one gets a "special right" as in LEO getting a deal - what is so hard to understand?

I'm done, y'all can argue amongst yourselves and pat yourself on the back..............still a bunch of crap
 
I would simply like to see Tennessee law changed and make it so we are not criminally liable under the stupid sign like in many other states. Unless a refusal to leave gains a trespassing conviction.

Doing that would make the need for a thread like this one virtually non-existent.

That is a dream that I know will probably never come true. It is hard enough to get a parking lot law in place and changed so that it makes better sense with this legislature we have. There are enough RINOS to start a herd.
 
Yeah, right.............try reading it again................I'd type it more slowly but that goes into banned territory

NO one gets a "special right" as in LEO getting a deal - what is so hard to understand?

I'm done, y'all can argue amongst yourselves and pat yourself on the back..............still a bunch of crap
Don't juice and post at the same time.
 
Have a goog evening everybody. Happy Easter. Too full to hold this device and stay awake. TOO MUCH HAMMMMMMM. ZZZZZZZZZZ

Z
 
I don't use the social media...they are full of false bravado and chest thumping...or so I've been told.

Which is why I said sounds like. Congratulations you are so advanced you don't use social media. Why are you on THR, then? Internet message boards and forums ARE part of social media. But you're too cool to use the popular social media. You hipster of hipsters.

You live in Michigan, sir, where entire communities are subject to Sharia law, and where a once-proud city [one of the largest in the country] is bankrupt; and with large portions of it in abject ruins. That may be your real world but it isn't mine...thank God.

Did you just fart, because you are talking out of your arse. Yes, Michigan is home to a lot of Muslims in close community, mostly Jordanian and Bosnian. However, NO community in Michigan is subject to Sharia law. You sure you're not on Facebook? Seems I have to debunk that drivel on a weekly basis for the grossly uninformed. As for Detroit, well, we do have the Democrats who held power there for so long. As well as extreme corporate greed for one of the biggest industries in the world. But the fault of Detroits failure does not fall on those shoulders alone. It falls on everyone who felt Made in the USA wasn't good enough anymore. But that's another topic that has got nothing to do with guns. Detroit is not alone in its failed economy, crime and whatever else you may have been alluding to.

You've done a remarkable job for a clutch of hens. Fortunately, the roosters here in Tennessee still have their spurs and know how to use them.

Actually, considering where we were in the Granholm years, to where we are now, we have done a remarkable job. Employment is up, conservatives are in power in Lansing, bad laws are being reformed or repealed and decent laws are taking their place. So for this clutch of hens, we've gone a long way in restoring freedom. But you go ahead and sharpening those spurs you got, because that sound tough and scary. Tennessee online militias everywhere are impressed.

"By defying outright these tyrannical government abuses, we invite something far worse than temporary disarmament."

You're a veteran [thank you for your service]...do you use the VA for your medical care?

Hell no. I could, but I have a great job with excellent insurance. I haven't set foot in a VA clinic in a few years, just long enough to be treated like crap, wait forever and find out I'm eligible for minimal coverage that BC/BS already provides.

"I like to call it prison, and it's a place I'd rather not go."

Incarceration comes in many forms...just ask the U.S Judicial Dept.

And this means what? Some veiled obscure conspiratorial enslavement exists under the DoJ? Well, that covers you down there in TN, too. But be that as it may, I like my gun rights, and want to keep them as long as I can. I like my job, my house and my family, too. Doing something stupid like breaking the law in some lazy form of protest against a law I don't like is going to get those things taken from me. And no jury on the planet is sentimental enough to acquit on the "Because it's tyranny" defense.


"It's a pretty far stretch to link obeying federal law to accepting anything our overlords can impose."

You must have been asleep for the last six years.

You act as though the last six years have been completely apocalyptic. I'm not denying there has been massive amounts of government overreach, bad laws, etc. ad nauseum. But what in the three hells does that have to do with whether or not you disarm in a gun free zone?! Those laws have been in place for DECADES and are nothing new.

I'll leave you with this quote which Douglas MacArthur wrongly attributed to Lincoln:

"To sin by silence, when they should protest, makes cowards of men." - Ella Wheeler Wilcox

Akin to "The only thing necessary for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing."
I get it. Don't see how it's really relevant to the topic of whether or not to abide by the law. Oh wait, yes I do. If you ignore the law, you are being silent in your protest. You are not actively, vocally working to over ride or repeal the law. You are simply ignoring it, as a coward would. A selfish act that helps no one and does nothing. Except maybe get you thrown in jail.
Also, random quasi-relevant quotations (like my sig line) is also something widely prevalent on most forms of social media. But you don't use that.
 
Chief, you should get the free pass as well within the current system.

I have never been a cop, and I am not a veteran. I am OK with the CHL process in Texas, and my limitations.

These are all opinions BTW.

I am honored you think that of me...I really am.

But my point is that I'm just another citizen, and I believe that right applies to ALL citizens equally.

People can say things like "LEO in good standing", or "prior military in good standing", but the truth of it is that we are ALL "in good standing" until we demonstrate otherwise and due process comes into play.

Scaatylobo is nothing more than any other citizen in good standing, just like I am or you are. We're in good standing by the way our rights, freedoms, and laws say we are UNTIL proven otherwise.

That's the way "rights" work...they apply to all, or they're not rights...they're privileges for the few, and the few ALWAYS turns out to be those in power.
 
I'm done, y'all can argue amongst yourselves and pat yourself on the back..............still a bunch of crap
Translation: I don't like the way you folks play; I'm taking my ball and going home. Waah.

Why does a thread asking for responses about what members do when they encounter the "no guns" signage at (presumably) mostly private businesses turn into such discord?

Oh, and by the way, I've spent time in Tennessee (in-laws live there) and have seen far more "no guns" signage there than I've seen up here in the land of CostCo (and even my home state, Michigan, which does, yes, have a large Muslim community).

Insinuating that we are less than courageous citizens because we obey the laws is really rather insulting. Much anonymous internet chest-thumping, the usual standard quotes and even bashing of Michigan and Detroit ... ah, great thread!
 
@ jlr1962

I keep my HR218 qualifications up EVERY year,that require me to shoot a departmental qualifier on our range and the RO keeps the scores and they are filed.

that being said,I see MANY [ not all ! ] civilian shooters that are better than many [ not all ] cops and retired cops.

Those that CHOOSE to shoot a qual every year, just happen to be those of us that keep our skill set up ALL YEAR.

IF there were a way to get all CCW's to qual around the nation,I would say that all should be allowed to carry in all places other than courthouses [ those under domestic stress get a 'bit' queer and might not be thinking straight.

btw,of the 120+ retirees that are still breathing,only about 20 bother to qual yearly.

The federal law [ passed by Bush ] refered to as HR218 ,allows me to carry in all 50 states [ or as Obama said ,all 67 states ].
 
@ retired USN chief

I do agree with most of your post.

But do note ,please that under FEDERAL LAW retired and active LEO's are allowed to CCW in all 50 states.

That is not exactly what it says on any CCW permit ,or on any state laws.

I do agree that IF you could demonstrate your abilitys, that you should be allowed to CCW in all 50 states.

But there are no current laws to cover that ----- yet :banghead:.

And yes,I do carry at all times.

And yes, that LAW says NOTHING about "shall not carry".

I am going by the letter and INTENT of the law.
 
Have a goog evening everybody. Happy Easter. Too full to hold this device and stay awake. TOO MUCH HAMMMMMMM. ZZZZZZZZZZ

Z
My sentiments too.

I did have a Happy Easter, thank you. And, yes I did have ham. And, it is hard to stay awake, so much so, that I would have had a hard time staying awake at the shooting range.

Oh, BTW, ah......ZZZZZZZZZ
 
Old Dog said:
Funny, I've never seen any "no guns" signs in my local Washington state Costco stores ...

This is Costco's nationwide policy on firearms in their stores.

Costco does not believe that it is necessary for firearms to be brought into its warehouse stores, except in the case of authorized law enforcement officers.

For the protection of all our members and employees, we feel this is a reasonable and prudent precaution to ensure a pleasant shopping experience and safe workplace. Our policy is meant to protect our members and employees in all warehouses around the world.

This is not a new policy and we do not customize the policy for each individual city/county/state/country where we do business.
 
"Congratulations you are so advanced you don't use social media."

I don't feel compelled to share every aspect of my life, especially with small-minded, immature individuals who like to hide beyond their keyboards and call others names.

"Why are you on THR, then?"

Because it is one the finest resources on the 'net.

"Internet message boards and forums ARE part of social media. But you're too cool to use the popular social media. You hipster of hipsters."

See above.

"Did you just fart, because you are talking out of your arse."

Never before have I conversed with anyone who talks like a teenager and quotes Albert Einstein.

"However, NO community in Michigan is subject to Sharia law."

That certainly would come as a great surprise in certain areas within Dearborn.
Maybe a little less time on Facebook and a little more time keeping up on current events in your state would be in order.

"But you go ahead and sharpening [sic] those spurs you got, because that sound tough and scary."

Not a fan of dry humor, eh? You started the exchange. Live with it.

"...do you use the VA for your medical care?"

"Hell no. I could, but I have a great job with excellent insurance. I haven't set foot in a VA clinic in a few years, just long enough to be treated like crap, wait forever and find out I'm eligible for minimal coverage that BC/BS already provides."

Do you care about what the Dept. of InJustice is doing to our fellow vets?

"Incarceration comes in many forms...just ask the U.S Judicial Dept."

"And this means what? Some veiled obscure conspiratorial enslavement exists under the DoJ?"

See above. And how about we add several other federal alphabet agencies?

"You act as though the last six years have been completely apocalyptic."

How about we add several other federal alphabet agencies?

"I'm not denying there has been massive amounts of government overreach, bad laws, etc. ad nauseum. But what in the three hells does that have to do with whether or not you disarm in a gun free zone?!"

Gun-free zones? Oh, yeah...criminal-enabling killing zones where honest, law-abiding citizens are stripped of their rights to self-defense. Only the *special* people with their taxpayer-funded bodyguards have a right to self-defense in that twisted world. Liam Neeson would be so proud of you.

"Those laws have been in place for DECADES and are nothing new."

Therefore, they are still acceptable?! What if the FCC shows up at your front door and tells you your 1st Amendment rights are being amended: you can't use Facebook or Twitter or whatever your trendy choice of the day is? Your type of communication in Hastings is no longer permitted...you're not one of the *special* people. Give a rat's ass about the next generations' rights?

"I get it."

You don't get it.

"Don't see how it's really relevant to the topic of whether or not to abide by the law."

Of course you don't...if you think illogically, there's always that danger.

"Oh wait, yes I do. If you ignore the law, you are being silent in your protest."

Huh?! That's 180° out of phase. Are you familiar with the particulars of the law in Tennessee? Of course not. Silly me...there's that Facebook thing where you can regurgitate your experiences to the entire world. Who has time for real research on germane subjects. It's so much easier just to publish your version of the facts.

"You are not actively, vocally working to over ride or repeal the law."

How many times have you appeared in court to assert your 2nd Amendment rights. I'd guess less than once, but please do be specific.

"You are simply ignoring it, as a coward would. A selfish act that helps no one and does nothing. Except maybe get you thrown in jail."

You don't know me. Further, you have exactly zero knowledge about my practices, advocacy and successes in defending my [and others'] Constitutional [federal] or Tennessee constitutional rights. Not that you let gross ignorance deter you while you insult from your cocoon.

"Also, random quasi-relevant quotations (like my sig line) is also something widely prevalent on most forms of social media. But you don't use that."

You've changed your definition again?
 
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Mr Blade First, use of the quote function would help make your posts a bit more easily readable ...

Ah, Red Wind: we up here in CostCo-land have discussed that company's firearms policy for years on our local gun boards; indeed the deceased equine has been flogged mightily -- it may well be that some of the stores do have some small signage somewhere, but my three local stores don't -- and it's not something the company makes a big deal out of hereabouts, in this, the first shall-issue state ...
 
I do agree with most of your post.

But do note ,please that under FEDERAL LAW retired and active LEO's are allowed to CCW in all 50 states.

That is not exactly what it says on any CCW permit ,or on any state laws.

I do agree that IF you could demonstrate your abilitys, that you should be allowed to CCW in all 50 states.

But there are no current laws to cover that ----- yet :banghead:.

And yes,I do carry at all times.

And yes, that LAW says NOTHING about "shall not carry".

I am going by the letter and INTENT of the law.


So, you agree that I have to QUALIFY for a right I already have?

I'm sorry, but I don't agree with that.

I'm glad that you are afforded that opportunity. I can't say that if such an opportunity came about for me that I wouldn't take it. But I STILL don't agree with it.

What you're describing isn't a RIGHT. It's a PRIVILEGE. And it's a privilege handed out to the "deserving" at the behest of the government against which the words "shall not be infringed" were used about this exact thing.

If they extended me that same privilege, then I would be yet another government agent who has privileges over the common citizen. Why are my fellow citizens being denied this? What has the government to fear from its citizens as a whole?

If the government has something to fear, then perhaps the government needs to re-evaluate what it's doing to engender that fear.

And even if I DID have the same privileges that you do, as a retired police officer, then morally speaking, what right would I have to enter a private establishment of an individual or company who has said "we don't want people to bring guns here"? You and I wouldn't be acting in an official capacity of law enforcement or other government entity. We'd have no duty or obligation to leap to the defense of another. We'd just be a couple of private citizens, except that we'd have a privilege that others do not.
 
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