NY State Pistol Permit Holder List Released

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In fact it DOES include police officers. Not all of them but some. I know a few in New York State and they are listed with their addresses.
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Some police officers in New York State choose to have a regular permit in addition to being qualified to carry "on their badge." I believe this simplifies their status when they leave the job or retire: no hassles about certification/qualification, etc. I'm not an expert, but that is how it has been explained to me.

Funny, some of the permit holders have no address, how is this so?
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The listings from the old database apparently don't have any address info. When they are carried over to the new database, it just appears as a string of commas separating where the address would be.

Tennessee Governor Phil Bredesen I believe is on the "old" system. He is from upstate New York. It does not surprise me because he is from a little town and did not leave New York I believe until his thirties....and the licenses up there are 'lifetime'.
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Permits are lifetime if you remain a New York State resident, but you are supposed to surrender your permit if you move out of state. To be fair to the Governor, the database is apparently less than up-to-date.
 
I just opened the As off the new list, works fine for me :cuss:

Didn't some news paper in Memphis do the same thing last year, causing the Tennessee state legislature to consider a bill making the information confidential? I don't know the outcome of the bill. Any Vols. here know what happened?
 
Memphis Commercial Appeal

The Memphis Commercial Appeal pulled that same stunt in creating a handgun carry permit database. The Commercial Appeal still has the database up.

Nothing has happened as far as a change in TN law in making handgun carry permits here confidential. DL's are confidential but handgun carry permits are public record in TN...very strange.
 
I agree that such information is no one's business.

On the other hand a criminal would know that compared to the general public, most everyone on a CCW list has the training, the commitment, the willingness, and the means to defend themselves and their families with lethal force.

If I were a criminal I'd go out of my way not to break into CCW homes.

Tinpig
 
Interesting how the site owner feels good about posting names and addresses of gun owners, but lacks the balls to publicly claim ownership of the site.

Gutless weasel.

...
 
most everyone on a CCW list has the training, the commitment, the willingness, and the means to defend themselves and their families with lethal force.
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Except, not everyone on that list has a CCW. Some of them have pistol permits limited to target shooting or hunting. In fact, some may just have the permit to keep a pistol as a curio. Remember, NYS and NYC require pistol licensing just to own a pistol.
 
Wow gives addresses! this is legal info out for free..... Can you sue? what if crim got you're name and he could just look you up.... What if you knew someone and you're a crim and did not like them and found this site and saw he had a gun.. WOW THIS SITE IS BAD NEWS FOR CCW HOLDERS!!!!!!
 
Except, not everyone on that list has a CCW. Some of them have pistol permits limited to target shooting or hunting. In fact, some may just have the permit to keep a pistol as a curio. Remember, NYS and NYC require pistol licensing just to own a pistol.
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That's correct--this is everyone in New York State who legally owns a handgun, including premises-only permits (home and business), restricted permits (hunting/target only), and carry-for-employment permits (security guard). Unrestricted CCW holders are only a part of this picture, which is why the whole premise--"Who's Packing?"--is blatantly false.

My brother used to work for the DMV--all their records were strictly confidential, under both state and federal law:

It shall be unlawful for any person knowingly to obtain or disclose personal information, from a motor vehicle record, for any use not permitted under section 721(b) of this title.

--Driver’s Privacy Protection Act (18 U.S.C. § 2721 et seq.)
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Only government agencies and insurance companies have access to this information for "permitted uses." I would like to see state and/or federal law amended to give the similar protection to pistol permit holders.

Despite the mealy-mouthed disclaimers of the owner of the site, it's quite clear that his/her true purpose is harassment of gun owners. If anyone truly does have a need/right to know this information, let that individual do the legwork and the FOIA paperwork himself or herself, and let that request itself be part of the public record. This kind of anonymous broadcasting of the information is driven by an anti-2A agenda, plain and simple.
 
Except, not everyone on that list has a CCW. Some of them have pistol permits limited to target shooting or hunting. In fact, some may just have the permit to keep a pistol as a curio. Remember, NYS and NYC require pistol licensing just to own a pistol.
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Good point.

Tinpig
 
Same happened in VA

....but the culprit was some local activist, anti-gun newspaper. Community brought social and commercial pressure to get list unposted, but I understand it surfaced again recently.

Unfortunately for battered spouses, civil servants and others, such exposure now puts them in harm's way.
 
Well, I'd say look at the lis for lawyers. Let them know about it, see if you can get one that wants to make this guys day suck.

If anyone on the list falls victim to any damaging criminal act, just start up a lawsuit for damages and claim this guy is an accessory and name him on the suit. Should get you a warrant, and that should be enough to get his domain registrar to give up on anonymity.

Then you really start messing with them.
 
Wouldn't need a warrant.

If you sue, your attorney, or yourself if you go "pro se", can issue a subpoena to get that information as to who is behind the site.
 
The person who created the site recently boldfaced the part about this being public accessible information, by law.
He/She also just added an anonymous email address for contacting, but rather smugly declares, "you can write, but don't expect a response."
I still wrote to them anyway - why not?
 
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I use 1 and 1 to host a high-school reunion site and here is a part of the Terms & Conditions. Dunno if this will help any of the legal eagles here, but here goes:

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7.9.

You agree that in the event that 1&1 is informed by any party that your domain name or any material on Your Web Site infringes the copyright of any party, or violates the right of publicity or privacy of any party, or consists of any other claim or violation of intellectual property rights of any kind, then 1&1 may, without prior notice to you and in 1&1's sole and exclusive discretion, either remove the material from Your Web Site, and/or disable public access to your domain name or the material on Your Web Site, and/or terminate this Agreement, without any liability of any kind to 1&1 from either you or any third party. As more completely set forth in Sections 5, 6 and 9, you waive any and all claims you may have, now and forever, against 1&1 relating to any action taken in response to the claim that you have infringed the intellectual property rights of a third party, and agree to indemnify and hold harmless 1&1 from and against any such claims.
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Memphis Commercial Appeal newspaper did this to Tennessee carry permit holders awhile back. I put in my name and got back that I had a permit, but enough pro-gun people had put up a stink that they were not posting full addresses.

But the anti-gunners feel that this is vital information that should be free to the public.

The two SOBs my sister put in jail (held one at gun point for arrest) are going to get out of jail eventually: what a great boon to them if they wanted to find (a) if she has a permit and (b) what her new address is. Hopefully we can keep our street addresses off the lists.
 
Newspaper Article on the website

http://thedailystar.com/localnews/x371478747/Pistol-permit-website-sparks-debate

Pistol permit website sparks debate

By Denise Richardson Staff Writer

A website listing pistol permit owners in New York state has sparked a debate about constitutional rights, public information and privacy.

Any New Yorker interested in knowing if a neighbor has a pistol permit may check online at www.whospackingny.com, a recently anonymously launched website.

The New York State Rifle and Pistol Association is working to shut down the website because of concerns that pistol owners will be targeted by criminals who will steal the firearms. The 70,000-member association had its annual meeting this weekend and pledged in a media release Monday to protect licensee's Second Amendment rights to bear arms "without the danger of their names and addresses being placed in the public domain."

But the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence supports the right to publish information that is public record, Peter Hamm, spokesman, said Tuesday.

The list is from records held by state police, who said the information likely was obtained through a request filed under the Freedom of Information Act. State penal law, which covers firearms licenses, states "the name and address of any person to whom an application for any license has been granted shall be a public record."

Anyone who wants to know who has a pistol permit can go to a county clerk's office and request the information, said Joseph Strnad of Oneonta, who opposes the broad publication on a website.

"This is an open invitation for Mr. Crime to come visit," said Strnad, a handgun instructor certified by the National Rifle Association. "It's nobody's business whether I have a pistol permit."

Pistol permit data, like medical information and Social Security numbers, should be protected, said Strnad, who this weekend taught gun safety and secure storage to about 18 women in an NRA Women on Target course.

Lt. Dennis Nayor of the Oneonta Police Department also said the accessibility of website information was a concern.

"There are people who could use it in an illegal way," Nayor said. A person with a pistol and no permit could be charged with fourth-degree criminal possession of a weapon, a misdemeanor, he said.

Hamm said when a state deems the information public, the right exists to publish the information. A citizen has a right to know if his child has a playdate in the home of a pistol owner, among other situations, he said.

"It certainly should be everyone's right to know those individuals are armed," Hamm said. "It's a First Amendment issue."

New York is among about one-third of states nationwide that allow disclosure of pistol permit data, said Lindsay Nichols, staff attorney with the San Francisco-based Legal Community Against Violence, which advocates to end gun violence. In Florida and Texas, researchers have used such information to identify felons who acquired weapons permits despite prohibitions, she said, but the gun lobby has worked hard to reduce accessibility.

"If this information isn't public, researchers can't do this type of work," she said. "This is really kind of tragic."

The Brady Campaign to End Gun Violence reports that in one year, on average, more than 100,000 people in America are shot or killed with a gun.

Otsego County Sheriff Richard Devlin said copies of approved applications are sent to the county clerk's office and to state police for record keeping. Callers have contacted the department in the past few days to ask if the website is legitimate.

"The bottom line is, it's public information," Devlin said Tuesday.

In New York, the Pistol Permit Bureau, established in 1936, has records of every legal handgun transaction in the state, according to state police website. Current ownership and the legality of a person's possession of the weapon can be determined, the site said, and at the end of 2006, information on 1,200,980 firearms was on file.

A disclaimer on www.whospackingny.com said the records were provided as disclosed by the state and no representations were made regarding accuracy. Permits are issued, revoked and amended daily, the site said, and records presented "were extracted on or about April 5." An "old" list has about 900,000 names, and a "new" list has about 300,000 names.

A pistol owner in Otsego County and a local gun shop owner refused to comment Tuesday.

Lt. Glenn Miner, director of public information for the state police, said multiple requests have been made in recent years for the database of pistol permit holders, and troopers have no choice but to release the information.

"We have to follow the law," he said. "I don't know who is behind this particular website."

Tom King, president of the NYSRPA, said the server company for www.whospackingny.com has told the association that it doesn't know who launched the website.

A request for comment through an e-mail to an address on www.whospackingny.com wasn't answered by 7:30 p.m. Tuesday. The site suggests that visitors with objections to state law contact their legislators, and errors should be brought to the attention of law enforcement officers.

New York state Sen. James Seward, R-Milford, is the main sponsor of a bill that would prohibit disclosure of pistol permit application data, except to police and prosecutors, spokesman Jeff Bishop said. "It protects lawful gun owners from being targeted by thieves."

Seward has introduced the bill in multiple years, Bishop said, and the legislation and a like Assembly bill are in committees in the respective houses.

Hamm said criminals are more likely to pick a target who isn't armed. Pro-gun groups "always have some reason the laws shouldn't apply to them," he said, and gun owners who want criminals to know they refuse to be victims cannot say they might become a victim because they have a weapon, he said.

"They can't have it both ways," Hamm said. "It's hypocritical."
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