odd day with a LEO

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BlazingAngel01

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well my grandmother wanted to take me out to do some gun shopping to support my interest and a cool Christmas present. well we just moved to a different city but just right a cross the road but we went there to get a purchase permit and we get there and i walk in and ask the desk officer where is the office to get permits at and he just says "handgun huh" i was shocked and he said "yes sir' well he hands me a slip of paper with a few numbers and some officers names he said to call the number and make a appointment. so i didn't understand and asked him why do i need a appointment. he got a little hostile and he said "just call the number" well by now I'm a little mad, but i keep my cool. well i got back into the car. well i call the number and i get the officer in charge of weapons . well i walk in and said i called and he said to sit in the lobby and he would be out in a few. the desk officer wanted to see my I.D. i gave it to him and he made a remark on my age and asked "why do i need a hand gun" i told him i target shoot and for home defense. well after that i walked in to the office and talked to the weapons officer he was very nice and respectful. we talked about different guns and good places to shoot. well i took the test and after that he pulled a form out and it was about 30 questions long. when i was doing the form the desk officer walked in and handed me my I.D. card and said "i don't like this" and left well i got done with the city forms and got the permit, payed the tax and said good bye.

i have a few questions.

1.even if im 18 can a LEO make those types of comments?

2.can you city make a form about personal information?

3.can you charge a tax on permits?

4.i was well dressed, cleaned up, and very respectful did i do anything wrong ?

5. has any one had a problem like this?


i did get a hand gun a Walther PPK/S the gun looks good. writing is a little warn and the spring was replaced and really tight but i like it when i get my camera back ill put up some pics.

i also go a m1 grand i love it.
 
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if you were charged for a purchase permit in Michigan, you were robbed. call the State Police. also, the test should have been a single half sheet of paper with 15 questions that are quite easy.

and I think you mean M1 Garand...who made yours?
 
1.even if im 18 can a LEO make those types of comments? I don't think there are laws about what comments people are allowed to make. It's just talking. Yeah he was an ass, but this is America. There is no right not to be offended.

2.can you city make a form about personal information? What form of personal questions?

3.can you charge a tax on permits?
No. But they can charge you to get the purchase permit notarized, which you need to buy a handgun.

4.i was well dressed, cleaned up, and very respectful did i do anything wrong? I don't know, I wasn't there. From what you told us, no you didn't.

5. has any one had a problem like this? I personally haven't. Maybe you just got stuck dealing with a jerk at the desk. None of my contacts with police and firearms have ever been anything less than courteous, including getting pulled over twice by Ann Arbor city police. They didn't care one bit that I had a CPL or a weapon on me.


And forgive me if I am being rude, but a little spell checking and punctuation would be more beneficial to you. I really do mean that as a friendly suggestion. When filling out purchase permits, job applications, college entrance essays, etc; capitalizing I when referring to yourself and using punctuation generally gives other people a better impression of you. I'm not usually part of the "grammar police" on forums, but when the thread is asking about why authorities didn't take you seriously, I think it's apt.

Again, I really don't mean to come off as rude or confrontational. I have personally found giving more attention to spelling and speaking well tends to make others give me better consideration.
 
You need a permit to buy guns in MI? And you have to go to the police station to get it? Wow.
 
and I think you mean M1 Garand...who made yours?
Click to expand...

Springfield Armory

a single half sheet of paper with 15 questions that are quite easy.
Click to expand...

i didn't have this in my old town so i didn't understand:scrutiny:

Sorry about my grammar i just used informal internet conversation :banghead:
 
Not Purchase

He didn't say he purchased a handgun.

It seems he was given a pistol.

In order to have a pistol in some places you have to have a chunk of parchment that allows you to exercise a right.

My son had a 9mm pistol for about a year before he turned 21. I gave it to him for Xmas.

So, tell us about the Springfield.

Shoot it much?

Is it well behaved?

Oh, and Angel? Dude? We are always pleased to have younger guys show up on The High Road. It will make it a whole lot better for those of us who read your stuff, and it will help a lot in being taken seriously, if you'll take a little extra time and use just a little more formality in your writing.

We all understand that "casual internet" speak has much looser rules, but The High Road has some pretty serious players, and the better you present yourself, the more respect you'll earn.

I mean, you can compose and write pretty much however you like, but if you want people to read it and talk to you, the cleaner it is, the better that will go.
​
 
Interpolate

I'm going to interpolate just a little here and imagine that she had to get the purchase permit, and he has to have a permit to possess the thing.

I don't know the rules where he is, so this would be called "guessing."

Anyone from Michigan wanna chime in here?
 
well my grandmother wanted to take me out to do some gun shopping to support my interest and a cool Christmas present.
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Doesn't sound like he was given a gun for Christmas by his grandmother, unless it was a straw purchase by her and given to him. Sounds to me like he is saying that he tried to, and successfully did, obtain a purchase permit to buy a handgun in his name that his grandmother was funding. Not a textbook straw purchase, but could appear to be one.

"Well", I call BS on an 18yo obtaining a handgun purchase permit legally in MI.

If the grandmother was the one getting the purchase permit, which you interpolated, Mr. Greebly... then it's a blatant straw purchase. Too, why would they want his ID and have him fill out a questionnaire if he's not the one getting the permit?

Edited to add: Now that I think about it, perhaps the reason the desk clerk said "I don't like this" is because he/she had figured out that the grandmother/grandson were indeed attempting to make a straw purchase by her getting the permit and funding the purchase for "his" handgun. If so, I would keep an eye out for a visit from the BATFE. :scrutiny:
 
Yeah, but since the grandmother was the one paying, and it was her money all along, it's not a straw purchase. Gifting is not the same as a straw purchase, and is expressly allowed on the 4473. I know - I read it on teh intarweb, so it must be true!

I think we do need more details, since it seems he wasn't going to be the one purchasing, but must need a permit to possess......

My head's gonna asplode.
 
Yeah, but since the grandmother was the one paying, and it was her money all along, it's not a straw purchase. Gifting is not the same as a straw purchase, and is expressly allowed on the 4473.
Click to expand...

Yep. I work in a gun shop. If Smith is giving Jones a gun, we ring up the sale under Smith's name, but have Jones fill out the 4473. If Mary Doe is giving a gun to her husband Joe Doe, we still have Joe fill out the 4473.
 
from what i understand in michigan, somebody 18 and over but under 21 can purchase a handgun from a private party but not an FFL.
 
In Michigan, any transfer of a handgun requires a perchase permit from the police or sheriff department, depending on where you live. This includes a purchase from a licensed dealer (in addition to the #4473 form), a purchase at a gun show (so much for that loophole) or from an individual -gift or sale.

This is part of the reason I am no longer a Michigan resident. If BlazingAngel01 and his grandmother lived in Arizona none of this story would have happened. I like to visit Michigan, but I would never live there again.
 
desk officer walked in and handed me my I.D. card and said "i don't like this"
Click to expand...

I don't think that officer had any business making this comment. He is a paid public servant and should keep his mouth shut about people exercising their rights in a lawful manner ((while he is on the clock))... That's my opinion..

Off the clock and out of uniform he should be free to say what he wants of course as Joe Citizen...
 
What the situation sounds like is Grandmother buys from FFL then transfers to under 21, how is this done, in MI anyone over 18 can get a pistol but federal law bars anyone under 21 from buying from an FFL, here in MI in order to purchase you need to get a license to purchase (or use a CCW with a date past 2005) and then bring it in to get a safety check, only issue here is whether it would condone as a "straw purchase". Back to MI yes it is stupid laws at work and they don't work either, case in point a few weeks ago they got a crook he had forged a CCW and purchased a gun the cops caught him WHEN HE BROUGHT THE GUN IN FOR A SAFTEY CHECK:rolleyes: Oh well.......
Hope this made some more sense.
 
From what my 18 year old son and his friends tell me, LEO's have a habit of treating young people like crap just because they can.
 
Michigan is not that bad.You need a purchase permit to buy a pistol.They are free at your local police dept or sheriffs office.All you need to show is a drivers license or state ID.The permit to purchase is good for 10 days and you can purchase from a FFL or private seller (with a valid safety inspection card for that pistol.(aka green card).You have 10 days to submit the pistol to the local pd for a "safety inspection" which is code for registration, which is illegal.A valid CPL in MI eliminates the need to obtain a purchase permit, but not the safety inspection.Michigan has in the past had some local prosecutors and gun boards issue their own interpretation of law resulting in virtually no regular citizens getting CPL permits. This has changed with Michigan now being a shall issue state with "castle doctrine" legislation. Michigan is tight on the requirements for CPL, but I agree with them. We are also working to eliminate some of the "no gun zones" written into the current laws.All in all, Michigan is a success story for CPL.
 
asknight-"Well", I call BS on an 18yo obtaining a handgun purchase permit legally in MI.

Not to be rude, but maybe you should do some reasearch before making assumptions. It IS in fact legal for an 18 - Year old to own a hand gun in the state of michigan. However, a person under 21 may only purchase a handgun from a private seller. Federal law stipulates that FFL dealers may only sell a handgun to someone over 21 years of age. Basically, federal law says 21, but michigan law says 18, so as long as you are not an FFL holder you may sell a handgun to someone 18 or older. I do not know about purchase from another state and transfering through an FFL though. You are not purchasing the firearm from the FFL, but they are helping you to get it into your hands, so I don't know what the law stipulates there. BTW, I am 18 years old and will be purchasing my second handgun on saturday.:)
 
"Puchase permit"? What the heck is that? Born and raised Arizonan, walk in, pay money, do brady check, (15 minutes max), grab ammo, holster, outthe door in 30 minutes, no muss no fuss. Move here, warmer summers and winters, lots less hassle firearms wise.
 
It truly isn't one country. "purchase permits","safety checks"??? I have bought,sold,traded,you name it with guns most of my life,even had an FFL in the '70s(I'm 54y/o) and until I joined THR,I never dreamed such infringements on liberty existed!
 
crankshop1000:

In Arizona:

No purchase permits or gun registration (a.k.a. "safety inspection"), and no need to make at least 2 trips to a police or sheriff department to make a purchase.

No restrictions on semi-automatic/military style rifles. You can own full-automatic firearms if you follow the Federal requirements.

CCW licences are easy and inexpensive to get, and available to both residents and non-residents.

No background checks on CCW holders when purchasing from a FFL.

No restrictions on face-to-face transfers between Arizona residents.

At 18 years of age, an individual can not only purchase a handgun (or any other firearm) from an non-FFL, but also legally open carry the handgun (but not concealed).

While it has nothing to do with guns, Michigan is goverened by a bunch of bliss-nannies that intrude into one's life any way they can, and when the economy is in the dumps and still going down they raise taxes. :eek:

Not so bad??? You can have it. :banghead: :banghead:
 
No offense to THR members from there but most of the stupid laws in MI are a result of Detroit, the most dangerous city in America, BTW Flint in 3rd.The CCW laws are being fixed nicely, but Cox needs to fix all of Kelly's mistakes eg, NFA restrictions, CCW age, and the ridiculous "you can only have a auto-knife if you have one arm" law.
 
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