Protection from Mountain Lions? Don't Even Mention "Gun"

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What a piddy puddy tat!

The shootist observed:

Which means you could almost start to think of them like coyotes - hunters/scavengers that are adapting to the urban landscape where man is found.

Which FURTHER means that Ca's problem is no longer just something that happens to unarmed hikers "out there" - anybody hiking in a state with somewhat decent cover could be at risk (MI, other parts of the midwest, Va, Penn etc and certainly Ga SC FL La and other parts of the South).

Well, even though I rarely get to go in the mountains anymore, that's the reason I've been interested in mountain lion (and other roaming predator) threads.

They are coming closer and closer to human habitation, and in fact have been spotted a couple of times nearby. (Including near a school up the street.)

They say you're more likely to get hit by lightning.

OK.

But I'm thinking I might want to paint eyeballs on the back of my tinfoil hat.
 
I'm not familiar with the habits of our feline friends but it seems to me that a small child might satisfy one during an attack and divert its attention.
 
"I suspect you have pretty close to the same chance of being abducted by aliens as being attacked by a mountain lion." Yup, or winning the lottery. I always thought tinfoil hats would protect from alien abduction (post #10 beat me to mention of that method of protection) but remember that tinfoil hats have to be grounded to work. In the DPRK it's probably illegal to resist when attacked by a predator that's protected by law.
 
While I tend to agree that a firearm probably wouldn't help if the cat were actually stalking you, that does not mean that going unarmed is a good defense. The gun is a tool that might be useful, if it can be deployed in time.

Of course, most people who've survived cat attacks stated that they never saw it coming and they were at the mercy of the animal in the blink of an eye. Heck, we all know how quick even house cats are and how strong they can be relative to their small size. Just imagine one 10-15 times as big:eek:.

I carry in the woods for a number of reasons, but I've come to grips with the fact that in the unlikely event of a cat attack, survival will probably depend fighting like hell with my own hands, feet and pathetic human teeth.
 
Notice that the questioner is in CA, so the Outside Magazine writer answered him properly.
 
A solution to the cougar attack problem to satisfy both the pistol and knife crowd that would make gecko45 proud http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/21621-46660-1292.html

double up on the trauma plates, fix bayonets, and slip a couple extra mag pouches on that molle vest, and you should be fine.

As far as effective defense aggainst alien abduction, you need a flashlight, bag of reeses peices, tinfoil head gear (obvious), and a linga yoni crystal.


MD does not allow common citizens the priveledge of effective self protection, and more and more cougars and black bear are following the deer to populated areas and trails. This is why I do my hiking in the great state of VA, same scenery, better laws, and as long as you stay mindful of the Concealed carry and open carry areas (often one is allowed, the other is not) you are fine
 
My reply:

You recently answered a question regarding mountain lion protection for a subscriber in California. You advised:

"Throw dirt in its face. Find a rock or stick and hit it."

Here in Colorado, we tend to carry .357 caliber "rocks" to "throw" at mountain lions and 2-legged predators. They tend to work much better.

People in California aren't allowed to carry Colorado-style "rocks". Would your answer have been different if the subscriber lived in a state where they were allowed to carry effective "rocks" while hiking?
 
I live and hike in the Angeles National Forrest area and I have called the DFG & Rangers and asked if I can open carry and they said yes. I then asked is it OK to defend myself against Cougar, mountain lion etc...they said yes.

I will continue to legally open carry a loaded handgun in the Angeles National forrest when hiking and if ever I have to protect myself I will and then I'll call DFG & Ranger ASAP.

As long as you're not hunthing them it's OK.
 
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When walking in the woods I've decided to carry a Phalanx CIWS on the rear webbing of my pack. The radar unit mounts nicely on my tin foil hat. For forward protection I'll still rely on my stereoscopic visible spectrum Foward Looking Early Warning Receptors and a hand weapon that consists of at least one man-made metal part.

I'm starting to think Gear Guy should be considered for a Darwin Award. Heaven forbid humans should interfere with the hunger pangs of a mountain lion. Better instead to have your tombstone read that you minimized your carbon footprint and didn't upset nature's applecart by protecting yourself, all in one unselfish incident.
 
While by no means an expert on the subject, I have stayed in a few motels in my lifetime.

As far as carrying a blade is concerned, it's better than nothing, I'll admit. But if I'm worried about cougar, I would prefer something along the lines of a 1911, loaded with the hollowpoint du jour--maybe a 230 grain HydraShok.

As far as being in the same ballpark as being struck by lightning--with all the recent sightings of cougar and bear in urban areas, you'd better start carrying a ground strap and a lightning rod.
 
Since the "Gear Guy" doesn't recommend any specific gear for protection against cats, why is he authoring the article? It annoys me when these clowns give advice on topics they know nothing about.
 
And, if attacked, fight back. Don’t curl into a ball. Throw dirt in its face. Find a <.357 revolver, point directly at cat and empty cylinder>. If you are with someone fighting off a lion, do the same.

There, I fixed the author's statement. I think he meant something like this, but was momentarily confused.
 
When I worked on the family's ranch as a teen, I never really worried about mountain lions (cougars). I knew they were around and would sometimes take one of our calfs, but I rarely saw one. I worried more about wild dogs and coydogs. They were more aggressive and when riding fence alone were more on my mind.
 
What a tool:

Mountain lions prefer deer. Lacking that, pets and livestock become targets. A little bit further down the menu, humans.

No, not really. Mountain lions, like all predatory animals, prefer prey that is easy to catch, first and foremost (per my understanding). Usually, that's older and younger deer (simply on the criteria of availability and shared habitat), but that in no way precludes humans. Humans are amazingly easy prey when they're unarmed, because we're more than likely unsuspecting due to our modern city-dwelling tunnel-vision, inattentiveness, and lack of ability to smell well.

alucard0822 - Only problem with your recommendation is that, as far as I know, cougars will got for their prey's throat and/or neck. If they don't break it, they want their prey to bleed out quickly. Cats are not like a bear, which will maul you. Cougars are efficient killers, because that's the sole source of their food: meat.

Best thing to do to "prevent" a cat attack is to travel the woods in a pack - ie, with other people - and for more than one of those people to be armed. Watch each others' backs. We humans evolved as pack animals, and our survival skills and abilities are reflective of that.

Failing that, I wonder if there's some sort of natural repellent which can be used to deter cat attacks - something like skunk spray, maybe? Burger King? Something that says "stay away, this prey will taste like crap". Would that work?
 
I've run into mountain lions a couple times while out in the woods, never shot at one though. Do I carry a gun when in the woods? Yep. Do I carry a knife? Yep. Which would be more useful in a mountain lion attack? Not sure, depends on the situation. The best defense against a mountain lion attack is to be aware of your surroundings. Every time that I've seen a cat, it took off running as soon as it noticed me. In chance encounters, big cats will almost never attack unless there is no other option.

Mountain lions are ambush predators, they like quick and easy kills. I you are attacked by a mountain lion, it will most likely be from above or behind (making a gun of little use). Of course the good news is that mountain lions are not grizzlies, and being attacked by one is survivable if you keep your head and fight back (edit: this is assuming the initial attack is not fatal). Think of a mountain lion as a 170lb man with sharp teeth and claws, dangerous to be sure, but his heart's not in the fight. The mountain lion wanted you to go down in the first attack like a good little dinner, you didn't and now he's frustrated. You decided to fight back and that frustrates him even more. Stab him in the ribs with a knife, bash him over the head with a rock and he'll think "forget this, I'm going to Jackrabbit-in-the-box."

In conclusion: Everyone should carry a weapon when out in the woods, just because we have i-pods and SUVs, doesn't mean that nature has gotten any less dangerous than it was 10,000 years ago. Is a gun useful against mountain lions? Possibly, but every time that I've seen one, the cat was heading the other way before I'd even cleared the holster. And finally, the more that you make a cat think that he is going to have to work to eat you, the more likely he will head off to find easier meat.
 
Failing that, I wonder if there's some sort of natural repellent which can be used to deter cat attacks - something like skunk spray, maybe? Burger King? Something that says "stay away, this prey will taste like crap". Would that work?

Heineken, maybe?
 
gunsmith for killing a cat that jumped you, unprepared from behind.
Thats why, along with a .357 revolver , I carry a couple pretty good blades
when in lion country.
I think that the boom of a gun would also scare it off you.
afaik the cat would attack from behind and it would sneak up on you, I'm sure it would use its claws and paws to control your hands/arms too.
A pretty fearsome opponent.

I don't think that's quite right. I've no idea how a cat would try to control your arms or legs.


Caimlas as far as I know, cougars will got for their prey's throat and/or neck. If they don't break it, they want their prey to bleed out quickly. Cats are not like a bear, which will maul you. Cougars are efficient killers, because that's the sole source of their food: meat.


Cats have various attack styles. If they attack something like an antelope and through chance end up on its front side, they use front paws not to scratch the prey but to stick into it like velcro. Teeth lock onto the neck, and the back paws are kicked repeatedly to disembowel the prey. Otherwise their attacks seem to consist of biting the neck, with the paws simply maintaining their stance on the prey. And let's face it, there's not many people who could defend themselves well with even 100lbs suddenly strapped to them, it would be overwhelming. Some cats chew on the neck, and their teeth then saw through the spinal column. I don't think they need to wait for anything to bleed out, if they grip the neck in their jaws they simply clamp down and the prey can't breath, so it's unconscious before bleeding becomes a problem (lack of blood to the brain, and air to the lungs simultaneously).


The notion of stabbing an attacking cat may be romantic, but seriously how many people suggesting this have ever stabbed something with their knife before? And cat's are harder than most any prey, a guy I knew who petted a leopard said what amazed him was that the cat looked soft, but it was literally hard as a rock. Now try to stab an animal that is extremely tough, and do it from the disadvantage of bad position and having a weight strapped to you. It's a recipe for failure.

A pistol, on the other hand, everyone here has experience shooting with. A whole hell of a lot more than they do practicing with their knives! As long as you can pull the trigger and point the muzzle you are fine. I honestly can't see any possible way a knife could be superior to a pistol when defending against a cat.

I've actually read a story exactly about a man hiking in North America who was jumped by a cougar, and he had time while it was going on to retrieve his swiss army knife and stab the cat with it. Unfortunately the stab wounds did nothing to discourage the cat, and he was so amped that he didn't even notice when the blade (non-locking folder) folded onto his hand and he was actually simply cutting his fingers slowly off.

So the rule to remember is to put something between your neck and the cat, and possibly between your gut and the cat. Your face and scalp will get ****ed up quickly, but the longer you keep it away from your neck the better.


And P.S. I find it a ridiculous notion that a cat will scamper off and find easier prey, in the middle of an attack, because you inconvenienced it and the meal is going harder than normal. It has a ****ing predator drive, it probably feels as little pain as possible, and it's NOT going to stop trying to eat you because you make it's meal take 30 seconds longer than normal. You are going to have to do MASSIVE trauma to this animal to get it off you. It made it's decision to attack you, THAT'S when it decided if you were too hard or too difficult or too dangerous to attack. And obviously it decided you weren't, because it attacked you. Their instincts to keep them alive obviously choose the easiest meals, because being injured is a big deal and they don't want that. But once the fight starts, it's idiotic to think the cat will get bored if you struggle too long, it won't stop trying to kill you unless you do MASSIVE trauma to it. If you somewhat injured it it HAS to keep attacking, because it will need the food while it recuperates and is unable to hunt for that period of time.
 
"I suspect you have pretty close to the same chance of being abducted by aliens as being attacked by a mountain lion."

actually its quite common in the southwest for mexicans to kidnap people
 
The hunter's safety courses here actually recommend carrying a sidearm in addition to a rifle when hunting in bear or mountain lion teritory. They also recommend shooting as soon as the cat tries to get behind you. They also recommend NOT trying to play dead if attacked by a bear, but rather shooting several times if need be.

Why do I give more credibility to the hunter's safety instructors than the Outdoors magazine writer?

edit: also shoot the cat if their ears go back.
 
seriously, look at the pic in post 21 and tell me you are going to beat that in a fist fight. and dont forget his fist are lined with 5 sharp claws. you have a stick.

yeah.....

i mean seriously, compare his mouth with your head! screw that, i'm going to go hide under my bed in fear.
 
Well if this idiot's in the wilderness I guess you'll see one other kind of animal out there.

jackass.jpg

Hee Haw!!


I'd actually be much more worried about meeting two legged predators on a hiking trail or out in the middle of nowhere than I would a mountain lion. There are some criminals that prefer out of the way locations such as these simply because they know that any potential help for their victims is a long time coming, if ever

15 or 16 years ago my father in law saved a girl that was left for dead after her husband/boyfriend was murdered while they were camping and after she was robbed, raped, had her throat slashed and was left for dead in a ditch by the side of the road. He was in the passenger seat of a electric company truck as they were building something out in the middle of nowhere and he saw her move as they were going by a ditch.

He and his buddy called for help on their work radio, he put pressure on her throat wound and after a CHP officer arrived they managed to get a Care Flight helicopter out there and it saved her life. It turned out that a bunch of gang-bangers from Los Angeles had gone by their camp site and decided to have some fun with them. They eventually found the car in East LA and they caught several of them and they ended up getting life. With the parole system that they have in California that probably means 7 years.

Presenting a firearm as a solution to the problem would mean that firearms are actually useful. That type of thinking just doesn't occur to these morons. Every action they take has to be from a tree hugging standpoint. A pistol or revolver on the belt and some some awareness of your surroundings would go a long ways towards keeping you safe from scumbags like these and a big hungry animal determined to bite and/or tear the living crap out of you and perhaps turn you into a meal.

I don't see a stick, making yourself seem bigger by raising your arms up and puffing yourself up or throwing dirt at these threats as doing much good. You might be able to run from the bad guys, but try running away from a mountain lion. You'll only die tired. Unless you jump in a lake or a stream, I hear that they don't like water much.
 
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