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Safety or no safety?

Discussion in 'Handguns: General Discussion' started by Phillip Farney, Oct 18, 2020.

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  1. Corpral_Agarn

    Corpral_Agarn Member

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    IMO: SAO guns get safeties.

    Everything else, no safety.

    If the gun or trigger makes you uncomfortable with that, I typically recommend a different gun or trigger type.

    Not telling anyone how to live, just my recommendation.
     
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  2. Corpral_Agarn

    Corpral_Agarn Member

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    I not heard this claim before.

    what makes you think this?
     
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  3. Cannibul

    Cannibul Member

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    It's not a claim, it's a simple fact.

    Show me in period literature, 1911-1960, where it was designed/intended to be carried that way.

    Here's a hint John Moses Browning carried his personal 1911 with the hammer down on a live round. Also the thumb safety wasn't part of the original design.
     
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  4. Corpral_Agarn

    Corpral_Agarn Member

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    typically when someone makes a claim, it's on them to back it up...


    You say the thumb safety wasn't part of the original design... are you sure? What do you consider to be the original design?
    How would you safely operate the pistol?

    Hammer down on a live round was a no-no since the Single Action revolver...
     
  5. Cannibul

    Cannibul Member

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  6. Fine Figure of a Man

    Fine Figure of a Man Member

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    None of my carry guns have manual safeties and there is always a round in the pipe.
     
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  7. Corpral_Agarn

    Corpral_Agarn Member

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    From the first article:
    so... it wasn't designed NOT to be cocked and locked?

    ETA: thanks for links!
     
  8. Cannibul

    Cannibul Member

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    No problem.

    The idea that the 1911 was designed to be carried cocked and locked is one of those things EVERYONE knows, but is not true.
     
  9. mlankton

    mlankton Member

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    CZ made me love the decocker, much prefer that to cocked and locked with my 1911. I'll do either, but a comparatively bad trigger pull vs having to sweep the safety off is a fair trade on a carry gun in my eyes.
     
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  10. Timeless

    Timeless Member

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    Cocked and locked is the only way I prefer...so every gun I own will be that way.
     
  11. Smokepole14

    Smokepole14 Member

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    I personally believe a safety shouldn’t belong on a self-defense handgun. That’s just one more step you’ll have to do in the event if you ever needed to pull your gun. The last thing you need is adrenaline and nerves to kick in and forget to disengage the safety. Get a good kydex holster, IT IS THE SAFETY!! When the gun is in the holster nothing can hit the trigger. Leather I don’t trust, it flexes after years of use. That’s just what I prefer.
     
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  12. Fine Figure of a Man

    Fine Figure of a Man Member

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    I will add that beyond supporting everyone's 2A rights, I don't care if others carry, what they carry or the status of what they are carrying.
     
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  13. George P

    George P Member

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    I own/have owned, Glocks, SIG, Kahr, S&W M&P (both revolvers and semis) - NONE have a safety and that's the way I like it; one less complication to add into a stressful scenario, one less thing to malfunction.
     
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  14. Phillip Farney

    Phillip Farney Member

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    As a big framed guy, waistband holsters are not optimal, I use a belly band which holds the gun in place well but is not hard cased. Would this cause concern?
     
  15. sgt127

    sgt127 Member

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    I’m a huge fan of off switches on guns that are carried cocked.

    That includes the current crop of striker fired guns.
     
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  16. Trunk Monkey

    Trunk Monkey member

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    This isn't entirely true. Cooper may have got the credit but it was a fairly common practice before him.

    I wish I could remember where it was but I made a similar claim about Cooper on another forum and I got multiple photographs of Texas Rangers from the 20s and 30s carrying not only cocked and locked but also with the grip safety disabled.
     
  17. Old Dog

    Old Dog Member

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    Concur. Stephen Hunter did a lot of research on this while writing his fine novel G-Men, and detailed these practices.
     
  18. JTQ

    JTQ Member

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    I would not use a soft bodied holster with a striker fired gun (or single action auto) without a manual safety. If had a gun with a light, short trigger pull, I'd really want a solid, stiff, holster made specifically for my gun.
     
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  19. WheelGunMan

    WheelGunMan Member

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    I carry IWB appendix... because of the potential of clothing intertwining with the trigger whilst holstering, I prefer a safety on a short stroke, light triggered striker fired gun. Once secure in a Kydex holster with the trigger totally covered the safety can be deactivated. On a DA/SA hammer fired gun one can thumb the hammer during the holstering process to prevent any negligent discharge.
     
  20. Trunk Monkey

    Trunk Monkey member

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    That name seems very familiar, does he participate here?
     
  21. MTMilitiaman

    MTMilitiaman Member

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    People with really strong preferences either way annoy me, because I really couldn't care less. On one hand, my ARs and all of my rifles have safeties. All firearms I operate with the exception of my Glock and the occasional revolver have a manual safety, and I am fine with this. I don't understand why it would ever be an issue for a handgun to have a properly designed safety present when almost every other firearm you operate has a safety. On the other hand, people who don't trust a gun without a safety also kind of freak me out. I get nervous around people who actually rely on their safeties. A mechanical safety isn't a proper substitute for trigger discipline and basic gun safety. You should be comfortable enough with the mechanical operation of a firearm and your handling of it to not require a safety to be present. If you can't trust yourself to keep your finger off the trigger, the presence or absence of a safety is the least of your concerns.
    I have ran a Glock without issue for years and never felt unsafe. But there are times I prefer a safety. I don't really like double actions. I like one consistent trigger pull. That is my strong preference. It can be in a polymer striker fire with no safety or a SAO CZ SP-01 with a safety. If there is a safety, it must be frame-mounted, down-swept, and it must be ambi. I will not compromise on this. I would prefer my strikers without safeties to have a trigger pull no lighter than about 5 pounds. I would prefer my SAO guns with safeties to have duty triggers to lighter than 3.5 pounds.
     
  22. jmr40

    jmr40 Member

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    On a pistol carried in a holster I'm fine either way. I have Glocks and am comfortable with them if carried correctly. But it isn't always practical to use a holster that covers the trigger. I'm talking about night stand or glove box carry. For that I prefer a safety.

    And as much as I like Glock I'm moving toward striker fired guns with safeties. Buying the Sig M17 with a safety got me started. I specifically sought out a 365 with a safety and also have a couple of Smith M&P's with safeties. All of those guns NEED a safety IMO. The Sigs come out of the box with a much lighter trigger than a Glock. And my M&P's have Apex trigger kits in them with trigger pulls very similar to a tuned 1911.

    But I'm not ready to sell my Glocks just yet. Depending on how it is used I think either can work. But IMO the 365 is better with a safety.
     
  23. SharpDog

    SharpDog Member

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    Proper jolster and no safety for me. I have 4 p365XLs all no safety. 3 p365's, one with safety.

    Here is a p365:

    [​IMG]
     
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  24. FL-NC

    FL-NC Member

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    If that is the case, me and a whole bunch of other people were doing it wrong for a long time. Not to mention some highly proficient users who still carry them.
     
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  25. SharpDog

    SharpDog Member

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    IMHO it might if the trigger were to be hit in the wrong way (for instance on the corner of a kitchen counter). I just got the new belly band from Alien Gear and it has a hard Kydex holster. It is well made and comfortable. The optional accessories (mag pouch and cell phone pouch) are handy but not as well made.

    belly-band-iwb-holster-in-use.jpg

    https://aliengearholsters.com/belly-band-holster.html
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
    George P likes this.
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