The F.B.I. Knocked on my door yesterday

[del4]

Federal agents have holograms on their ID's to make them hard to counterfeit.

It's pretty hard to believe that a bunch of clean cut guys in nice suits, driving suburbans and crown vic's are wandering around my city looking to roll Joe Schmo just to get his collection of Mosin Nagants and SKS's. It COULD happen but...

 

[Molon Labe]

Molon Labe - you really need to relax....

Rouge Cops - how many have you encountered in your lifetime???

Over half my encounters with LEOs have been negative, meaning they were dishonest and/or abusing their authority. Since this is the "High Road," and engaging in (so-called) "cop-bashing" is the surest way to get a thread locked, I won't elaborate.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

ere is a question. If six guys are at your front door saying they are the FBI, and you have no idea what an FBI badge looks like. Would you answer the door with a gun on you?

Of course. Why would I not?

------------------------------

Federal agents have holograms on their ID's to make them hard to counterfeit.

Like you mean the holograms on counterfeit credit cards that are hard to counterfeit . What hologram is there? What is it supposed to do? How do I know it is the right one? How does it differ from the US Marshalls, Homeland Security, etc.?

Badges and ID cards mean very little to me. They are supposed to be proof of who the person is and who he works for, only if you don't know what the real ID looks like, then you don't know if he is who he says or not.

By comparison, we had guys acting like they were with the power company. The wore the shirts with the company name and had the company ID badges in the plastic sleeves around their necks, only the badges were faked. Consumers had been told that said employees would have the badges and what the looked like and so the robbers made badges that met the description.

 

[nfl1990]

Rouge Cops - how many have you encountered in your lifetime???

It only takes one.

 

[jeff-10]

Kermit911, ignore most of the grandstanding about opening the door with a gun in your, refusing them etc. You reacted correctly to the situation, you got the special agents to leave as soon as possible with the least amount of your time being wasted. Any other response could have cost you your life, or thousands of dollars in legal bills and possible jail time. Unless you happen to be Jason Bourne, six guys don't need you to answer your door to do evil things to you.

 

[FPrice]

You're a bad man Rick Reno.

I heard somewhere that Rick is 1-1-1 using that tactic.

 

[Johnny_Yuma]

Thanks, ChickenHawk!

I don't know, guys.

The FBI and LEOs are Public Servants trying to their jobs the best they can.

Those of you who won't even talk to them without an appointment make that pretty impossible. If they were searching for the BG who has your kid would you want people to open their doors and answer questions?

I really appreciate dealing with helpful members of the public.

Some people want to play games and insist on appointments, etc. We have our games, too. My favorite is called "Grand Jury Subpoena" and the hardcases always hate getting them. They get to miss a day of work, drive 30 miles in the middle of the day to the federal courthouse, leave their handgun in the car, go through magnetometer, and appear before the grand jury - all to answer a few easy questions they could have answered on their front porch . It doesn't matter to me - I get paid the same.

I wonder how many of you "Make an Appointment" guys are the same ones that complain that we don't do our job efficiently enough?

JY

 

[Sean85746]

ALWAYS

I ALWAYS answer the door with a gun ON me.

If, after looking though the peep-hole, I don't recognize them...I have the gun IN my hand, hidden behind the door.

I am not concerned about someone rushing my door...there is an iron security gate locked at the entrance to my porch, which must be opened to even gain access to the entry door, which is also covered with an iron security gate.

But, yep...if you are strange to my home...I have a gun in hand.

I know how bad a home invasion can be. I was a deputy sheriff for 2 years, then went fed for another 10 years. In this day and age being "paranoid enough" is just about right.

 

[Aguila Blanca]

Here is a question. If six guys are at your front door saying they are the FBI, and you have no idea what an FBI badge looks like. Would you answer the door with a gun on you?

Probably.

But only after asking him to pass his ID card through the window so I can have a close look at it.

 

[atomchaser]

I think you handled it well. I don't think a bunch of thugs are going to go to all that trouble to look like "G-men" unless you really have something big-time to steal. I'm sure they are just trying to run down some scumbag. Better for you if they find the guy and put him away so he doesn't come back around his old 'crib'. If I were you, after such an experience, I think I would be extra careful about security since the previous occupant may be coming back around for some reason.

 

[McCall911]

Here is a question. If six guys are at your front door saying they are the FBI, and you have no idea what an FBI badge looks like. Would you answer the door with a gun on you?

Close to the top of the list of Really, Really Bad Ideas IMO.

Unless you're just really curious as to what FBI agents actually do carry and, possibly, whether their ammunition is effective or not.

But if you must, nothing wrong with having one close/within reach (since the "real deal" won't come into your house without an invitation.) But possibly a telephone in hand would be the better idea of what to have on you/in your hand when you open the door.

 

[Zundfolge]

ME: "I want your name, badge number, and your supervisors name. I'm going to call and verify you are who you say you are. And I'll look forward to getting that letter or phone call if this is indeed a legitimate inquiry. Good night."

Don't ask for a badge number.

According to a couple of officers I've known over the years, often the badge number is just that, the number of the badge, not necessarily the number of the officer (and some departments recycle and reuse badge numbers ... some even have multiple badges with the same number at the same time). Ask for his name and his service number.


At any rate, I always do everything with a gun on my so I'll answer the door with a gun on me ... not necessarily in hand, but on me.

Any honest cop who is really just "doing his job" and is not a JBT or a thug in a cop costume will have no problem waiting for you to call 911 and verify who he is. If you're worried about what he thinks than simply tell him "you can't be too careful ... there's loonies out there pretending to be Gmen all the time).

Living in Colorado I can get away with this easier as there was a guy who was impersonating a police officer, pulling women over and raping them a couple of years back (consequentially the law here in CO now makes impersonating a police officer a felony).

 

[FPrice]

I may be mistaken but I think that there are two separate issues here. The first is the issue of people of questionable identify showing up at your door late at night asking to speak to you or come in while the second involves only the topic of talking to LEOs.

I have had our local PD come to my house at night and invariably (when in a marked car) they turn on their overhead lights and it is pretty apparent who they are. Once I had a detective show up in an unmarked car but I knew her by sight so there was no problem with identification. So I would be a bit concerned if a group of people without uniforms showed up and wanted to come in. I would be reserved but polite and would verify their identity before letting them in. But once I did, I would cooperate with them.

As far as talking to LEOs, I would not insist on them making an "appointment". After all, when I call for their assistance, they don't make me make an appointment. Call it, "professional courtesy".

My local (small) PD is pretty good. About half the officers know me by sight and more than a few of them hang out at our local gun shop and shoot the breeze. The last chief got rid of the one problem officer. He was the kind who routinely wrote people up for "36 in a 35 mph zone".

So cooperation is not a problem for me.

 

[Aguila Blanca]

Rouge Cops - how many have you encountered in your lifetime???

How many World Trade Centers were destroyed by terrorists with hijacked airliners before 9/11?

I don't want my first encounter with a rogue (not "rouge") cop to be the lest encounter I'll ever have.

 

[Standing Wolf]

I don't ever answer the door without a gun in my pocket and my hand on the gun butt. It's one of the reasons my neighborhood is lower in crime than most.

 

[Heywood Case]

FBI came to my place of business about 10 yrs ago. I was up front and when they came off the elevator I said to myself "this is either the mob or the FBI". Maybe a little too clean-cut, or maybe it was the body language, I'm still not sure. They asked for a co-worker, did not identify themselves, and wanted to come into the office. I had to press them to get identification. My co-worker came out, agreed to meet with them. It turned out a disgruntled employee had called in and claimed she was the unabomber. A very unpleasant experience, especially for the slandered co-worker. If it happened today, I would surely have complained to the local office about their unwillingness to identify themselves and the sneering, contemptuous attitude when I told them they couldn't just come in. I don't remember exactly what they said, but it was along the lines of "we'll do what we want and there is nothing you or anybody else can do about it". I don't have any problem with FBI or police officers in general, but that incident sure left a bad taste in my mouth.

John

 

[JohnKSa]

Some people want to play games and insist on appointments, etc. We have our games, too. My favorite is called "Grand Jury Subpoena" and the hardcases always hate getting them. They get to miss a day of work, drive 30 miles in the middle of the day to the federal courthouse, leave their handgun in the car, go through magnetometer, and appear before the grand jury - all to answer a few easy questions they could have answered on their front porch.

So you wouldn't have a problem with my showing up at your home any time to ask you some questions that would help me with my job?

And you think it would be ok for me to "play games" with you to complicate your life if you refused to talk with me then and asked me to make an appointment or call you instead?

 

[Avenger29]

I live in a house with large bay windows- that is 180 degrees of coverage- if I need to talk to someone, all I have to do is open the window and verify who they are. I highly encourage anyone building a home or looking for one to look for bay windows. It is very easy to observe anyone instead of haveing to worry about blind spots- better than straining with normal flat windows or squinting through peepholes.

 

[M-Rex]

Over half my encounters with LEOs have been negative, meaning they were dishonest and/or abusing their authority. Since this is the "High Road," and engaging in (so-called) "cop-bashing" is the surest way to get a thread locked, I won't elaborate.

And I'm sure your pretty little innocent self didn't do anything to encourage it. You're pure as the wind driven snow, right?

Try again. This wouldn't be one of your little militia hang-ups, would it?

I dare you to elaborate...if indeed you really can.

 

[M-Rex]

Yep. Cops never masquerade undercover then call in the SWAT team who proceeds to shoot you dead even though you're at your own home, unarmed.

Yep, we're totally paranoid and delusional.

Did you not get it the first time?

Pray tell...how many times has this happend to you?

 

[Lupinus]

Anything they need to be in my home for they can get a warrent. If it isn't urgent or me that called them anything they want to know can be asked an answerd through the door. If I'm in a good mood and it is daylight hours maybe I will call verify and let them in, if not the door locked it is. They don't like it tough cookies. That isn't to say I wont talk to them, simply that I'm not opening the door, esspecialy in the middle of the night.

 

[dman4384]

I really appreciate dealing with helpful members of the public.

Some people want to play games and insist on appointments, etc.

JY

The civilized world has a word for requesting an appointment. Its called courtesy.

What is wrong with asking to make an appointment?

Do the Feds just barge into a doctors office and demand that the doctor treat them?

Gheesh. That post really put a bad taste in my mouth.

Theres a reason why alot of folks don't want to talk to the feds...its because they don't trust them. They don't trust them because they have a track record.

For better or for worse, the arrogance of the Feds (as displayed in the referenced post) continue to remind us of that track record.

A shame really because it doesnt have to be that way, nor should t.

 

[orionengnr]

Rouge Cops - how many have you encountered

Rouge Cops???

I knew it!

They're...they're...everywhere!

Using Taxpayer's money to buy Rouge, and lipstick, and Mascara, and Eye Liner...
Probably shopping at Victoria's Secret on my dime!

And...and...buying Strapless undergarments and... and... parading around to offend the sensibilities of good folk every where!

This madness must Stop! Who will stand with me? Who, I ask?


...what? what did you say? Rogue cops? Not Rouge cops? Ohhh...


Never Mind....

 

[Johnny_Yuma]

We don't usually make appointments

The civilized world has a word for requesting an appointment. Its called courtesy.

What is wrong with asking to make an appointment?

Do the Feds just barge into a doctors office and demand that the doctor treat them?

Gheesh. That post really put a bad taste in my mouth.

Theres a reason why alot of folks don't want to talk to the feds...its because they don't trust them. They don't trust them because they have a track record.

For better or for worse, the arrogance of the Feds (as displayed in the referenced post) continue to remind us of that track record.

Often, we don't know if a potential witness is "friendly" to the subject or beholden to him/her for reasons of love, indebtedness, friendship, etc. Showing up unannounced removes the chances that witnesses will cook up a story with the subject. If you think that's arrogant, you are entitled to that opinion.

I'm proud of what I do for a living and I don't make apologies for it.

JY

 

[orionengnr]

next time a home invader kicks in your door

remind him that he doesn't have an appointment.

Then call your local coroner and see if you can make appointment for them to come out and pick up your body. Would sometime next week do? What's that? He cannot understand you through the static on your phone? Ah, try taking off that tinfoil helmet.

Get real, or at least be consistent.