9mm Soft-points: More penetration? Ditto for 147gr hollow-points

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peacebutready

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Good Day All,

When browsing for a possible ammo purchase online, I noticed one of the manufacturers has 9mm soft-points in 124 grains. Does anyone know if these are better for penetration through bone or a semi-hard barrier? I am also wondering if they are like hollow-points except are slower to expand.

The other part is about 147 grain hollow-points. Assuming they cycle though a firearm well (mine is a CZ75B), are they better to penetrate past bone/semi-hard barriers? Thanks and best regards.
 
Soft-tip ammo is like you said "like hollow-points except are slower to expand". Most common used by hunters its also a good choice for self defense for those concern with hollow points not expanding due to clothing pluging the tip of a hollow point. My concern with these in self defense would be a human skin isn't that thick and neither is the torso, so would the bullet exit the body before expanding? This I don't know...

Also far as bullet weight and heavier bullets having better penetration. Many studies have shown this not to be true. Here is a very good chart for data use that has extentive testing behind it. http://www.chuckhawks.com/handgun_power_chart.htm
 
lol ok.... calm down everyone. Either would be a fine and both work in my CZ 75b. I would say order some of both and see how your gun likes it the CZ 75b was devolved around the 124gr so those might yield better results as far as accuracy don't know until you try.

About the grains of each bullet 124 vs 147 either would do fine penetration wise if you have enough powder behind it.
 
There are soft points and there are soft points. Which soft points are you referring to? I have found most soft points loaded in handgun rounds fail to expand much beyond the diameter of the bullet shank.
 
gofastman said:
Whats that smell?!? oh yeah, BS...
Click to expand...
I'm sorry... Marshall and Sanow seem to do a great amount of research and testing to build such chart. What is it that is BS?
You may argue that their tests were flawed in some way but its not completely false and you can usually find discrepancies and any test. Either way I find it better than a bunch of people with no real world experience (such as combat) saying that one is better cause that is what they use.
Fact is there is a reason why such rounds like the .25-06 are around when there is heavier bullets such as the .30-06 already deployed for the same use... Personally I believe the bullet weight will affect point of impact much more than penetration, and that should be the deciding factor on which weight works best for you.
 
147gr Federal HST

First off, that chart is older then I am:neener: [I am 55yrs old ! :eek:] -and done with OLD Technology Bullets before HST's were ever around. The 147gr Federal HST has fantastic Penetration and opens slightly better then the Winchester Bonded 147gr [Another Excellent Round] I use the +P version of the Federal 147gr HST for a little Extra Energy!:evil:

The Best to All!

Frank

PS-Soft Points for Self Defense-NEVER!
 
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.357 magnum said:
First off, that chart is older then I am:neener: [I am 55yrs old ! :eek:] -and done with OLD Technology Bullets before HST's were ever around. The 147gr Federal HST has fantastic Penetration and opens slightly better then the Winchester Bonded 147gr [Another Excellent Round] I use the +P version of the Federal 147gr HST for a little Extra Energy!:evil:

The Best to All!

Frank

PS-Soft Points for Self Defense-NEVER!
Click to expand...
Did not know it was so old... either way I still think that what I said holds true, bullet weight will impact point of impact much more than penetration. Of course adjustable sights make that a non issue.
 
Chuck Hawks and Marshall and Sanow are some of the most discredited names in firearms/ammunition. Look elsewhere.
 
+1 Drail.

There are much better sources of information out there.
 
Drail said:
Chuck Hawks and Marshall and Sanow are some of the most discredited names in firearms/ammunition. Look elsewhere.
Click to expand...
I've wondered if Marshall and Sanow have some good points with stopping power where bone is not hit. I've read/heard of people being shot multiple times in the chest with 115gr hollow-point ammo and surviving. Ditto for the upper back. I saw a video clip after the event showing a man hit twice in the chest with a .40 and the police walking him along in cuffs like he wasn't even shot. Do the police academies teach candidates to aim for the gut still? My guess is that's where it hurts like hell with fast expanding ammo.
 
I'd use 'em if the pistol wouldn't eat JHP's, otherwise I'd use a good JHP from a reputable maker in +P or +P+ and 115-127gr. weight. They penetrate enough and open up fine due to the velocity, and if that isn't enough step up to a bigger calibre. Save the 147's for the suppressor.
 
Most common used by hunters its also a good choice for self defense for those concern with hollow points not expanding due to clothing pluging the tip of a hollow point. My concern with these in self defense would be a human skin isn't that thick and neither is the torso, so would the bullet exit the body before expanding? This I don't know...
Click to expand...

I would be concerned with that, given that a handgun softpoint bulleet isn't going to expand much if at all in a person. I don't even think the magnum revolver softpoints get any significant amount of expansion until you get into something like the .460 which only exists to get light rifle velocity. Makes for good marketing campaigns.

Like gofast I'd take a soft point over an FMJ, but I wouldn't expect it to do any better.

147 grain bullet typically penetrate soft tissue noticeably better than the lighter 9mm bullets, but hard barriers like steel are almost always better defeated with a fast bullet, weight or sectional density doesn't really affect thin hard barrier penetration all that much.

And today's 147 grain 9mm bullets are head and shoulders above all of the 9mm loads that were offered when Marshall and Sanow were still around and somewhat reputable.
 
Also my 9mm CZ loved the 147 and 147+P HSTs, and my .40 liked the 165 and 180s just as well.
 
Save the 147's for the suppressor.
Click to expand...

147gr bullets are longer, which allow them to have a deeper hollowpoint cavity. The deeper cavity allows cloth plugs, which are cut out “cookie-cutter” style by the cavity rim, to be pushed deeper into the cavity, which clears the cavity mouth to facilitate reliable expansion without +P or +P+ recoil and muzzle flip (required for lighter-weight bullets to achieve the same level of expansion reliability after passing through heavy clothing).

147gr is to 9mm what 230gr is to .45 ACP and 180gr is to .40 S&W. All share similar sectional densities. All are propelled at similar velocities. All penetrate about the same after expansion.
 
Softpoints, with exposed lead at the tip, seem likely to cause feeding stoppages in auto pistols. As well, if they do expand at all, they just mash the nose over a little, resembling a rivet. If they worked, the ammo companies would have used them instead, don't you think?
 
I Apologize

robinkevin-I owe you an apology I should not have been condescending!:( Please accept my apologies.

The Best to All!

Frank
 
Sellier and Bellot makes two different kinds of 9mm soft points, one is a standard 9mm FMJ with an exposed tip and the other is a truncated cone with an exposed tip.
When it hits bone, the bullet "squashes" rather than just punching through. Other than that it works just like any other ball ammo. They won't expand in a pistol, maybe a carbine. You can't get the speed high enough to make the lead expand in soft tissue like a soft tip rifle bullet.
S&B also make a 9mm LRN for those old fashioned kinda people ;)
 
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