Carrying a gun you like.

[The Night Rider]

If being charged from 7 yards or less,

Well. let's break this down a little further.

I've only had two people try to attack me around witnesses. Both were in a 7-Eleven and there really wasn't any place in the store that I could be 7 yards away from them.

There was one tweaker that tried to approach me at a gas station and I saw him and stopped him as soon as it became apparent that I was the person he was trying to contact.

Everyone else stayed under cover or didn't begin the interview until I was fairly close and to be fair in almost every instance the fact that I started shaking up my OC had a more to do with ending the encounter than the fact I had a gun.

TBH most of my encounters I initiated because my job required it.

 

[The Night Rider]

I don’t practice a lot for self defense. I practice my draw, and single hit on target, then transition to another target. Sometimes 3 targets.

 

[WrongHanded]

Thats not doing anyone any favors though, nor is it likely realistic.

On the other hand, it does sound like the current thinking of the American school system.

Youll learn and gain more trying to work within the 7-yard limit, than you will the 25.

Right, but my point was that if a person is struggling to get off two or more shots from an unrealistically long distance like that, because they chose slow hardware, they're only going to do worse closer in.

 

[JohnKSa]

No reason to double tap as I believe 44 special, loaded to slightly above 45 automatic levels will bring down an attacker with 1 shot. So my six shooter makes me good for up to six badguys provided I have good shot placement.

In a gunfight situation, where everyone is shooting and also doing their best to not get shot, good shot placement is not a given by any means.

Just getting hits is hard enough in a gunfight which is why it's usually recommended to assume that you will need two hits to stop the attack. Assuming you can make hits during the gunfight as well as a typical law enforcement officer (they get about a 30% hit rate), your chances of getting 2 hits on a single opponent are about 58% if you have 6 shots and get to use all of them before getting hit. Your chances of getting 2 hits on 2 opponents is about 7% with 6 shots--again assuming you get to make all your shots before getting hit.

A six shooter, assuming typical gunfight type accuracy and the need for 2 hits per assailant to neutralize, gives you a little better than even odds against 1 attacker and a 93% chance of failing against 2. Anything more than 2 is just wishful thinking.

 

[DeepSouth]

I find it amazing this has gone 5 pages.
Post #2 said “carry what you want”

Well, amen brother!

Choosing the trade off you want is entirely your business. If you are the one carrying the gun it is only your business, if you are not carrying the gun it is not your concern.

If someone wants to carry a NAA 22 short fine! If you’re comfortable with that limitation you are the one that has to deal with the consequences of that decision. I just can’t imagine me caring what you carry.
And if you want to carry a G17, G19, and AR pistol with 5 extra mags for each, fine. You have to carry it around not me, so I really don’t care.

So many of you guys need to just quit caring about what other people think & believe. And before you say “well I really don’t” then why go on and on about it for pages and pages… does anyone really think some is going to change their mind at this point?

When I disagree with someone about their carry gear/philosophy I may express my opinion (if asked) and they disagree about I roll my eyes or shrug my shoulders and move on with life….. because I’m unaffected.

 

[JohnKSa]

Choosing the trade off you want is entirely your business. If you are the one carrying the gun it is only your business, if you are not carrying the gun it is not your concern.

To be fair, he started the conversation which implies he wants to discuss the topic. That pretty much guarantees that there will be multiple opinions voiced.

People who don't want to discuss their decisions don't have to--but it doesn't make sense to bring up the topic and then be surprised when people give advice and air their own views on the subject.

Also, if he had just said: "It makes me happy and that's all I care about.", it would be a lot different than saying: "It makes me happy and it's a good choice from a self-defense standpoint." The former can't be debated. Someone might not agree with his choice, but if all he cares about is being happy and he says it makes him happy, there's no real way to disagree with his reasoning. But once he starts arguing that his choice makes sense from a self-defense standpoint, it's a whole different kettle of fish. At that point it's quite easy to disagree with his reasoning and support that disagreement with logic and facts.

 

[trackskippy]

….. because I’m unaffected.

Hopefully, thats the case.

What worries me is, all these people carrying a gun who have trouble just hitting somewhere on a full size human silhouette at 5 yards, let alone know enough about human anatomy to pick a specific vital spot and hit it. And that's when they are standing still and arent under any stress and started with the gun in their hands.

 

[DeepSouth]

To be fair, he started the conversation which implies he wants to discuss the topic. That pretty much guarantees that there will be multiple opinions voiced.

People who don't want to discuss their decisions don't have to--but it doesn't make sense to bring up the topic and then be surprised when people give advice and air their own views on the subject.

Also, if he had just said: "It makes me happy and that's all I care about.", it would be a lot different than saying: "It makes me happy and it's a good choice from a self-defense standpoint." The former can't be debated. Someone might not agree with his choice, but if all he cares about is being happy and he says it makes him happy, there's no real way to disagree with his reasoning. But once he starts arguing that his choice makes sense from a self-defense standpoint, it's a whole different kettle of fish. At that point it's quite easy to disagree with his reasoning and support that disagreement with logic and facts.

All fair points, I just went on a bit of rant I suppose.
Sorry about all that.

 

[.38 Special]

Care to expand on why you think so?

I should have thought it self evident.

 

[UncleEd]

Regarding references to training schools, I was
critical and did mention Mas Ayoob. And I've
supported the idea of revolver carry.

But I definitely agree with Ayoob on one thing when
it comes to autos. In his most recent video for Wilson
he touts the Wilson Beretta Centurion. Right on!

So many here have mentioned Glock. Ugh, say I.
The DA/SA Beretta has it all over that Austrian
concoction. The DA feature is an excellent feature.

Now back to defending revolvers.

 

[Kleanbore]

I should have thought it self evident.

Not to me.

The scenario reflects an ambush at close distance, which is what one might expect and which one may be forced to defend against.

If you thought it "gibberish", perhaps it was not described clearly.

 

[Zendude]

How often is a thug or even a group of thugs going to continue an assault on you or a carjacking once the defender fires a shot?

 

[Kleanbore]

How often is a thug or even a group of thugs going to continue an assault on you or a carjacking once the defender fires a shot?

Sometimes that will suffice. I would never count on it.

We had a recent video here showing an Uber driver in Philadelphia firing perhaps 16 shots at members of a carjacking group before they turned and ran.

 

[Kleanbore]

Hopefully, thats the case.

What worries me is, all these people carrying a gun who have trouble just hitting somewhere on a full size human silhouette at 5 yards, let alone know enough about human anatomy to pick a specific vital spot and hit it. And that's when they are standing still and arent under any stress and started with the gun in their hands.

I would put them among those who believe that just carrying a gun is sufficient.

 

[Ru4real]

If someone has reached a distance of two feet from a defender and is moving fast, hitting the head would be extremely difficult. No one would recommend trying that.

I just recommended it, I’m someone. They ran at me from 25 feet. Surely you realize that the “coming towards” or “going away shot” is the easiest to make. If not, I suggest practicing that shot and it will become quickly evident and you will see how little your have to move your gun to stay on target.

Also, the perp with the rock/machete/knife had 23 feet to look down my barrel and the whole time my target is getting bigger. Basketball = slam dunk

You must be a far better shot than I am, with far faster reflexes, and so cool under pressure that you make Absolute Zero look warm.

It’s a timing or countdown shot and thus doesn’t require fast reflexes. It also tends to calm and coordinate the shooter because the mind can envision the shot and has a picture of success for the second or two before it happens.

The best example for calming coordination and readiness are countdowns for rocket launches.

And yeah, I do have nerves of steel under pressure, but that’s beside the point. If your saying you’d be less scared doing a mag dump at 25 feet, chances are every bullet will be a miss.

 

[Jeff White]

I just recommended it, I’m someone. They ran at me from 25 feet. Surely you realize that the “coming towards” or “going away shot” is the easiest to make. If not, I suggest practicing that shot and it will become quickly evident

Yes, it’s a very easy shot on the square range with no Adrenalin in your system and no consequences for failure. Ever tried it when your heart rate is 160 or above?

Also, the perp with the rock/machete/knife had 23 feet to look down my barrel and the whole time my target is getting bigger.

How long do you think it’s going to take the perp to cover that 23 feet? How many EDPs have you had to subdue? I can assure you that none of them I ever had to arrest ever thought about looking down the barrel of a gun. There is an entire class of people who will be completely unimpressed by a drawn gun. Some will take it as a challenge. And you’re going to stand your ground and calmly shoot the perp down. How calm do you think you will get in the second to second and a half it would take the perp to cover that distance?

 

[Ru4real]

Ever tried it when your heart rate is 160 or above?

How long do you think it’s going to take the perp to cover that 23 feet?

I stated the time in my previous post. About a second or two. And in that time I’m somehow magically pumped full of adrenaline and my heart rate goes from 60 to 160? In 10 seconds, sure.

I offered my opinion on what I would do. And now you are the third person telling my my opinion is wrong. For what I would do. Not you. Me.

Religion anyone?

 

[WrongHanded]

It’s a timing or countdown shot and thus doesn’t require fast reflexes. It also tends to calm and coordinate the shooter because the mind can envision the shot and has a picture of success for the second or two before it happens.

The best example for calming coordination and readiness are countdowns for rocket launches.

And yeah, I do have nerves of steel under pressure, but that’s beside the point. If your saying you’d be less scared doing a mag dump at 25 feet, chances are every bullet will be a miss.

It's not just a countdown on a moving head, because that head is unlikely to be delivered on a Zipline. The muzzle still has to be pointed in exactly the right direction, when the bullet leaves it. It's all easy peasy when you're imagining it, but pulling it off first time in real life is unlikely to go well for the vast vast majority people. Maybe you're just that good, but don't pretend such a feat is simple and easy and anyone can just do it.

It's got nothing to do with a mag dump. It has to do with not having to manually cock a hammer before I can take each subsequent shot.

 

[Ru4real]

How many EDPs have you had to subdue?

Cops are obligated to subdue, if possible. I’m not a cop, lol.

 

[Ru4real]

It has to do with not having to manually cock a hammer before I can take each subsequent shot.

Cool. Good for you. And for me, I will get it done with one shot at two feet like I said in my first post to your scenario. I’m not trying to change your opinion. I’m simply stating mine, again.

 

[eddiememphis]

I would put them among those who believe that just carrying a gun is sufficient.

How often do you train and what scenarios do you train for?

 

[Jeff White]

I stated the time in my previous post. About a second or two. And in that time I’m somehow magically pumped full of adrenaline and my heart rate goes from 60 to 160? In 10 seconds, sure.

Yes, you’re heart rate doesn’t slowly accelerate and the Adrenalin doesn’t flow into your system like it’s regulated by an IV pump. They call it an Adrenalin dump for a reason.

I offered my opinion on what I would do. And now you are the third person telling my my opinion is wrong. For what I would do. Not you. Me.

I spent my adult life doing this and teaching it for living. You posted what you think you would do. Everyone I ever met with no experience thinks that they will calmly dispatch their attacker just like they envision it in their mind and just like they practiced it on the range.

Professionals, both military and LE do stress inoculation training so they can learn to function under stress.

Cops are obligated to subdue, if possible. I’m not a cop, lol.

Nope but if you are attacked you will be dealing with an EDP and when that EDP doesn’t react to your response the way you expect you might slow your response enough to get hurt. I’ve seen it happen.

Of course if you’re completely confident that your fight will happen exactly the way you envision you’re free to ignore everyone here.

Just remember this truism I learned early on in my Army career…..No plan survives contact.

 

[bdickens]

I like carrying a gun, I like my gun. I like shooting my gun. But I don’t like “training”, so I don’t do it.

Wow. That's.... quite remarkable....

I’ve always felt having a gun is enough, and then practicing a smooth draw and being proficient with manipulation, more than enough

Just having a gun doesn't make you ready to defend yourself any more than owning a guitar makes you a musician.

 

[bdickens]

No reason to double tap as I believe 44 special, loaded to slightly above 45 automatic levels will bring down an attacker with 1 shot.

Maybe.

So my six shooter makes me good for up to six badguys provided I have good shot placement.

Whole lotta maybe.

 

[old lady new shooter]

First... top notch from your earlier post that you have thought about it and do practice.
Now, for training with a revolver, Tom Givens does offer Rangemaster classes in Defensive Revolver. Read about the class here, clicking on Defense Revolver to top open the description that begins,


Tom's EventBrite page shows that he is teaching the course on January 6 in Memphis!

Can you get there? Good luck.

Gunsite and I believe ITT also offer classes for revolver users.