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CCH At A License Check

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by MikeNice, May 12, 2011.

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  1. MikeNice

    MikeNice Member

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    I ran in to a license check this morning while taking my kid to pre-school. I wanted to post and see if anyone else has had a similar experience.

    While I was waiting in the line of cars I reached in to my pocket and pulled out my wallet. I retrieved my license and carry permit. I then tossed my wallet up on to the dash board. I rolled my window down and put my left arm on the window sill with both cards in my hand.

    When I got to the cops the first words out of my mouth were, "I am a concealed carry permit holder and I have my gun with me."

    The officer took both cards and before he looked at them he asked me to pull up and off of the road. I complied and even said "yes sir." I parked and put both hands on top of the steering wheel with my fingers interlocked.

    He walked over to the car and asked me where my gun was located. I told him that it was in a holster beside my right leg. He then asked me to rais my arms over my head so that he could see the gun. I did as I was asked and everything seemed fine.

    He asked me when I recieved my carry permit and I said that it was either late October or early November. He shook his head and asked me to exit the car. I reminded him of the location of the gun. He called another officer to observe while I exited the car.

    When I exited the car he told me to walk to the rear of the car and place my hands on the trunk. He then reached in the car and removed the gun and holster. He inspected the gun. He removed it and held it pointed sideways torwards the car. He actually muzzle swept my kid twice.

    After he inspected the gun he said he hadn't seen one like it before. He then asked if I had modified the barell in any way. I told him that I hadn't it was just a semi rare Taurus 85 with a three inch barell. He nodded and asked the other cop to stand by while he went to run the numbers.

    He came back and asked me where I had bought the gun. I told him that I had bought it from a friend that picked two of them up at an estate sale. He nodded again and asked if my friend had an FFL. I responed that he didn't but that we were both CCH holders and no laws were violated. He nodded and looked at me for a second.

    (This part was the icing on the cake.)

    He asked me, "do you think you are properly trained to carry a gun."

    I responded, "According to the state of North Carolina I am responsible enough, I have trained enough, and I can shoot well enough. I know I can put fifty of fifty inside the nine ring or better. Most cops I work with can't do that. So you tell me."

    He then asked which department I worked with. I told him which department I worked with and explained my position with the department. He simply said, "sorry for the mix up" and handed me back my gun.

    Suddenly it was fine for me to carry even though I am not a LEO. It seems that in his mind just working for a police department makes me worthy to carry a gun.

    I got his badge number and car number. I am actually in the process of typing up a formal complaint.
     
  2. Ford4x4

    Ford4x4 Member

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    Good for you on the complaint. Sweeping your kid is a really bad deal. I considered not appendix or pocket carrying my j frame, because of the possibility of getting shot in the carotid artery while a cop disarms me.

    When he asked you if you were properly trained to carry a gun I might have mentioned that I can at least follow the four rules and not point it at anyone, unlike him. However, that would be kind of like going to the zoo and putting your finger between the bars, just to see what would happen.
     
  3. dusty14u

    dusty14u Member

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    Which part of Carolina? My fiancee live in Greenville and I was ticketed for a minor traffic offense and my experience was pretty good.Once I informed the officer nothing else was said of the matter. He did have a second unit there and I kept my hands on the steering wheel and that was it.

    On Open Carry forum I have read of some pretty nasty treatment by LEO in the North Carolina forum. I think you are more than justified in filing a complaint. Totally unproffessional and asking questions that were irrelevant to anything going on. It seems he has a personel agenda and was persuing his own agenda.
     
  4. MikeNice

    MikeNice Member

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    It was in Orange County. I honestly never would have expected it there. I have been through checks in Durham and Raleigh with zero issues.
     
  5. Superpsy

    Superpsy Member

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    geez louise. Please file a complaint.
     
  6. M2 Carbine

    M2 Carbine Member

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    Definitely file a complaint. The Officer was WAY out of bounds. I would demand a written apology for such unnecessary high handed treatment.
    (I was a city Policeman myself years ago)


    I have been stopped, for one reason or another, over a dozen times, by all manner of LEO. They were always very polite when they saw my carry license.


    OH YEAH, this REALLY makes me mad.
     
  7. HD Fboy

    HD Fboy Member

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    My son got pulled over several months ago for rolling thru a stop sign.. Cop comes up and my son does the same thing. Officer asks where is the firearm. Son tells him center console. Officer asked if he can retrieve the gun my son says sure. Cop retrieves weapon, and says wow this is what I carry as an off duty piece. "Nice choice!" He then let my son go, no ticket.
     
  8. Bubba613

    Bubba613 member

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    Some cops just have an attitude that private citizens cannot be trusted with guns,no matter what the law says.
    Sad.
     
  9. JellyJar

    JellyJar Member

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    The only time I have ever been stopped while carrying was in East Texas outside the city of Nacodoches. Once I informed the officer about my gun and showed him my CHL it was a total non-issue.

    Got to love Texas! :)
     
  10. Mudinyeri

    Mudinyeri Member

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    I would most likely have asked that he please not point the barrel of the weapon at my kid. Did he at least remove the magazine and empty the chamber before he "waved" the gun around?
     
  11. Hangingrock

    Hangingrock Member

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    I’ve never experienced that problem in this part of NC nor did I experience a problem when pulled over for speeding by the NCHP on I-40 when returning from Raleigh.

    On a stop/check I give them NC-CHP, drivers license, insurance card, and registration. The only question I’ve ever been asked is “what are you packing”.
     
  12. Jeff F

    Jeff F Member

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    Thats one reason I like it here, no duty to inform. Its a can of worms I don't want opened.
     
  13. dodo bird

    dodo bird Member

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    License check???? Your experience sounds horrible. File a complaint for sure. But why would you ever have a licience check if there was no laws broken?
     
  14. 9mm+

    9mm+ Member

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    There's your problem. That's Liberal Country there! ;)

    I live in Wake County and haven't had any issues yet. I tell my CCH students that if they're pulled over to roll down the window and press your palms against the steering wheel at the 10:00 and 2:00 position and spread your fingers without making a move. When the officer comes to the car, inform him or her that you're a CCH holder and whether or not you are carrying. DON'T MOVE YOUR HANDS. The LEO will then ask for your permit and license, but ASK IF YOU CAN MOVE YOUR HANDS TO RETRIEVE THEM. The LEO will ask where the gun is if you're carrying, but TELL HIM/HER WHERE IT IS WITHOUT REACHING FOR IT (usually the LEO will retrieve it personally). In other words, don't move your hands at all unless you explicitly ask if you may and only for the item in question.

    It's a big, fat PITA in North Carolina, but it's getting better here. At least we will soon be able to carry in restaurants that serve alcohol. Baby steps...baby steps...
     
  15. 9mm+

    9mm+ Member

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    I would've recommended against that. See post #14.
     
  16. Hangingrock

    Hangingrock Member

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    Driver-Licence check points SOP in NC
     
  17. henschman

    henschman Member

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    What a disgrace. First you are stopped without any suspicion of being in violation of any law, and required to show papers. Then you have to show that you have permission from the state that you are armed and inform the policeman that you are. Then, still without any suspicion of any wrongoing of any kind, nor with any warrant, you are subjected to a search and seizure of your property. Absolutely ridiculous and disgraceful that this happens in what we fancy to be a free country. The fact that this sort of thing goes on in my country makes me livid... not only at those who made such laws, but those who unquestioningly enforce them. I could never be in the business of law enforcement these days. There are too many laws that I would be required to enforce which I consider to be a violation of the rightful liberty of the citizens of this country.
     
  18. 9mm+

    9mm+ Member

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    North Carolina used to be a decent state to live in, however we have now been overrun by yankees from New York*, New Jersey*, etc., who have brought their liberal, anti-gun agenda with them.

    *I commend and respect my freedom-loving gun owners in NY and NJ. This comment was not directed at you. It was directed to your liberal brethren who have fled your state and have infected ours.
     
  19. ny32182

    ny32182 Member

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    Prime example of why "requirement to inform" laws are a terrible idea.
     
  20. phoglund

    phoglund Member

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    I have to agree with 9mm+. A driver's license check? Really? North Carolina blocks roads to check everybody's driver's licenses? I'd thought only authoritarian autocratic governments had random document check points strewn about. :barf:

    :cuss:

    I'm beginning to think I'll have to start a list of 'No Visit' states!
     
  21. mljdeckard

    mljdeckard Member

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    I would also seek to learn which judge requested this checkpoint, and look through the notices in your newspaper to see if advance public notice was given.
     
  22. 9mm+

    9mm+ Member

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    These are determined at the police department level. They're legal here without consent required from a state judge. See below:

    There is no constitutional mandate requiring law enforcement officers to obtain permission from a supervising officer before conducting a driver's license checkpoint; furthermore, written guidelines are not required and the legislature did not intend for N.C.G.S. § 20-16.3A to apply to all license checks.
     
  23. rellascout

    rellascout member

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    I was pulled over in VA once for speeding. In VA you do not have to inform them but when they run your lic your CHP data shows up so I always inform. The officer was young and inexperienced. While holding my lic and permit my hands are on the wheel so he can clearly see them. He asks for my lic & registration and I move my left hand giving him the items he requested + my CHP.

    He asks are you armed and where is the gun? I told him I was armed and that the gun is on my hip secured in a holster. He asks me to step out of the car because he wants to take posession of the gun. I comply and he has me put my hands on the car and reaches to unholster my gun and take possession of it. His eyes just about bug out of his head at this point because he sees the hammer is cocked. I am carrying a DW 1911 CBOB.

    He then proceeds to remove the mag but cannot clear the weapon because he does not disengage the thumb safety. He looks confused and at this point I ask him do you want me to clear the weapon. He says yes. So he hands it back to me I point it in a safe direction and clear it. I then hand the round and the gun back to him. I am pretty sure he had never held a 1911 in his short life. IMHO he had no business taking posession of a gun he had no idea how to operate.

    He then asks me to sit in the front seat of the patrol car. He writes me my ticket and then hands the unloaded gun, mag and unchambered round back to me. As I am signing the ticket he says to me. "It's your gun and you can carry it anyway you want but carrying it with the hammer cocked is dangerous and sooner or later you are going to shoot yourself or someone else." :what:

    At this point I have my ticket my gun back but I cannot keep my mouth shut any longer. I proceed to explain to him that the gun is a 1911. I explain the grip safety and the thumb safety to him. I even ask if he will allow me to demonstrate how they work. I show him that with the thumb safety disengaged but no pressure on grip safety the trigger will not drop the hammer. I then show him that with the thumb safety engaged and pressure on the grip safety the hammer will not fall. I then show him the 3 diliberate actions required to fire the gun. I explain to him that yes it would be dangerous to carry his Sig P229 with the hammer cocked because it is a DA/SA gun but that in many ways one could argue that the cocked and locked 1911 is safer than his Sig.

    He just looks at me and repeats "It's your gun and you can carry it anyway you want but carrying it with the hammer cocked is dangerous and sooner or later you are going to shoot yourself or someone else."

    Needless to say I filed a report with the VA State Police. He did not sweep me with the gun but he had no business taking posession of a gun he did not know how to operate. He also should have skipped the lecture since again he had ZERO knowledge of the 1911. Instead of simply leaving me in the car with my hands where he can see them he not only took the gun but felt the need to clear it. Then when he could not clear it handed it back to me to clear it. If I had bad intentions towards him I would have shot him with the chambered round. This fact seemed to be lost on him. By handing it back to me he negated the need to secure it in the first place. It was a clear case of a young ignorant officer who believed because he wore a badge he knew best.

    Every other time in VA during a traffic stop the officer has simply asked where is the gun. I told them it was in a holster on my hip. They told me to leave it there and keep my hands where they could see them.
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2011
  24. The Lone Haranguer

    The Lone Haranguer Member

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    I don't know what NC law is regarding this, but it seems likely this could have been avoided by not volunteering such information.
     
  25. ForumSurfer

    ForumSurfer Member

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    :fire::cuss::banghead:

    I hate that. I did some work with government in my past. I was pulled over once and the guy recognized me. He literally stopped writing the ticket. It felt disgusting. Are you a better class of person deserving of special consideration because you work with law enforcement? That's why I hate those little black stickers with the blue bars that the LEO's significant other displays. Is an LEO's marital partner more deserving of leniency than we lowly peasants' marital partners? Same goes for those "NC Justice System" license plate frames or the special tags for judges. This is a free society and we all deserve the same treatment during a traffic stop. I have many friends in law enforcemnt and I have the utmost respect for them, but they and their SO's should be subject to the same treatment and scrutiny as the rest of us.

    /rant

    Good for you!!!! Keep me informed, by pm if necessary.

    We have a duty to inform in NC.

    Edit:: one more thing...

    So what if you did? At that point, I might have lied and said "yes" since you hadn't done anything you could be ticketed or charged for. You were detained for no good reason and your child was left unattended in your car at the roadside while some self righteous LEO (mind you, all of them aren't...you ran into a bad apple) pointed your weapon at your kid. Man I'm furious just thinking about it. I hope you follow through on the complaint. The officer needs to be taught a lesson and have someone lecture him in this case, not you.
     
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