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Instructors? A instructor should be able to teach you to shoot so that you don't NEED 12-15-17-19-or 32 rounds.
Kevin
Kevin
CCW instructor tells wife that her 642 is a bad choice !
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Fred Fuller
Moderator Emeritus
Too bad you had to pay money to have her confidence in her weapon undermined. Of course it is an adequate choice, whoever tried to tell her otherwise is an idiot.
I showed your post to my wife (also a shooter herself) and her immediate response would not be suitable for Art's grammaw to read, I assure you. My wife has several S&W snubs...
lpl/nc
I showed your post to my wife (also a shooter herself) and her immediate response would not be suitable for Art's grammaw to read, I assure you. My wife has several S&W snubs...
lpl/nc
Mongo the Mutterer
Member
Counterpoint. In my CCW class the instructor liked wheel guns.
Matter of opinion. If I need more than 5 rounds of .38 +P, I'm definitely in the wrong place. Feet don't fail me now...
But I will have the 642 with me, especially in the summer.
Matter of opinion. If I need more than 5 rounds of .38 +P, I'm definitely in the wrong place. Feet don't fail me now...
But I will have the 642 with me, especially in the summer.
Cosmoline
Member
Here we go again. This is yet another example of how too many Americans, including many "experts", view the sidearm as the ultimate weapon. They seriously think that getting into a sustained firefight with a short gun is a realistic possibility. The revolver is perfectly fine as a handgun. Why? Because all handguns are short range defensive firearms. AND THAT IS ALL THEY ARE!! If you're facing multiple armed foes, you need a long gun if you want to survive. This business of planning on using a pistol in a protracted offensive firefight with a bunch of goblins is nuts.
ken B
Member
CCW and revolvers
Unless they've changed it, in Texas if you test with a revolver, that is all you are legally able to carry concealed, while testing with an auto means you can carry any type of pistol ( really not sure why that is...has it changed?)
When my wife was looking into taking her course, she was a very new shooter and the instructor of the course that she thought of taking did everything but refuse to let her take it with a wheelie. DId everything to dissuade her. SO, we tried everything from Beretta to Browning to Glock and so on....hated them. Hated slides, hated the brass coming near her head in some instances (she's a southpaw), hated them. She now knows how to use everything in our safe, but hates them.
Picked up a rather clean, very clean Model 10 4" heavy barrel...she now has 4 revolvers that WILL go with her when either death or divorce do us part
(hope she's joking!) Took the course with another instructor, who was great with her and the other woman who took the course (if memory serves me, she used a Model 66).
She's told the other guy when she ran into him that she was only going to carry a revolver, so why take it with an auto?
That is just bad that instructors won't teach someone basic saftey like muzzle control, or badmouth someone's choice in pistolas. Little on the high horse from what it sounds, I guess. Shoot, anything in the pocket is better than a $1k custom in the safe!
Ken B
Unless they've changed it, in Texas if you test with a revolver, that is all you are legally able to carry concealed, while testing with an auto means you can carry any type of pistol ( really not sure why that is...has it changed?)
When my wife was looking into taking her course, she was a very new shooter and the instructor of the course that she thought of taking did everything but refuse to let her take it with a wheelie. DId everything to dissuade her. SO, we tried everything from Beretta to Browning to Glock and so on....hated them. Hated slides, hated the brass coming near her head in some instances (she's a southpaw), hated them. She now knows how to use everything in our safe, but hates them.
Picked up a rather clean, very clean Model 10 4" heavy barrel...she now has 4 revolvers that WILL go with her when either death or divorce do us part
(hope she's joking!) Took the course with another instructor, who was great with her and the other woman who took the course (if memory serves me, she used a Model 66). She's told the other guy when she ran into him that she was only going to carry a revolver, so why take it with an auto?
That is just bad that instructors won't teach someone basic saftey like muzzle control, or badmouth someone's choice in pistolas. Little on the high horse from what it sounds, I guess. Shoot, anything in the pocket is better than a $1k custom in the safe!
Ken B
Kamicosmos
Member
In MO, you have to shoot both revolver and semi-auto to qualify for the CCW permit. I think it's a good idea. (que argument about training requirements infringing on the 2nd A now. 
)
I won't expand on the revo vs uberauto argument. Both guns have their place. I carry an SP101 with a speedloader. If I ever have to shoot and I have to use more than 10 rounds of .357 Magnum....I better be shooting at Aliens, T-Rex's, zombie hordes, etc.
On occasion, I carry my CZ97 with a spare mag. If I ever have to shoot and I have to use more than 21 rounds of .45 ACP....I better be shooting at Aliens, T-Rex's, zombie hordes, etc.
You get the idea behind my point. Carry what you want, what you can conceal, and what you're comfortable and confident in shooting! End of debate.
)I won't expand on the revo vs uberauto argument. Both guns have their place. I carry an SP101 with a speedloader. If I ever have to shoot and I have to use more than 10 rounds of .357 Magnum....I better be shooting at Aliens, T-Rex's, zombie hordes, etc.
On occasion, I carry my CZ97 with a spare mag. If I ever have to shoot and I have to use more than 21 rounds of .45 ACP....I better be shooting at Aliens, T-Rex's, zombie hordes, etc.
You get the idea behind my point. Carry what you want, what you can conceal, and what you're comfortable and confident in shooting! End of debate.
denfoote
Member
Scottsdale Gun club!!
I knew the funny feeling I had about that place was warranted!
I took my renewal class at Mandall's shortly before they shut down.
I knew the funny feeling I had about that place was warranted!
I took my renewal class at Mandall's shortly before they shut down.
I'm a CCW instructor for Arkansas, and what they said to your wife sounds like all kinds of stupid......and not for the least reason that saying such stupid things to paying customers tends to drive away other paying customers in the future.
I was actually staying in Scottsdale with friends back when the Scottsdale Gun Club was on the verge of opening. In fact, they were opening the week after I left.
I picked up their brochures, and read about the club on the Internet. My friend even drove me to the parking lot and let me check it out. He knew I was into guns, and did it mainly as a joke, since he was living literally about four blocks from it.
It looked like a place where the main concern was how much money you had, and anything else, especially things reltaed to guns, would be very much secondary.
hillbilly
I was actually staying in Scottsdale with friends back when the Scottsdale Gun Club was on the verge of opening. In fact, they were opening the week after I left.
I picked up their brochures, and read about the club on the Internet. My friend even drove me to the parking lot and let me check it out. He knew I was into guns, and did it mainly as a joke, since he was living literally about four blocks from it.
It looked like a place where the main concern was how much money you had, and anything else, especially things reltaed to guns, would be very much secondary.
hillbilly
Thanks for all the responses.
She called me on break to say that she shot 3 x 10 ring, 5 in 8/9, and 2 flyers in 7 (not bad flyers if you ask me).
The RO singled her out for compliment, especially as she was not only the only revolver on the course, but with a 1 7/8" at that.
After the shoot, a few of the other attendees came to talk to her and one said that "anyone who goes up against this girl on the street is dead". A little too much maybe, but it has all served to make her feel a lot better about the whole course.
If anyone needs a realtor in Phoenix who knows how to shoot a J Frame just let me know
She called me on break to say that she shot 3 x 10 ring, 5 in 8/9, and 2 flyers in 7 (not bad flyers if you ask me).
The RO singled her out for compliment, especially as she was not only the only revolver on the course, but with a 1 7/8" at that.
After the shoot, a few of the other attendees came to talk to her and one said that "anyone who goes up against this girl on the street is dead". A little too much maybe, but it has all served to make her feel a lot better about the whole course.
If anyone needs a realtor in Phoenix who knows how to shoot a J Frame just let me know
Glad to hear it all came out good.
I was waiting to hear how it went.
I've also been waiting to take the course myself.
If she needs any help Real Estate wise on the East side (East Valley) that can also handle a Wheelgun and does not deal too much with bottom feeders, have her call me. I'll take care of her people on this side of town.
What company is she with ?
Jeff (GUNKWAZY)
Red Brick Realty
I was waiting to hear how it went.
I've also been waiting to take the course myself.
If she needs any help Real Estate wise on the East side (East Valley) that can also handle a Wheelgun and does not deal too much with bottom feeders, have her call me. I'll take care of her people on this side of town.
What company is she with ?
Jeff (GUNKWAZY)
Red Brick Realty
dawei
Member
Those that can't, teach; those that can't teach write for gun magazines.
Three times I've used a handgun to defend myself. All three times were with a revolver; the most I shot was twice. I'm here, they're not - nuff said.
Three times I've used a handgun to defend myself. All three times were with a revolver; the most I shot was twice. I'm here, they're not - nuff said.
"Three determined assailants will undo that plan.
As will being a bad shot under stress.
I'm not saying that a five-shot isn't a viable choice. I'm saying that more ammunition is generally a Good Thing, everything else being equal.
pax"
Well, let me take this kind of thinking one step further,
10,000 charging Red Chinese could screw up your day even if you had a BAR and a duce and a half full of ammo now couldn't it?
It is a shame what some folks won't do to run down someone elses handgun pick.
As will being a bad shot under stress.
I'm not saying that a five-shot isn't a viable choice. I'm saying that more ammunition is generally a Good Thing, everything else being equal.
pax"
Well, let me take this kind of thinking one step further,
10,000 charging Red Chinese could screw up your day even if you had a BAR and a duce and a half full of ammo now couldn't it?
It is a shame what some folks won't do to run down someone elses handgun pick.
I know a few guys that got certificates or whatever as instructors when Ky's concealed carry law went into effect. Other than owning a few guns these guys had no business teaching anyone anything about guns or shooting. I still hear a lot BS statements from instructors and range workers that should know better.
bubbygator
Member
I'll tell a story that is anecdotal - because I can't remember which gun-rag I read it in. It was on the back page where the guru's discuss their stuff. About 8 of the Board of Directors of some National annual gun function were all senior gun whizes & they were sitting around a table discussing the latest get-together. It was in the time of the discussion of which was better, the new wonder-nines, or the venerable 1911 .45's. Someone said why don't we put up on the table what we are each carrying right now. Every gun on the table was a .38 snubby.
Newton my wife and i went to Guns Plus in Surprise and had a good time, i have known Ken for a long time and has a very good repore with his class. When you or your wife go for requal go see Ken. Good for your wife and for her shooting so well My feelings are you carry what feels right to you not what some gun rag comando says is right.
My feelings are you carry what feels right to you not what some gun rag comando says is right.Sam Adams
Member
I own both a 1911 clone and a 642.
If I knew that I was going to be attacked, I'd choose...not to be in that place at that time. The first rule for surviving a gunfight is not to get in the fight.
The second rule is to bring a gun - ANY gun - to a gunfight. But carrying a big 1911 is not always practical. Believe me, being here in South Texas in the summertime, wearing a suitcoat or an untucked shirt isn't always practical. So many times I didn't take my 1911 with me - and I'm damned glad (and perhaps lucky) that I never had a need for it when it was sitting at home. Anyhow, now I have a 642 (as of 8 days ago). It goes with me practically everywhere, and will until the weather cools off and I can carry my 1911 with comfort. BTW, I carried my 1911 for the better part of 2 years, so I'm certainly not inclined against it.
5 shots of .38 +P Gold Dots will beat a thumb up your you-know-what any day. Yeah, I'd rather have 8 .45s than 5 .38 +Ps, but I'd really rather have 20 rounds of .308. Of course, carrying around the M1A might make concealment a bit more difficult, and it sure won't be very comfortable.
Bottom line: the instructor is both uninformed and an idiot.
If I knew that I was going to be attacked, I'd choose...not to be in that place at that time. The first rule for surviving a gunfight is not to get in the fight.
The second rule is to bring a gun - ANY gun - to a gunfight. But carrying a big 1911 is not always practical. Believe me, being here in South Texas in the summertime, wearing a suitcoat or an untucked shirt isn't always practical. So many times I didn't take my 1911 with me - and I'm damned glad (and perhaps lucky) that I never had a need for it when it was sitting at home. Anyhow, now I have a 642 (as of 8 days ago). It goes with me practically everywhere, and will until the weather cools off and I can carry my 1911 with comfort. BTW, I carried my 1911 for the better part of 2 years, so I'm certainly not inclined against it.
5 shots of .38 +P Gold Dots will beat a thumb up your you-know-what any day. Yeah, I'd rather have 8 .45s than 5 .38 +Ps, but I'd really rather have 20 rounds of .308. Of course, carrying around the M1A might make concealment a bit more difficult, and it sure won't be very comfortable.
Bottom line: the instructor is both uninformed and an idiot.
I carry two S&W M49's in ankle holsters (left and right), a Sig Sauer 220 on my belt along with two extra mags,a 686+ in a shoulder holster and a 32 caliber Keltec taped to my chest. Somtimes I also tape a straight razor to the back of my neck and stuff a couple switchblades into my pockets. Of course I also have a Remington 870 riot gun in my car with three reloads and an M1 Garand in my trunk, because you never know when you might need to punch through body armor or a car body.
A five shot .38 caliber J - frame by itself??? Nonsense.
A five shot .38 caliber J - frame by itself??? Nonsense.
XLMiguel
Member
Checkman - What do you smoke and where can I get some?
geekWithA.45
Moderator Emeritus
Texas got it bassackwards, if you ask me. Yeah, sure, you have to know an extra trick or so for an autoshucker, and so what.
When the chips are down, the revo's TRIGGER is a heck of a lot more challenging. If you master a revo trigger, auto triggers are easy, and that's going to have a heck of a lot more to do with the "public safety" aspect of the thing than anything else.
(Where, "Public safety" == discharged rounds hitting bad guys, rather than random innocent people milling around)
Now, as for the dim bulbs teaching the carry course, Shame on them!
Newbies are to be treasured, not foils to magnify the instructor's ego.
As for the 642, it's a perfectly good gun, and I love mine. (It's my deep concealment piece) but like any heavy triggered snubbie, it's a more challenging than many armaments, and something you MUST take to the range and practice with before taking onto the street!
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