CLASSIC EXAMPLE: Why I Don't Open Carry.

[Trunk Monkey]

I'm in favor of laws that prohibit weapons in places that serve alcohol. I've seen how men (and sometimes women) act after a few drinks

There are already laws that prohibit possesion of a firearm under the influence. Why shouldn't people who are abstaining be able to enter a bar armed?

I haven't had a drink since December of 1982, am I really a threat sitting in the bar at Texas Roadhouse eating while carrying?

 

[Good Ol' Boy]

From the point of view of someone who is new to carrying (not guns) my main reasoning for choosing to CC is the unwanted attention that may very well come with OC.

The downside is accessibility with CC. With my OC holster I can draw and be on target like a world champion compared to my CC gear. IMHO it's a small price to pay as I don't foresee myself getting into any old fashion duels at any point.

I have no problem at all with folks who want to OC though, to each their own. If I see someone who is OC if anything I feel safer and if eye contact is made they'll get a solid nod from me.

 

[PowerG]

From what I read the security guard exchanged fire with the shooter until he was nearly out of ammo then disengaged, I saw no mention of him being wounded but can't say definitively that he wasn't.

 

[PowerG]

Thanks for allowing me to make my own decisions. I've found that people that make statements such as yours say it because they don't trust themselves. They can't handle themselves around alcohol so no one else should be allowed to. There are many states that allow carrying in a place that serves alcohol. There should be stories everyday in these states about all the shootouts that occur because of it.....Pretty hard not to see my point because these incidents don't happen in these states. It amazes how many people want to impose their will on others and don't have an understanding of personal responsibility.

This.

 

[IWAC]

I do not o.c. for the very reason I stated. It is a personal choice based on my belief of what would happen to me if a shooter were intent on murder of one or many, and if I were in his vision.

As for statistics re my belief, there probably are not enough to quantify anything. I have a background in law enforcement. I base my belief on what I know about real criminals. Real criminals do not think the way you think.

Just for a mind exercise, place yourself in the role of a murderous shooter. You go to some place where you want to commit your murderous act. There is a man there who is wearing a gun. No one else has one. Whom would you shoot first?

As I said, that is my opinion. What choices other people make doesn't bother me a bit.

L.W.

Agree completely...

My personal feeling is that I want my weapon to be concealed...and not under clothing that may mark me as someone who may have a weapon.(If I am wearing my photo vest, I am sure my camera is very visible! Disinformation!
I want my carry gun to be a total surprise to anyone planning to hurt me or mine.

 

[tkroenlein]

I think the gun on his hip had a lot less to do with getting shot first than the fact he was close to the front door.


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[Dain Bramage]

Only one officer noticed Clemmons, stood and tried to draw ... very sad.

In the Lakewood incident, one officer did manage to wound Clemmons in the torso. This was a major factor in Clemmons later being found out and killed.

 

[Shaq]

Thanks for allowing me to make my own decisions. I've found that people that make statements such as yours say it because they don't trust themselves. They can't handle themselves around alcohol so no one else should be allowed to. There are many states that allow carrying in a place that serves alcohol. There should be stories everyday in these states about all the shootouts that occur because of it.....Pretty hard not to see my point because these incidents don't happen in these states. It amazes how many people want to impose their will on others and don't have an understanding of personal responsibility.

You're quite mistaken, since I don't drink.

 

[Trunk Monkey]

You're quite mistaken, since I don't drink

I notice you completely ignored the substance of his post.

Care to comment on that?

 

[shafter]

There are already laws that prohibit possesion of a firearm under the influence. Why shouldn't people who are abstaining be able to enter a bar armed?

I haven't had a drink since December of 1982, am I really a threat sitting in the bar at Texas Roadhouse eating while carrying?
__________________

I'm ok with this. Like driving, there should be a threshold. I'm not afraid of the guy who's had a beer or two, or a glass of wine and is carrying any more than I am of him driving. However, you reach a level where bad things start to happen.

 

[Shaq]

I'm ok with this. Like driving, there should be a threshold. I'm not afraid of the guy who's had a beer or two, or a glass of wine and is carrying any more than I am of him driving. However, you reach a level where bad things start to happen.

And I've seen macho jerks who don't know what that level is.

Example: http://www.upi.com/Odd_News/2016/06...started-with-a-fart-police-say/3301465913639/

If any of the participants had been carrying, there would have been gunfire & innocents would be in danger.

 

[Onmilo]

And I've seen macho jerks who don't know what that level is.

Example: http://www.upi.com/Odd_News/2016/06...started-with-a-fart-police-say/3301465913639/

If any of the participants had been carrying, there would have been gunfire & innocents would be in danger.

Cop I knew way in the way back used to tell me stories of how he and his partner would make tavern checks at each place on their beat at least twice a shift, enjoying a boilermaker at each and every establishment.
Free of charge...

 

[shafter]

And I've seen macho jerks who don't know what that level is.

Absolutely. Which is why there would have to be a set limit like driving under the influence. We allow people to go into bars with car keys in their pockets, and there really isn't anything to stop them from driving away. However, if you cross that line and get caught there are penalties. I don't know what the limit should be, but I think it's unfortunate that a responsible person who only has one drink should have to disarm.

 

[wishn4more]

Not the same

I have not read all the responses, but the Orlando shooter was intimately familiar with the club, the layout and the that there was an armed security person at the door. Of course that was target #1. He probably knew each of the regular security people by sight. He knew where they would normally be stationed (at the door). In reality, the guy was a sitting duck.
So were the patrons. One entrance, and reports that exits were locked...

Nothing in this scenario equates to the randomness of how a lawful OC'er in a normal venue would be distributed, or whether said OC'er could even be identified at the outset of a shooter entering. Possible? Yes. Probable? No.

 

[jbrown50]

CLASSIC EXAMPLE: Why I Don't Open Carry.

I prefer concealed carry because I don't want to draw attention to myself and in most cases it would be very detrimental to me. Some people don't take kindly to certain people having a gun, legally or not. That's just a fact of life. That's why concealed carry has to always be available as an option for everyone. At the same time I wholeheartedly support open carry and don't down others who are in a position to do it effectively. Both open and concealed carry have their advantages and disadvantages but at the end of the day both methods reach the same goal.

The main reason cops wear uniforms is so that they're easily identified as cops. Cops open carry so that it's much easier and quicker to access their gun in a confrontation. The gun and badge are also a symbol of authority, more of a deterrent effect than actual enforcement affect. A cop would still be identified as a cop with the uniform and badge and carrying concealed but open carry affords both easy access and the deterrent affect. There's no question about the cop's ability to use deadly force because you see it on his/her hip.

 

[jrdolall]

I can agree with the OP in that someone openly carrying a gun could possibly be the first target of an attacker.

I can also disagree strongly in that someone openly carrying a firearm could possibly deter the attacker from ever making his attack.

I think there is ample evidence that attackers tend to go after targets where they feel there will be no citizens carrying guns as virtually every public attack occurs in a gun free zone. Shootouts at homes, among gang members or family members, probably are not in gun free zones.

I very rarely OC off of my own property. Not because I can't but because I am more comfortable with CC. I have no problem with either.

 

[NormH3]

Not sure why this topic pops up on so many gun forums. Bottom line is if you are comfortable with it OC every day. If you aren't...don't. In my state to conceal carry I have to have 5 references from my county. I have to put an ad in the paper saying that I'm applying. I have to pay the fees required and then have to wait for a judge to sign off on it which may take up to 6 months. OC I can walk out the door anytime I want as long as my handgun is in it's holster.

 

[Shaq]

Absolutely. Which is why there would have to be a set limit like driving under the influence. We allow people to go into bars with car keys in their pockets, and there really isn't anything to stop them from driving away. However, if you cross that line and get caught there are penalties. I don't know what the limit should be, but I think it's unfortunate that a responsible person who only has one drink should have to disarm.

The problem is that the limit is different for each individual. And the effect of alcohol is also different for different people. Some just get sleepy, some get more mellow & some get aggressive & start fights.

 

[Red Wind]

Weight and gender are also a big factor with your BAC. I taught the Commercial Drivers License (CDL) course 3 years for my City and always emphasized those points.

 

[Warp]

People who are against open carry are not bothered by OC'ing in a desert, mountains, hiking areas or rural country-type properties where houses are far apart.

They are referring to the attention-craving yahoos who stroll through a mall or airport or down a city street, looking for confrontations with cops, with AR's slung over their shoulders or holstered handguns, trying to make a statement, enjoying the attention & anxiety they create.

God forbid somebody carry a gun while at the mall.

And those holstered handguns, for crying out loud, a holstered handgun, what are they thinking?!?

No, and I repeat, NO self respecting citizen carries a holstered handgun unless they are an on-duty uniform police officer. Anybody else is just a wanna-be Punisher vigilante hoping to blow some punk away.

 

[GEM]

I think there is ample evidence that attackers tend to go after targets where they feel there will be no citizens carrying guns as virtually every public attack occurs in a gun free zone. Shootouts at homes, among gang members or family members, probably are not in gun free zones.

Not true. It may be the case that many did occur in such but there were quite a few attacks in locales that were not gun free. Look it up before making a wide but incorrect generalization.

For one example - how about the WalMart where an armed good samaritan just got himself killed?

 

[Big7]

I did not read all the posts.
I'm in the CC camp.

Think about it this way. If YOU were the bad guy and observed
some OC'ing, WHO WOULD YOU SHOOT FIRST?

I don't want anyone to know I have a weapon until he is in my sights.
If he don't comply real fast like, last thing he will see is a muzzle flash.

 

[yugorpk]

No, and I repeat, NO self respecting citizen carries a holstered handgun unless they are an on-duty uniform police officer. Anybody else is just a wanna-be Punisher vigilante hoping to blow some punk away.

Thats the dumbest thing Ive ever read in print.

 

[EmbarkChief]

Thats the dumbest thing Ive ever read in print.

That was my exact thought as well, however I'm pretty sure he was being facetious. At least I hope so.

 

[dragon813gt]

I did not read all the posts.

I'm in the CC camp.



Think about it this way. If YOU were the bad guy and observed

some OC'ing, WHO WOULD YOU SHOOT FIRST?



I don't want anyone to know I have a weapon until he is in my sights.

If he don't comply real fast like, last thing he will see is a muzzle flash.

Well since you didn't read everything you missed many points that were brought up. The main one being a criminal seeing an armed citizen and deciding not to commit a crime. There is no one answer as to what will happen. You might as well flip a coin because the odds are 50/50.

Thats the dumbest thing Ive ever read in print.

I see your grasp of sarcasm is lacking.