Get into 10 mm?

[Dave T]

It came from the factory loaded Winchester 175g Silvertip.

Have you ever chronographed any of this or are you just repeating something you read on the internet?

Last time I ran some Silvertips through a G20 (4.6" bbl) the Oehler gave an average for 5 shots of 1167 fps. Most every factory 41 Mag load except the Remington 210g lead bullet one puts that to shame.

Dave

 

[harrygunner]

It's because of Winchester's lab-only number for 10mm muzzle speed. Winchester rates them at 1290 ft/sec without mentioning that's from a 5.5" lab barrel. The barrel probably has no rifling so that all the energy goes into translational and zero rotational.

The poster above listed numbers consistent with what everyone gets from a real gun.

 

[Gryffydd]

All three of those companies are "max loaders".

They're still factory loadings, so the point remains that the difference is not solely in "reloading".
The major ammo companies neuter a lot of the cartridges they load, the .44, .41, .357, and 10mm in particular. What they do with their loads has little to do with the capabilities of a cartridge.

 

[tango2echo]

I have had similar experience with the Win SilverTips when chronographed. Much below listed velocity.

t2e

 

[jmr40]

Another vote for the Glock 20. Perfect for your intended uses.

 

[mokin]

Unless you are into reloading go with a good size .357. I have a Glock 29 and love it. But, I feel most of the reasons for not owining a 10 mm Auto are true. Factory ammunition is hard to find, expensive, and mostly loaded to a little over a .40 S&W. Also, guys at the range have commented on the muzzle blast. On the other hand, most of the positive things said about the 10mm Auto are true as well. It is powerfull, compact, has a large magazine capacity, and if you reload, capable of handling a wide variety of loads. I've recieved comments on the accuracy on the pistol at the range too.

 

[Seven For Sure]

Yes, 16 rds. of 10mm beat 5,6,7 or 8 rds. of 357mag. 10mm does'nt need as much barrel either. Also, my 3" 686+ is the same size as my Glock 20. I admit 357mag needs a 4" barrel minimum to make it worthwhile.

 

[jmr40]

I'm a big fan of the 10mm, but it is not in the same league as the 41 mag unless you are talking about some of the watered down self defense loads made for the 41 mag. It is in reality capable of equaling the hottest 357 mag loads, but in a smaller, lighter more compact gun that is easier to shoot in my experience. At least with a Glock.

Ammo availibility is a regional issue. I am able to get 10mm locally from www.georgia-arms.com for a little less than 45ACP. If you have to order I'm not sure if shipping costs would make it worth it or not. Although it is more expensive the doubletap ammo is good stuff for serious uses.

 

[CZF]

Too many people who don't own a 10mm, or even fired one.
Tend to compare the .357 Magnum and .41 magnum against the
mighty 10.

Velocity and energy numbers don't mean much when you can
load (or buy) from Mild to Wild with the superb 10mm cartridge,
and get pretty much exactly what you want for a power level.

As a .357 Magnum owner for many years and forced to carry one
in my early days.

I think the 10mm is far beyond the .357 for power.
I've never seen any 180 gr. 357s or Buff Bore ammo for
sale in my local shops, but they do have the sweet 10mm.
(or at least the used to before OBIWAN)

I never felt well armed with a .357 for animal defense, but feel
fine with 10 or more 180 or 200 gr. 10mm rounds aboard.

I also feel that the .41 Magnum is a nice cartridge, but very costly to shoot.
Also that my .44 Maggie can match it and more if you are going to go
the revolver route.

 

[Gryffydd]

I think the 10mm is far beyond the .357 for power.

Too bad you're wrong

Velocity and energy numbers don't mean much when you can
load (or buy) from Mild to Wild with the superb 10mm cartridge,
and get pretty much exactly what you want for a power level.

Translated: "Facts and hard numbers don't mean much"
And you can't do that with the .357 or .41? I'm sorry you have poor selection where you live, but there is this Internet thing you can use to buy ammo.

 

[Dave T]

I never felt well armed with a .357 for animal defense, but feel
fine with 10 or more 180 or 200 gr. 10mm rounds aboard.

Before Obama was elected the following 357 Magnum factory loads were readily available:

CorBon - 180g Bonded Core (published velocity 1265 fps)

Federal - 180g JHP Hi Shok & 180g Lead Flat Nose Castcore

Remington - 180g Semi-JHP

Winchester - 180g Partition Gold Supreme

Then there's the Buffalo Bore and Double Tap offerings. All of the above need to be fired from a 5"-6" barrel to realize the full potential of these loadings.

The 10mm full loads with the 180g bullets compare more favorably with the above than the 41 Magnum. The semi-auto does offer greater capacity and control than any revolver.

Dave

 

[waterhouse]

Too many people who don't own a 10mm, or even fired one.
Tend to compare the .357 Magnum and .41 magnum against the
mighty 10.

I recently sold off 4 .357 revolvers and a .357 lever gun after switching to 10mm. I prefer shooting 1911s, so the switch was easy, but when you look at the numbers the "mighty 10" compares almost exactly to the .357.

Velocity and energy numbers don't mean much when you can
load (or buy) from Mild to Wild with the superb 10mm cartridge,
and get pretty much exactly what you want for a power level.

I shot a .357 for a number of years. The velocity and energy numbers do mean something, they are nearly identical to the 10mm. The .357 is also available, through both reloading and factory offerings, from Mild to Wild, to give people pretty much exactly what they want for a power level.

I think the 10mm is far beyond the .357 for power.

What do you mean by power? Are you comparing one round of 10mm to one round of .357, or are you comparing a magazine full of 10mm to 6 shots of .357?

If the former, what do you base your thinking on?

I never felt well armed with a .357 for animal defense, but feel
fine with 10 or more 180 or 200 gr. 10mm rounds aboard.

Are you saying that you would not feel well armed with 6 rounds of 10mm and that you do feel well armed with 10 or more rounds of 10mm? I'm just trying to figure out if you are comparing the capabilities of the round or the number of them that you can shoot without a reload.

 

[KBintheSLC]

Some folks on this thread really know how to put the "D" in D-bag.

 

[Gryffydd]

I recently sold off 4 .357 revolvers and a .357 lever gun after switching to 10mm.

Sorry for the small hijack here, but did you replace the .357 lever gun with a 10mm carbine of some kind? If so, what? A 10mm carbine sounds pretty awesome to me, but I haven't seen many around.

 

[waterhouse]

Sorry for the small hijack here, but did you replace the .357 lever gun with a 10mm carbine of some kind? If so, what? A 10mm carbine sounds pretty awesome to me, but I haven't seen many around.

I didn't (not for lack of looking), but I do still have a .357 carbine (it's a pump, not a lever) to burn through the rest of my .357 ammo. I'd like to completely consolidate calibers, but that pump may be hard to part with, and it shoots .38s well so I'll probably keep it to accompany the 642.

 

[Demitrios]

Man this crowd is getting hostile. We're supposed to be giving this gentleman advice as to the pros and cons of buying a 10mm or revolver, what our experiences are and maybe try and help him come to his own decision. Yet here we are arguing about whose numbers are right in terms of ballistics. To tell you the truth I own a Dan Wesson in 10mm and it's been a very pleasurable experience for me. I shoot very accurately with it and I like the fact that as a 1911 I'm afforded the option to change sights, grips, safety's(all of them), recoil spring, etc. Revolvers are nice too, there's nothing nicer than reliability when your life is on the line. All in all it's your own preference. I'd start looking by asking myself, "Is it practical? Is it comfortable? Do I like it?" in that order. Oh and by the way gentleman if you want to talk about "wildcat cartridges" or major power in a wheel gun that's a 10mm don't forget to look up the 10mm Magnum. http://www.accuratepowder.com/data/PerCaliber2Guide/Handgun/Standarddata/40Cal(10mm)/10mm%20Magnum%20pages%20124%20and%20125.pdf For the record I AM NOT SUGGESTING HE BUY THIS but I just like to pass a little info along here and there from time to time.

 

[Ben Shepherd]

What are the downsides, other than cost of ammo? Anyone have a better recommendation for a trail gun? I'm on the fence about .44 mag & .357 mag, and I'm not much of an expert on wheel guns.

The last sentence right there tells the tale. I am a wheelgun nut, and have only 2 semi-autos in the stable. So for me the choice is made.

As far as raw horsepower goes that 10mm will do 95% of anything the 357 mag can do for you with the right projectile. So given you can get 10mm in a platform you are used to, I'd go with that. Use what you know. Reverting back to how you train in an emergency is a well documented occurance. Semi-autos are your area of knowledge, go with it.

 

[Gryffydd]

Man this crowd is getting hostile. We're supposed to be giving this gentleman advice as to the pros and cons of buying a 10mm or revolver

So when people give blatantly false and misleading information to the OP we shouldn't have a little discussion about it? It's up to the OP and anyone else looking for information in the thread to look through the posts from all points of view and come to their own decision. It's up to us as posters in this thread to give the most accurate information possible. Sometimes that means addressing factual errors by other posters.

 

[Eon047]

Its all about personal preference. The 10 mm falls in power between a .357 magnum( much easier to find) and a .41 magnum. 10 mm shoots with quite the flat trajectory, and performance is very similar to a .41 magnum. In hunting, It can take down a bear,boar or deer in a short range, which isn't exactly ideal for hunting. But remember that reduced power loads are nearly the equivalent of .40 s&w, So it shines mostly when on a full load.
All in all, Expensive and hard to find, but caters very well to hand loaders.

 

[Gryffydd]

and performance is very similar to a .41 magnum.

Just curious, did you read the whole thread before posting?

 

[Ben Shepherd]

How about this for a comparison:

If I expect a 357 will do the job, then the 10mm will almost certainly do it just as well. A little bit of sectional density difference comes into play, but they(357 and 10mm) will do about the same things if needed.

The 41 mag with the right load is at a whole different level, and the 44 mag, capable of 325-300 grain payload in supersonic territory is a completely different animal than any of the other 3.

 

[Gryffydd]

The 41 mag with the right load is at a whole different level

Put another way, a hot loaded .41 Mag will outperform most commercial .44 Mag loads in the same bullet weight.

 

[jem375]

My walking around the woods gun is a Ruger Super Blackhawk in 44 mag. or a S&W model 1076 in 10MM... the 44 is loaded with Garrett's 310 gr. lead hammerheads at 1325 fps when picking berries in bear country. the 10MM is loaded with Double Tap ammo which is the best available for the 10MM and also some other calibers.... The 10MM is ok, but I sure do like the 44 in heavy bullets for nasty critters..........

 

[Ben Shepherd]

Put another way, a hot loaded .41 Mag will outperform most commercial .44 Mag loads in the same bullet weight.

Generally true due to the better sectional density and ballistic coefficient numbers of the slightly smaller and longer slug. The 41 will usually "go deeper" in this case.

Back to the original subject now we've all hammered ballistics and energy numbers-

I still reccomend the 10mm semi-auto to our OP as an adequate choice anywhere in the lower 48. Plenty of punch, plenty of rounds on tap, in a platform he(not me, and not you) has proficiecy with. The responsible choice is obvious.

 

[sneedb82]

I'm going to try the 10mm out... I like it in the 1911 format (although I don't own a 1911), but will have a glock 29 this weekend .... little small I'm sure, but if I have that as a bug, with a full frame 10mm shooting good size projectiles, I can subdue the "animal" on the trail.

I don't live on trails, and my idea of backup for animals (when I don't have a shotgun or rifle handy) will need to kill the animal with one or two shots... no more or else I'm hurt!