Glock 23 KaBoom w/Wolf ammo

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don,
Shooting industry is just quoting percentages from the factory.

Glock, along with a couple of other companies played a game that if an individual officer purchased one of their guns, they called that agency their's, and included it in their total percentage of the market.

Years ago, I saw a list that had my former agency listed as a Glock agency. At the time, Glock wasn't allowed on or off duty. But several guys had taken advantage of cheap prices on police letterhead deals to add a Glock to their personal collection, (or to resell at a profit......). So, we were a "Glock agency".... not....

Glock has a large percentage of the police market.

70%?

Bullsh*t......
 
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I have no idea what you think you've demonstrated, Don… other than you can't even cut 'n' paste reliably, #1, and, #2, a lack of familiarity with the common 'Netiquette practice of "excerpt and link" rather than Theft of Intellectual Property.

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don,

You can stop posting agencies that use Glock. We get it. There are lots of them. But there are lot's that don't. How about the Highway Patrols/State Police of the Southwest? California, Arizona, Nevada, Texas? None of them are Glock users.

Why don't you start doing internet seaches on other gun models? Might keep you from looking so silly.....

BTW,
Your post mentioned Glock's strategy of trading straight across, new guns for the department's old guns, including old revolvers. Before you use police agency's choice as a yardstick of quality, you might ask yourself if you can get that same deal.......

And I don't drive a Crown Vic either...... :)
 
They dont TRADE STRAIGHT OUT,lol but nice try anyway

When I hear about the occasional Glock blowing up or someone experiencing an accidental discharge, I need to hear the complete story. Was the pistol analyzed after the accident? Was the pistol being maintained properly before the accident? Was the factory ammo lot number checked? Was the reloaded ammo checked? Were one or more of the four cartridge components defective? Did the owner follow the simple safety rules? Can the owner even recite the simple safety rules? What did the ammo company say? What did Glock say? You rarely seem to hear the whole story!

The bottom line is that there are a heck of a lot of Glocks out there with millions of rounds pouring through them. And yes, some Glocks have blown (we all agree on that), just as have several other well known brands. Yet, with all this finger pointing, NO "person" or "company" has ever been able to undeniably prove that there is an engineering defect in the current Glock design. Why is that? Why is it that I could perform the above mentioned extreme, abusive tests without having any problems whatsoever with my Glock 31? :)

If you visit www.ammolab.com (be sure to read their main page and copyright info), you'll see some excellent testing reports of the 357 Sig and others. One chart shows the results of an overcharged 147 grain bullet fired from a Glock 32 (4" barrel). The Glock held together fine although the recoil and blast were quite severe. The bullet was clocked over 1800 fps, rupturing the case. Folks, this was over 600 fps faster than a typical maximum 147 grain load is capable of. It penetrated 18.5" and the bullet was an exploded fragment of only 34.7 grains. Obviously this round was far, far beyond the 40,000 psi maximum, yet the Glock 32 was unscathed. I believe this is yet another example of how tough Glocks really are.

I KNOW THIS IS A 357 sig he is doing one on the 40 will post as sonn as the results are here.
I"M SURE HE DID MORE TESTING ON THE GLOCKS THAN DEANNN DID
 
because he didn't ask Dean the expert thats why....lmao
thank goodness I went to a Alabama school and not the one Dean and Elmer went to
 
They dont TRADE STRAIGHT OUT,lol but nice try anyway

William Casey, deputy superintendent of the Bureau of Administrative Services for the Boston Police Department, says that thousands of guns belonging to uniformed Boston cops and detectives were swapped one-for-one for new guns.

Now you're arguing with your own posts!

Glock did lots of one for one swaps. In fairness, so did some of the others, but no where near the same number of times. It helps when your cost on the gun is less than anyone elses.

That's the beauty of the internet. You can have strong opinions about subjects you have no knowledge of.......
 
Pardon the intrusion, gentlemen, but I've never been included in a locked-thread before and didn't want to miss out on a sure thing. Please continue, and thanks for the delightful tit for tat.

All the best

Gunny
 
If you visit www.ammolab.com (be sure to read their main page and copyright info), you'll see some excellent testing reports of the 357 Sig and others. One chart shows the results of an overcharged 147 grain bullet fired from a Glock 32 (4" barrel). The Glock held together fine although the recoil and blast were quite severe. The bullet was clocked over 1800 fps, rupturing the case. Folks, this was over 600 fps faster than a typical maximum 147 grain load is capable of. It penetrated 18.5" and the bullet was an exploded fragment of only 34.7 grains. Obviously this round was far, far beyond the 40,000 psi maximum, yet the Glock 32 was unscathed. I believe this is yet another example of how tough Glocks really are.

This is a good post, don. It helps make the point that simply overpressured ammo shouldn't blow a Glock up like a hand grenade.
 
Pardon the intrusion, gentlemen, but I've never been included in a locked-thread before and didn't want to miss out on a sure thing. Please continue, and thanks for the delightful tit for tat.

All the best

Gunny

:D :D :D :D :D

Priceless, Gunny.....
 
Elmer, be it random chance or kismet, as soon as this thread became hot and heavy, the Glock Talk website itself Kb'd, which led me back here to see if anyone was taking credit for sending them an obviously remanufactured message made entirely of lead in a poorly cared-for email.

All the best

gunny
 
And don, I didn't go to school with Dean.

I'm much, much, younger than he is....... :p


:D
 
Elmer, be it random chance or kismet, as soon as this thread became hot and heavy, the Glock Talk website itself Kb'd, which led me back here to see if anyone was taking credit for sending them an obviously remanufactured message made entirely of lead in a poorly cared-for email.

All the best

gunny

Maybe their server has some kind of hidden structural problem.....

Nah... it's just that they have 70% of the internet traffic.....

Bound to have more server problems with that much traffic...
 
Hello folks, when I originally posted this topic, I knew it might set off some controversy. I appologize for the ill will that has ensued. I found the incident interesting enough to post about (sorry about the picture timing). It also gave me a chance to opine on the wisdom of Glock running a "high pressure" round with relatively less "meat" supporting it (compared to my G-17). My opinion (simple observation) has long been that a gun should be a bit more robust. That is, the design should be able to resist failing due to changes in it's environment( eg. somewhat higher pressures than it's "rating"). Guns are not immune to the compromises of engineering. I am also of the opinion that an expensive gun should be fed high quality ammo, and after using a few boxes of Wolf I don't care for it's quality. I, too have observed the criticism of tools being taken personally and pity those individuals connecting their self-image to the tools. The combination of G-23 and Wolf ammo was, even though possibly isolated, very telling of Glock's supposed "perfection" to me in the .40 S&W arena. Glock's attitude is one I've observed before, "they are right, even when they are wrong". These are all my opinions. I shoot and buy guns, just not .40 S&W's. My Glock manual states that only "high quality" factory ammunition, in "excellent condition" be used. Glock has never provided objective information on which ammo meets their standards (and I haven't seen any other company do much of this, either). "Quality" is often a gray area, open to subjective judgement. Many people subjectively judge Wolf to be "high quality", I also subjectively, judge it to be of "poor quality" and wonder why people will spend good money on a gun and feed it "junk". Glock, in my manual, states that they cannot verify the pressures of reloaded ammo, and so do not want it used in their guns. From their standpoint, I agree. Car companies specify the standards of the fuel used in those tools, too, and test with everything available that meets those standards, and some that are sub-par. Does Glock test most available ammo in their guns?? I would like to think they do and belive it is their duty to define their design's limits. I understand that any gun can fail on any day, with any given ammo. I just like to think or trust that gun makers "know what they are doing". They have more capability of testing their products objectively than I do. When I chamber a round, I like to have confidence that the gun will work properly. I simply don't trust 9mm size guns chambered in .40 S&W, overblown hullabaloo or not. Just my opinions on a public forum. Thanks again, Dean for offering your insights and observations on a subject you know more about than I do. The rest of you, thanks for reading this long winded post, and sorry for the "stirring up".
Josh
 
Yes he is considered to be some sort of expert in the field of pistols blowing up?

And if you are really trying to understand this subject you had best hear his opinion no matter if you agree with it or not.

I'm waiting to hear Dean's and other's opinions but so far I've read very little in this tread other than people contradicting others that was worth much.
 
Detroit put out word that the inventory was for sale, and then accepted the highest bid, from a private gun dealership in northern Vermont. Then, with that money, Detroit purchased its new weapons from Glock
so your saying that every Department traded their old guns for new ones one for one, wanna put your money where your mouth is?
well I've got better things to do than to sit here and argue with a bunch of Glock haters...I think I'll go to the range and shoot my Glock, I'll keep my fingers crossed that it don't KB...lol, if you don't hear back from me, you'll know why. And ANY gun can KB from a over charge, your an idiot if you think different.
 
I for one, don't have any problems with the shots taken at me. I'm a big boy.

What this thread did do, was put some opinions out there that aren't on most of the boards. THR attracts some very interesting and experienced people. I learn something every time I tune in. If I wanted to just read gun writers biased opinions, I'd subscribe to them. I don't....

Good information is worth a little heat.....
 
so your saying that every Department traded their old guns for new ones one for one, wanna put your money where your mouth is?

Never said that, and he knows it.

When they don't have a good argument for what you say, they put words in your mouth.

Make sure you have your hockey mask on don...
 
Well, since we're picking nits...

:rolleyes:
don10m post#114 said:
70% of police departments use them,
don10m post#148 said:
More recently, reports indicated that 70 percent or more of new police handguns sold in his country are Glocks.
There's quite a ginormous difference between 70% sold new and 70% used.

If I started a hamburger company and sold 90% of all hamburgers in the US this year I would still only have sold less than 1% of what McDonalds has sold. I would also be lying if I said that 90% of America was eating my Hamburgers.
And as Fatburger is oft to say, "You know 32 billion sold is a lot different than 32 billion enjoyed."
dom10m post#155 said:
thank goodness I went to a Alabama school and not the one Dean and Elmer went to
Your lack of understanding of when to use capitalization and punctuation. The use of the word your when you mean you're. And, of course, that you went to AN Alabama school and not "A Alabama school" only seems to reinforce their points.
don10m post#149 said:
Now who got called on what...dig it deeper
C'mon Sparkey, fess up, you're using a Glock E-tool to dig that hole ain't ya?
 
Well I made it back, I bet Dean and Elmer are really glad to hear that, but I had a problem with my glock, I couldn' hit the target, no problems with my brand new Sig 220 ST except 8 jams out of 200 rounds, nor did I have a problem with my Carbon 15, but I think we figured it out, seems every time I would squeeze the trigger I would flinch(afraid the gun would KB) so I guess that would explain it.
 
so you never answered my question, do you think unsupported cases or fire out of battery would cause the barrel or chamber to explode as in alot of Glocks that have been posted on the internet?
 
L.A. police to get slicker, lighter guns

Wednesday, August 27, 2003


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(08-27) 03:16 PDT LOS ANGELES (AP) --

Police here will soon be able to carry a lighter and slicker weapon -- the Glock pistol.

The Board of Police Commissioners on Tuesday approved the new weapons, which are already used in some specialized divisions.

"Quite frankly, it's just a much better weapon," than the standard-issue Beretta 9 mm, said Chief William Bratton during a hearing before the five-member civilian panel that oversees department policy.

About 70 percent of U.S. law enforcement agencies use Glocks, including the FBI and the U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration.

Bratton, who headed the New York Police Department when it switched to Glocks in the 1990s, said the Beretta gun gave him blisters during his academy training in Los Angeles.

The $500 Glock has less recoil than guns currently used by officers. It also has a larger magazine capacity, a simpler construction and a more ergonomic design that allows officers with small hands to easily grip the gun, according to the Los Angeles Police Department.

The guns can take 9 mm, .40 caliber and .45 caliber ammunition.

The pistols are easier to use, but it's more difficult to trace the bullets fired from Glocks than other guns. Some departments have used a modified barrel in an effort to mark the bullets, but LAPD officials say that system is still untested.
 
We're the first major police department to transition to the 1911 in 50 years," said Sgt. Mark Jenkins, the department's range master and an instrumental player in the selection of the new guns.

The department saw the 1911-style handgun as a lost treasure, ignored by other law enforcement agencies because of its "old-fashioned" image, Jenkins said.

"We found that what had been around for a long time was better," he said. "We are taking a huge step forward into the past."

In addition to the Kimber 1911, officers can choose a Glock, which more than half of the state's law enforcement agencies already use as their firearm.
 
I don't know what exact percentage of LE agencies use Glocks, but I've seen Todd Green who was once the Director of Beretta LE Sales claim on the web (within the last year or so) that Glock has something like 2/3rds of the LE market. I can't imagine what Beretta would have to gain by inflating Glock's share of the LE market. Unfortunately, Mr. Green now works for SIG and I can't find the link for this comment any more.
 
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