I'd like to ask for a ceasefire on the cop/anti-cop stuff.
- Thread starter Warren
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ojibweindian
Member
I've never been arrested, and I've never done anything questionable to warrant investigation by the police, or be considered a suspect in an investigation.
I have called the police on occasion to report things, i.e. witnessing break-ins and assaults. That said, I always, when talking to the police, keep it short and sweet; just the facts and nothing more.
Let's face it, there is an adversarial relationship between the police and the rest of society. Maybe it wasn't always that way, but it is now. My advice to anyone, in any dealings with the police, is to keep your statements, etc, VERY short and specific, lest you screw yourself.
I have called the police on occasion to report things, i.e. witnessing break-ins and assaults. That said, I always, when talking to the police, keep it short and sweet; just the facts and nothing more.
Let's face it, there is an adversarial relationship between the police and the rest of society. Maybe it wasn't always that way, but it is now. My advice to anyone, in any dealings with the police, is to keep your statements, etc, VERY short and specific, lest you screw yourself.
The pro-LEO and anti-LEO discussions serve a legitimate purpose. The "Replies" and "Views" statistics for these particular threads are testament to their continuing utility and popularity. I see no practical need in pleading for reduced activity here.
How can we, in good conscience, walk away from this or this?
The Legal and Political category, which is where many LEO threads exist, remains the appropriate forum for the aforementioned subject matter.
TM
As someone who has friends, family in law enforcement I must tell you I
have seen a big change in officers past 15 years and I am concerned
with what I see, less common sense, more of a desire to carry out orders
without any thought as to if right or wrong, a them vs us thinking.
Our society has changed and for sure in many ways not for the best
it only stands to reason our law enforcement will follow.
have seen a big change in officers past 15 years and I am concerned
with what I see, less common sense, more of a desire to carry out orders
without any thought as to if right or wrong, a them vs us thinking.
Our society has changed and for sure in many ways not for the best
it only stands to reason our law enforcement will follow.
Aguila Blanca
Member
That's fairly common. What's the alternative -- take up space in academy classes with people who have NOT been hired as officers, and may never be? In my state officers are hired first by a town or city, then assigned to the first vacancy at the state-run academy. That vacancy may not be for several months after the initial hiring.
The state even has this system for fire marshals, who (in my state) aren't LEOs. A person must be hired or appointed by a municipality as a fire marshal BEFORE he/she is eligible to take the certification class conducted by the state.
RealGun
Member
I agree with Here2Learn. The subject of LEOs is not the problem. The problem is piling on when someone let's it be known that they are an LEO. It is uncivil to treat them like aliens to The High Road and present a meat grinder to anything they might have to offer. Those contentious posts are from people who are anti-establishment, everything sucks, glass-half-empty, etc. If a discussion occurs without a known LEO being on "the hot seat", then I think it's appropriate.
Establishing a special folder is just an excuse to behave badly. It wouldn't be "the High Road", although I'm sure some would consider it fine sport and engaging. Actually it would be trash and certainly no source of pride in association. Sure, I could avoid such a folder, but I wouldn't endorse the list sponsoring that folder. Why encourage "the low road", allowing outsiders to review and exploit what jerks ("gun nuts") some of us may be?
Establishing a special folder is just an excuse to behave badly. It wouldn't be "the High Road", although I'm sure some would consider it fine sport and engaging. Actually it would be trash and certainly no source of pride in association. Sure, I could avoid such a folder, but I wouldn't endorse the list sponsoring that folder. Why encourage "the low road", allowing outsiders to review and exploit what jerks ("gun nuts") some of us may be?
Circling the wagons
It is less a matter of circling the wagons, and more a matter of having practical experience in the field. Most of the cops on this board will be the among the first to wash their hands of an officer who acted maliciously and abused his power. The problem is that all of the cops on this board have been to scenes where they know what happened, and then read the news reports and suffered through the media appraisal afterwards, or went to a a run where they were not rude and then had the rudeness complaint come in, or been in a situation where they did what needed to be done, by the book, the right way, and then had people who don't know what was going on start bloviating about how wrong they were, and I daresay that the vast majority of us have been sued in what would in a just world be referred to as a frivolous lawsuit.
Can cops screw up and do wrong? You damn betcha. The problem is that in the vast majority of the cases heard on THR we don't have the facts, or we have the opinion of one of the involved parties (or, someone who had it happen to "his friend"). Someone then starts posting things like "Outrageous!" and "JBTs!" and "Pigs!", in which they took the incomplete set of facts and leapt to the conclusion they like...and when the cops say "well, hey, lets think about this for a second" it is just the thin blue line circling the wagons.
Fact of the matter is that the vast majority of the time the cops do the right thing, and having done the right thing they still get bad press and bad lip service, so none of the cops on this board are particularly impressed by a news report in which some journalism graduate from LeastCommonDenominator State University has decided that they have screwed up. Or, take one of my lawsuits (which I cannot discuss here)- if the plaintiff were to show up here and post his "experience" with law enforcement, we would doubtless be up in arms about "what happened"...which I know to be pure BS. So when we see other cops accused of the same sorts of things, we know that it is probably pure BS, too.
I agree that these threads have a potential to enlighten. Lets face it, law enforcement is a pretty complex job, and officers do the things they do for reasons that are not always readily apparent to an onlooker. Some will always be quick to assume that they are doing the wrong thing, but most of the time there is a far less malicious reason behind their activities. Cops know this. I can't tell you how many times I've had discussions with officers from other agencies and swap stories, and we've punctuated our tales with "well, yeah, then the media go ahold of that" or "then, of course, the complaint came in" and everyone just sighed and nodded. Been there, done that, went to Internal Affairs.
If cops do one thing consistently poorly, I think it is taking the time to explain why they do what they do. Sometimes you just can't, other times the citizens won't listen, but when you can and your audience is willing to listen, cops should take a moment to explain why something was done. I've seen that head of numerous complaints, and, more importantly, left people who would otherwise be angry with a feeling that they've been treated properly.
Mike
It is less a matter of circling the wagons, and more a matter of having practical experience in the field. Most of the cops on this board will be the among the first to wash their hands of an officer who acted maliciously and abused his power. The problem is that all of the cops on this board have been to scenes where they know what happened, and then read the news reports and suffered through the media appraisal afterwards, or went to a a run where they were not rude and then had the rudeness complaint come in, or been in a situation where they did what needed to be done, by the book, the right way, and then had people who don't know what was going on start bloviating about how wrong they were, and I daresay that the vast majority of us have been sued in what would in a just world be referred to as a frivolous lawsuit.
Can cops screw up and do wrong? You damn betcha. The problem is that in the vast majority of the cases heard on THR we don't have the facts, or we have the opinion of one of the involved parties (or, someone who had it happen to "his friend"). Someone then starts posting things like "Outrageous!" and "JBTs!" and "Pigs!", in which they took the incomplete set of facts and leapt to the conclusion they like...and when the cops say "well, hey, lets think about this for a second" it is just the thin blue line circling the wagons.
Fact of the matter is that the vast majority of the time the cops do the right thing, and having done the right thing they still get bad press and bad lip service, so none of the cops on this board are particularly impressed by a news report in which some journalism graduate from LeastCommonDenominator State University has decided that they have screwed up. Or, take one of my lawsuits (which I cannot discuss here)- if the plaintiff were to show up here and post his "experience" with law enforcement, we would doubtless be up in arms about "what happened"...which I know to be pure BS. So when we see other cops accused of the same sorts of things, we know that it is probably pure BS, too.
I agree that these threads have a potential to enlighten. Lets face it, law enforcement is a pretty complex job, and officers do the things they do for reasons that are not always readily apparent to an onlooker. Some will always be quick to assume that they are doing the wrong thing, but most of the time there is a far less malicious reason behind their activities. Cops know this. I can't tell you how many times I've had discussions with officers from other agencies and swap stories, and we've punctuated our tales with "well, yeah, then the media go ahold of that" or "then, of course, the complaint came in" and everyone just sighed and nodded. Been there, done that, went to Internal Affairs.
If cops do one thing consistently poorly, I think it is taking the time to explain why they do what they do. Sometimes you just can't, other times the citizens won't listen, but when you can and your audience is willing to listen, cops should take a moment to explain why something was done. I've seen that head of numerous complaints, and, more importantly, left people who would otherwise be angry with a feeling that they've been treated properly.
Mike
CannibalCrowley
Member
Hawkmoon
So you're telling me that it's common for people to be allowed to attend a police academy and be hired, even after they fail a psychological evaluation? That explains an awful lot.
Edward429451
member
I agree with Geek with a 45. Some things need to be addressed.
While some cops will debate rationally, there are those (seemingly mostly feds) that hold themselves above us regardless and radiate the God complex. Not even giving consideration to the peoples words and thought process. Not being able to think outside the box. Probably due to their training & indoctrination for this brave new world (order).
In my mind these guys need to be addressed, sometimes vehemently (sp?) lest the fence sitters come here & read and get the impression that us Americans will back down from the administrations BS.
Some cops show a modicum of respect for the people and show indications of reasonability, which is encouraging and enlightening, even if I disagree with certain points they make. I respect these guys. Brownie & Coronoch are two prime examples. These guys have a different perspective due to their profession but still exhibit an ability to think for themselves (at times
). They represent their professions well and act like they still have some heart & intelligence. I realize its a fine line they walk getting on the web professionally and wading through all the flak, yet they continue to hang in there and be as reasonable as they can, all things considered. It's a two way street and we cant expect to win them over overnight. The debate & mutual enlightenment continues.
The other guys...How can you take the high road with "I-Robot" guys who flex the God complex and tell you to leave your own country? Can't. Shouldn't. Why should us so called anti-LEO's back down from such tripe? That would send the wrong message to them and accellerate the destruction of our great country. So in conclusion, I think we need the threads. Besides, where else can we vent? Not on the street, we'd lose the element of suprise.
Declaring a truce with rogue cops is like declaring a truce with a rapist and letting them have their way. Bad tactics. Or so it seems to me.
While some cops will debate rationally, there are those (seemingly mostly feds) that hold themselves above us regardless and radiate the God complex. Not even giving consideration to the peoples words and thought process. Not being able to think outside the box. Probably due to their training & indoctrination for this brave new world (order).
In my mind these guys need to be addressed, sometimes vehemently (sp?) lest the fence sitters come here & read and get the impression that us Americans will back down from the administrations BS.
Some cops show a modicum of respect for the people and show indications of reasonability, which is encouraging and enlightening, even if I disagree with certain points they make. I respect these guys. Brownie & Coronoch are two prime examples. These guys have a different perspective due to their profession but still exhibit an ability to think for themselves (at times
). They represent their professions well and act like they still have some heart & intelligence. I realize its a fine line they walk getting on the web professionally and wading through all the flak, yet they continue to hang in there and be as reasonable as they can, all things considered. It's a two way street and we cant expect to win them over overnight. The debate & mutual enlightenment continues.The other guys...How can you take the high road with "I-Robot" guys who flex the God complex and tell you to leave your own country? Can't. Shouldn't. Why should us so called anti-LEO's back down from such tripe? That would send the wrong message to them and accellerate the destruction of our great country. So in conclusion, I think we need the threads. Besides, where else can we vent? Not on the street, we'd lose the element of suprise.
Declaring a truce with rogue cops is like declaring a truce with a rapist and letting them have their way. Bad tactics. Or so it seems to me.
Funny how this quickly turned into a cop bashing thread:
Post 5:"I think it fair game to post an account (true or fictitious) of police violating rights and have the LEOs comment on the story.
More often than not, the thin blue line will circle the wagons and we peons get a chance to learn something:
You can trust 9 out of 10 cops, but that 10th one will burn you into a state of massive regret for "having nothing to hide."
Post 7: "Okay, okay.
You can trust seven out of ten cops. But the last three...
Hooo boy."
Post 11: "I thought departments weed out mental disorders like Napoleon Complex during the hiring process."
Post 12: "Obviously I bet you could outshoot his ass any day too!"
Post 13: "The obvious power trip thing."
Post 18: "Unfortunately, the police now have the power to utterly destory your life, they can do it casually, without fear of retribution."
. . . hits keep on coming.
No defense of cops at all until 1911Tuner (who is not a cop), explained what has been true of rookies for centuries, in post 17. Unfortunately, people will twist that anecdote, and say the new training, the new doctrine, the young cops all have an "us v. them" attitude. The truth is the training is geared toward protecting rights, and trying to keep EVERYONE safe, including suspects and fugitive felons.
CEShooter said something very wise:
"I seem to remember a lot of gun owners justifiably upset because all the bad gun news makes the headlines and the good gun news never sees the light of day. Boy I sure am glad a couple of people don't give the LEO community a bad name like the media gives guns a bad name with only reporting 99% of the bad and 1% of the good. How some of us can scream about being judged by a few of our poorest examples but have no qualms about returnging the favor to others."
There is a lot of blatant cop hatred right here on the THR, which is why the LEOs on board are quick to "circle the wagons."
Anyone remember this gem?
Post 5:"I think it fair game to post an account (true or fictitious) of police violating rights and have the LEOs comment on the story.
More often than not, the thin blue line will circle the wagons and we peons get a chance to learn something:
You can trust 9 out of 10 cops, but that 10th one will burn you into a state of massive regret for "having nothing to hide."
Post 7: "Okay, okay.
You can trust seven out of ten cops. But the last three...
Hooo boy."
Post 11: "I thought departments weed out mental disorders like Napoleon Complex during the hiring process."
Post 12: "Obviously I bet you could outshoot his ass any day too!"
Post 13: "The obvious power trip thing."
Post 18: "Unfortunately, the police now have the power to utterly destory your life, they can do it casually, without fear of retribution."
. . . hits keep on coming.
No defense of cops at all until 1911Tuner (who is not a cop), explained what has been true of rookies for centuries, in post 17. Unfortunately, people will twist that anecdote, and say the new training, the new doctrine, the young cops all have an "us v. them" attitude. The truth is the training is geared toward protecting rights, and trying to keep EVERYONE safe, including suspects and fugitive felons.
CEShooter said something very wise:
"I seem to remember a lot of gun owners justifiably upset because all the bad gun news makes the headlines and the good gun news never sees the light of day. Boy I sure am glad a couple of people don't give the LEO community a bad name like the media gives guns a bad name with only reporting 99% of the bad and 1% of the good. How some of us can scream about being judged by a few of our poorest examples but have no qualms about returnging the favor to others."
There is a lot of blatant cop hatred right here on the THR, which is why the LEOs on board are quick to "circle the wagons."
Anyone remember this gem?
DRZinn
Member
MUSTACHES! That's the key! I've dealt with cops in a variety of situations, and the bad ones all had MUSTACHES!!!!
Sven
Senior Member
This thread proves its own point.
(sigh)
Isn't there another forum where you can all go and vent about this?
(sigh)
Isn't there another forum where you can all go and vent about this?
FWIW, I have all the respect in the world for individual men and women whose job it is to work in various police forces across the country facing incredible stress, long hours, life-threatening situations, mind-numbing boredom, insane stress to their own psyches and that of their families and relations, all for -- like as not -- absurdly low wages.
By the same token, I have anywhere from scant respect to downright contempt and anger for thugs of any description, and all the more so if they are government licensed, trained, and rewarded for being thugs.
I do not rejoice when one of the former meets an untimely end; in fact, just the opposite.
I am not sorry when one of the latter meets an untimely end; in fact, just the opposite.
A "pig" is not the guy who gave me a ticket when I was, in fact, speeding; even a cop who tickets me in an obvious speed trap is not a pig. A pig is not an officer who tells me to sit down and shut up while investigating a crime because there are simply too many people trying to talk to her all at once. The DEA agent my girlfriend talked to in the course of doing research on tactical entry for a novel she's writing, was not a pig, nor was the DC Police detective she also interviewed for the same book.
A pig is someone who feels that because he is a cop, he is somehow better than the rest of us "little people," that he is above the law, or that he IS the law. A pig is someone who feels that it's ok if she stomps a kitten to death in front of the owner's eyes. A pig is someone who beats up a suspect in an interrogation room or rapes him with a nightstick. A pig is someone who votes to make it unlawful for citizens to own firearms, but carries one herself. And a pig is someone who passes more and more laws designed to restrict individual freedom, incarcerate citizens for victimless crimes, and thwart or nullify the Bill of Rights.
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By the same token, I have anywhere from scant respect to downright contempt and anger for thugs of any description, and all the more so if they are government licensed, trained, and rewarded for being thugs.
I do not rejoice when one of the former meets an untimely end; in fact, just the opposite.
I am not sorry when one of the latter meets an untimely end; in fact, just the opposite.
A "pig" is not the guy who gave me a ticket when I was, in fact, speeding; even a cop who tickets me in an obvious speed trap is not a pig. A pig is not an officer who tells me to sit down and shut up while investigating a crime because there are simply too many people trying to talk to her all at once. The DEA agent my girlfriend talked to in the course of doing research on tactical entry for a novel she's writing, was not a pig, nor was the DC Police detective she also interviewed for the same book.
A pig is someone who feels that because he is a cop, he is somehow better than the rest of us "little people," that he is above the law, or that he IS the law. A pig is someone who feels that it's ok if she stomps a kitten to death in front of the owner's eyes. A pig is someone who beats up a suspect in an interrogation room or rapes him with a nightstick. A pig is someone who votes to make it unlawful for citizens to own firearms, but carries one herself. And a pig is someone who passes more and more laws designed to restrict individual freedom, incarcerate citizens for victimless crimes, and thwart or nullify the Bill of Rights.
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Carlos
Member
Agreed. I want all you to know I'm not really into cop bashing, but will (to the death) stand up for myself. I'll not back down when some God-wannabe tells me that he's arrested people with more credibility than I. That's BS. I've been working in the legal system for over 20 years. I don't have a record. I try and keep my nose clean. I don't speed. I show courtesy for my fellow drivers. I'm a Military Veteran.
I don't need the BS like the other night.
LEO's know this: I will continue to be a good citizen and cooperate with police, but drawn the line with looked down upon as a perp.
Enough said. Like I said earlier, I have two LEOs in the family. I have shooting buddies who are cops and I always meet new cops either on the street or the range.
It's that few (and you know who you are) who cause problems.
spacemanspiff
Senior Member
any profession will have decent hardworking individuals filling the shoes, as well as a few black sheep.
while it doesnt bother me to learn about the experiences of those who have encountered those black sheep of the LE world, it is horribly disruptive to our cause for every LEO story to turn into threads filled with statements of "i hate all cops!" or "i laugh when cops get killed!"
our cause is geared towards helping those not in the gun culture realize we are sane, rational people who merely have different hobbies.
and we are supposed to be taking the high road, not stooping to the level of the relatively few JBTs.
while it doesnt bother me to learn about the experiences of those who have encountered those black sheep of the LE world, it is horribly disruptive to our cause for every LEO story to turn into threads filled with statements of "i hate all cops!" or "i laugh when cops get killed!"
our cause is geared towards helping those not in the gun culture realize we are sane, rational people who merely have different hobbies.
and we are supposed to be taking the high road, not stooping to the level of the relatively few JBTs.
Coronach,
Well said, thanks.
I did my turn thru IA and OPR, from both sides. Attitudes here are why I wish we had compulsory police service. Wow. We could use a THR Civilian Police Academy, but I guess no one would attend because of the title.
Sidebar - I think a "separate" forum is a bad idea - if you wont say it loud and proud in the glare of the spotlight, dont say it at all.
Well said, thanks.
I did my turn thru IA and OPR, from both sides. Attitudes here are why I wish we had compulsory police service. Wow. We could use a THR Civilian Police Academy, but I guess no one would attend because of the title.
Sidebar - I think a "separate" forum is a bad idea - if you wont say it loud and proud in the glare of the spotlight, dont say it at all.
Penforhire
Member
To the original post, we can't stop discussing LEO's, pro and con, if the subject matter contains LEO's. You want to avoid most of the LEO discussions? Stick to the gun forums (Handgun, Revolver, Rifles, ...).
I don't appreciate emotional bashing or personal attacks from either side but rational discussion between dissenting adults should be fine right? If you don't ever want to hear a bad thing said about LEO's then put some ear plugs in (and where exactly in Mayberry do you live?...).
I hold LEO's to a higher standard. They are not just like checkout clerks at a convenience store. They have the power to change my life for better or worse. You choose that job, you need to be 'better' than the next guy.
I don't appreciate emotional bashing or personal attacks from either side but rational discussion between dissenting adults should be fine right? If you don't ever want to hear a bad thing said about LEO's then put some ear plugs in (and where exactly in Mayberry do you live?...).
I hold LEO's to a higher standard. They are not just like checkout clerks at a convenience store. They have the power to change my life for better or worse. You choose that job, you need to be 'better' than the next guy.
sm
member
Coronach -
Great Post!
In any business/profession we have good representatives and bad ones. In any profession/business, we have many Legal/Political matters to be concerned with - May I suggest folks Vote, get involved with the L&P, educate and be informed? Both sides have so much L&P affecting them it is hard to do one's role, no matter what the profession/business is.
The way I see it , Both sides have Gummit Meddlin' that affects the role's one is to be. So perhaps a little more involvment to change the Gummit Meddlin' would make life easier for all parties involved.
Respect is earned, makes no nevermind what the profession / business is.
Yep, I have helped the LEO community, and I have been tossed in a cell, they do that when you drive drunk. I have also been the receipient of a Rude business person and LEO. I was polite, respectful and contacted the Superior of that person.
It is amazing how some folks take care of matters in house. It is also amazing how when you walk a day in a person's shoes, one better understands and can better vote the L&P stuff needed.
Some folks do not need to be in the business or profession they are in. Be it LEO, a Doctor, a Lawyer, or flipping burgers...
A little more action to change, a little more involvement to change perhaps. A little less complacency in the voting booth,or not getting the whole picture.
I competed in skeet for years, many of these folks are total numbnuts when it comes to L&P. Rude to new folks, bashing, talking down to them. If you don't shoot skeet, you are the scum of the earth. I don't shoot or communicate with many of these folks anymore. I did say my piece, do my L&P by example and help the new folks out. Do some of "my kind" Vote, get involved...heck no...they won't come for the skeet guns.
Great Post!
In any business/profession we have good representatives and bad ones. In any profession/business, we have many Legal/Political matters to be concerned with - May I suggest folks Vote, get involved with the L&P, educate and be informed? Both sides have so much L&P affecting them it is hard to do one's role, no matter what the profession/business is.
The way I see it , Both sides have Gummit Meddlin' that affects the role's one is to be. So perhaps a little more involvment to change the Gummit Meddlin' would make life easier for all parties involved.
Respect is earned, makes no nevermind what the profession / business is.
Yep, I have helped the LEO community, and I have been tossed in a cell, they do that when you drive drunk. I have also been the receipient of a Rude business person and LEO. I was polite, respectful and contacted the Superior of that person.
It is amazing how some folks take care of matters in house. It is also amazing how when you walk a day in a person's shoes, one better understands and can better vote the L&P stuff needed.
Some folks do not need to be in the business or profession they are in. Be it LEO, a Doctor, a Lawyer, or flipping burgers...
A little more action to change, a little more involvement to change perhaps. A little less complacency in the voting booth,or not getting the whole picture.
I competed in skeet for years, many of these folks are total numbnuts when it comes to L&P. Rude to new folks, bashing, talking down to them. If you don't shoot skeet, you are the scum of the earth. I don't shoot or communicate with many of these folks anymore. I did say my piece, do my L&P by example and help the new folks out. Do some of "my kind" Vote, get involved...heck no...they won't come for the skeet guns.
Wildalaska
member
I submit that a lot of the "Police Officer Brutally Beats Bystander and Violates Rights O my God its A Police State" posts are little more than trolling...
You can still have trolls with 4000 posts, espcially if all they do is troll.
WildbacktogunsAlaska
You can still have trolls with 4000 posts, espcially if all they do is troll.
WildbacktogunsAlaska
Warren
Member
It is not censorship that I am after here. I just want High Roaders to stop sticking rhetorical knives into one another.
Disagreements are fine. Some of these threads go way past that into a sort of war zone.
Disagreements are fine. Some of these threads go way past that into a sort of war zone.
Shovelhead
Member
I agree.
The "Anti's" couldn't have come up with a better "Divide & Conquer" for the "Pro's" if they all stayed awake all night for a year....
Ed
Coronach,
I can appreciate where you're coming from, but the impression left by a few officers (and one or two non-officers) on this forum appears to be more defense of any action by any LEO rather than "Things are not always as they are reported". I can respect the "let's wait for the facts" view when evenly applied, but the benefit of the doubt from many police online often seems reserved only for those with badges. I lose respect for an officer who defends a bad cop (or a good cop's bad actions). This might be an inaccurate perception on my part, but I know I'm not the only one who has been given it.
I note that dispite the well-known inaccuracies of the press, when some gun owner really screws up, he's lambasted up and down on this board for his many shortcomings. Sure, we pick on the press for their "arsenal" remarks and such, but we typically condemn any apparently wrong actions of the individual in question.
Now, I try to qualify my judgements on threads regarding police with such things as "If the events happened as reported" or "Without better information" and the like. But what I seem to see most often from LEOs here is not "If that really happened, that was horrible. But here's another possible explaination." It's almost always something like "... whatever it takes to guarantee officer safety." or "The supreme court has ruled that this is okay" or "We don't serve you" and other warm-fuzzy-making stuff.
That there are anti-cop extremists doesn't excuse (in my mind) some of the responses I've seen from a few police here.
My view, anyhow.
I can appreciate where you're coming from, but the impression left by a few officers (and one or two non-officers) on this forum appears to be more defense of any action by any LEO rather than "Things are not always as they are reported". I can respect the "let's wait for the facts" view when evenly applied, but the benefit of the doubt from many police online often seems reserved only for those with badges. I lose respect for an officer who defends a bad cop (or a good cop's bad actions). This might be an inaccurate perception on my part, but I know I'm not the only one who has been given it.
I note that dispite the well-known inaccuracies of the press, when some gun owner really screws up, he's lambasted up and down on this board for his many shortcomings. Sure, we pick on the press for their "arsenal" remarks and such, but we typically condemn any apparently wrong actions of the individual in question.
Now, I try to qualify my judgements on threads regarding police with such things as "If the events happened as reported" or "Without better information" and the like. But what I seem to see most often from LEOs here is not "If that really happened, that was horrible. But here's another possible explaination." It's almost always something like "... whatever it takes to guarantee officer safety." or "The supreme court has ruled that this is okay" or "We don't serve you" and other warm-fuzzy-making stuff.
That there are anti-cop extremists doesn't excuse (in my mind) some of the responses I've seen from a few police here.
My view, anyhow.
- Status
