New range rule: give us your DL

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Well, I don't know where you all are from, but I have NEVER been somewhere that wanted to hold on to my drivers license for any reason. Or leave watches, car keys, Whut next!? Hand over a bill of sale for you guns in case you damage a shooting range!?!
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I live in a place where on a busy day hundreds and hundreds of people come through each local range from open to close. The strange part is you seem to expect them to let you (a complete stranger to them) fire a weapon on their property, that has the potential to kill someone instantly (and don't pretend you've never ran into an unsafe person at the range) or do hundreds of dollars in damage without seeing who you are and holding an ID (that contains completely public information on it).
 
At my work (not a gun range) we take people's DLs for guest badges. Never had anyone have a issue in the six years I've worked there. Wouldent be a big deal for me, I understand that people have ruined the trust rule, so they need info for me to use there services.
 
If your state offers it, go and get a state issued ID card. you can use that instead of your DL when asked.
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Not many (if any states) will issue (or allow you to have) a DL and ID Card at the same time. That state issued ID will have the same exact information as your DL.
 
I walk into my range and I am usually greeted by name. Never had to show an id, most of the time I don't even show my membership card. Never had to leave an id to shoot anywhere. I would bet it's their insurer that's requiring it.

Talking about passports, I have been in countries where they held my passport st the border, which would only be returned when you departed, which had to be via that port of entry. When you leave your home, you play be someone else's rules. Or you stay at home.
 
I walk into my range and I am usually greeted by name. Never had to show an id, most of the time I don't even show my membership card. Never had to leave an id to shoot anywhere. I would bet it's their insurer that's requiring it.
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Same at my range, and they require a DL.
 
I am disappointed that this discussion is four pages long, but I am not surprised...

The other day I was at the bank and the teller asked a man for his id in order to get cash back during a deposit. The guy was furious and called the young women behind the counter an idiot and a thief and demanded to see their manager. He then started shouting for them to give him his money. I was not on duty, but a bank is a secure environment and you can not simply melt-down in one. I told him he needed to calm down and that I am a cop so he eased up a tiny bit. He was still obviously mad though and refused to give up his ID. He even called me a storm trooper. The irony is that at some point he trusted this bank enough to give them his money and probably every shred of personal information he had.

Anyways, back on subject. I belong to a gun club and they issue their own IDs that I just have to carry around. Security is pretty lax there, but we have never had a problem. If it were open to the public though I would not be surprised if they collected all kind of information to make sure you did not raise any hell. Also an uninitiated visitor might wander into the trench at the end of the high powered rifle range and you would have to identify the body.

Still, I can not believe how some people behave these days. I understand the desire to protect oneself, but people gotta realize that the world does not revolve around them.
 
There's a range around here that makes you join to to shoot there. This means keeping a copy of your DL on file, making a "membership card" and signing some stuff. Me and a friend were in a rush to go shoot one day, and they were the closest range. It was a PITA, and took an extra 15 minutes, but I had no problem keeping a copy of my DL, address, phone number, etc.
 
"Nearly every company has a janitor, that is paid miserably, that cleans the rooms where these records are kept."

The average gun shop with or without a firing range does not hire outside people to clean the shop. I've been employed by several gun shops and know a lot of people around the country who work in gun shops, and unless it's a big box store, the staff does the cleaning. These are the same people who have access to your firearms paperwork in the store, and that paperwork is not locked away anywhere. Everyone gets upset about the DL, but what about the paperwork you filled out for your gun? We lock it away where I work, but at previous places they just filed them in a backroom where the staff hung out, and it was in cardboard boxes on shelves.
 
I have both a driver license and a state issue ID here in GA. I did the same in IN.

Actually, I even have two valid DLs since I lost one and then later found it. Had to pay too. :rolleyes:
 
I think a good bit of the issue is that the amount of information coded onto a DL varies from state to state. There is also a difference between making a copy of the DL, and taking the DL itself. A copy is all that's needed for most day to day transactions. Physically taking the DL itself can be another issue, depending on what other information in encoded on the card in the form of magnetic strips, etc.

The Feds have been pushing the RealID Act to bring all state issued DLs up to a uniform standard and formalize what's already happened informally, the concept of the DL as a defacto national ID card. There has been a lot of push back on doing that and last time I looked, the whole concept was stalled in Congress. Since the prevailing opinion about handing over your ID seems to be 'sure, no problem', it kind of makes me wonder why there was such an outcry over the RealID standard.
 
I liked how my old pistol club handled it; you'd get a "Visitor's Card" after taking a short safety course, and with each time you went there, you just needed to present it.

I never needed to show a Driver's License, which is good, as I don't and never will have one. I have a Firearm's License though (probably coming to a state near you)!
 
A business that provides a service needs to treat you like a human being, and not take steps that say "You know, I think you may be a miscreant."

The range is a business, and is NOT doing you a favor by being there. I have been to several ranges both in Ohio and in Tennessee, and none that I have been to have forced me to leave my DL behind. If they had, I may have walked out. If they want to see it, even write some of the info, that's fine. But something rubs me the wrong way by forcing me to essentially "deposit" my license like that.
 
Every indoor range that I've ever been to does this. Many bars do too (as mentioned earlier - often times when you open a tab they'll want either your ID or a debit card). Many clubs also hold onto the ID of any patron between 18 and 21 (often times they'll put a paper bracelet or something on you to make sure the bartender doesn't serve you - if you come back out and the bracelet is torn or removed, you're not getting your ID back, and they're calling the cops).

Realistically, EVERYTHING on your driver's license is public record. You can put in a FOIA request to the appropriate government office and get any of that information (plus a LOT more) with virtually no effort.

Really, the main thing you have to worry about regarding identity theft is your SSN - which is not on your drivers license and should never be given to a private party unless they're a banker or other financial worker of some sort who needs it. My DL though? I don't even bat an eye.
 
I guess I don't understand why taking the DL provides better protection for the business than swiping a credit or debit card. The latter provides a trackable and established method of settling any financial issues with legal protections for both sides.

FWIW, in over forty years of visiting indoor and outdoor ranges, restaurants, bars, and vacation spots, I have never been asked to surrender my DL for any reason. I've put down a lot of equipment deposits and been asked to show my DL as an method of identification, but noone has ever tried to physically take possession of it for any length of time other than to confirm my name and address. Sure someone can find out my personal info by other means, but the point is that you don't have to make it easy for them.

But hey, I'm one of those 'tinfoil hat' people who locks his front door when he leaves, and locks his car in the parking lot.
 
A business that provides a service needs to treat you like a human being, and not take steps that say "You know, I think you may be a miscreant."

The range is a business, and is NOT doing you a favor by being there. I have been to several ranges both in Ohio and in Tennessee, and none that I have been to have forced me to leave my DL behind. If they had, I may have walked out. If they want to see it, even write some of the info, that's fine. But something rubs me the wrong way by forcing me to essentially "deposit" my license like that.
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This. As I said before, a lot of gun businesses sadly fall into this trap of thinking they are doing you a favour by simply being there. Some standards do still have to be maintained.
 
The state range I go to in MI has you print your name & nothing else on their paper.
They did get your zip code but stopped that a couple months ago.
I like to go there on monday--very quiet up until about the last week in Oct--then until Nov 15 it becomes very busy 7 days a week.
 
I can see the point of collecting personal data for liability purposes. I also can see the point of registering all the calibers at the range one shoots for the same reason (a flyer hits somebody etc.) However, all that data can go into a database somewhere. (I am not saying it does, I am saying it is possible. Yeah it is also possible that a lightning will hit from clear skies) Later all that data can be used to know who has what.
 
My range isn't an indoor range. They give us a membership card with our name, address, membership number. They have never asked for my drivers license. I've been a member since I was 18, 18 years ago. Before that my father was member so I didn't need to be. I'd go with him as a family member.

NYH1!
 
Again...you do not have to give them your DL. You can simply leave. Their house, their rules. Don't like it, go somewhere else. Not a big deal. Why the need to whine about it?
 
You guys think going to a gun range and letting them hold your ID is an invasion of privacy? Trying taking flying lessons and then renting an airplane! They have a copy of my DL, my private license, my instrument endorsement, the list of classes taken,a running total of hours spent aloft, a copy of every log book entry, my phone number, email, home address, next of kin, and they even have a copy of my medical exam! And I flew with that outfit for two years! They also still send me birthday cards and email jokes. They'd even inform me when my medical was about to expire or drop to a lower class. They also greeted me by name, asked if I wanted some coffee or donuts (or usually pizza) while I waited for the plane to come back from a lesson,etc.. Heck! The head instructor and I even went out for beers and girl watching after (after!) we got done flying a cross country trip! It's not that they're being rude or that they're going to steal your info. They're covering their collective arses legally. You may have noticed the silly law suits lately? Spill coffee in your lap? Here's a million bucks for your pain......If you're THAT worried about ID theft, get Lifelock for Pete's sake!


Ps- that wasn't meant to be a rant, just sounded like one. It was actually spoken aloud with tongue in cheek while I typed.
 
You guys think going to a gun range and letting them hold your ID is an invasion of privacy? Trying taking flying lessons and then renting an airplane! They have a copy of my DL, my private license, my instrument endorsement, the list of classes taken,a running total of hours spent aloft, a copy of every log book entry, my phone number, email, home address, next of kin, and they even have a copy of my medical exam! And I flew with that outfit for two years! They also still send me birthday cards and email jokes. They'd even inform me when my medical was about to expire or drop to a lower class. They also greeted me by name, asked if I wanted some coffee or donuts (or usually pizza) while I waited for the plane to come back from a lesson,etc.. Heck! The head instructor and I even went out for beers and girl watching after (after!) we got done flying a cross country trip! It's not that they're being rude or that they're going to steal your info. They're covering their collective arses legally. You may have noticed the silly law suits lately? Spill coffee in your lap? Here's a million bucks for your pain......If you're THAT worried about ID theft, get Lifelock for Pete's sake!
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On the other end of the spectrum, when I was renting the guy gave me a key to the plane, and just told me to "Give me a call and let me know when you're taking it out. Just get me a check for the time next time you see me, and get my gas truck to fill it up when you get back.". Of course the owner was just shy of 90 and no longer could fly himself, so that might have had something do to with it, but he was pretty nonchalant about it.

That aside, I wouldn't have minded giving them whatever documentation he had wanted. As I mentioned earlier, the main piece of information you want to protect is your SSN. The rest is simply out there. It's not akin to locking your door - it's more like walking down the street with a ski-mask on to make sure nobody can see your face. Not only is it inconvenient, it's also not really protecting you from any legitimate threat.
 
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