7.62x51 (.308) bear loads

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mini14gb: Your response determines the bears actions but the initial charge is real!!
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Me: It's a pretty awesome thing to see, but it's just a warning or a test...
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I don't see any difference between what I said, and what the biologist said - different words, same point.

But there is a second kind of attack where your actions make no difference - you're going down, period. Unless you stop him with a good shot, or a blast of pepper spray. And those attacks are very different than the one described above. I'm sure if you read more on what DeBruyn says, he'll describe that type of attack also. And I'm sure he'll describe it as I do - no noise, ears back, eyes narrowed to slits, sudden rush from close range.
 
That explains where you get your grizzly expertise...
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Well what kind of expert are you? Livin' on some little secluded island...nothin' but seals...and moose...and lost people...and bear. Okay...you win.

:)
 
Kodiak there is a distinct difference in what you and DeBrunyn say. YOU say a bluff charge is a bluff from the start part of a threat posture but if you show weakness your screwed. DeBrunyn say all charges are REAL and that your reaction will deter the bear from making an attack. I don't know about you but to me that sound quite different.

The other attack you refer to is a stalking/predatory attack and here is what DeBrunyn says about those attacks, "Silence, the bears eyes intensely focused, signs of stress (jaw popping ect are not evident, ears will be up and forward in the position of a pure aggressor."
 
Kodiak, I do respect your opinion and you have obviously been around the block with the big bears. I'm not in AK but Montana is a close second when it comes to bears. I to have lived in the woods my whole life. I'm not a amateur by any means and we are splitting hairs on these finer points or bear logic.
 
you guys can go all read your hihg powered rifle shooter magazines and get brainwashed by the BS they feed you saying that .300 wsm's are good for brown bears and that .300wsm can penetrate tank armor... but i'll stick to my logic and common sense and not get brainwashed on the .30 caliber and tactical rifle craze
 
Jeeze Greg can you give some kind of evidence to back your conclusions? You have rejected ballistics and history so far so I'm wondering if your evidence is in your mind in the form of massive fear of bears. If you are so correct about bears can you please explain to me how Lewis and Clark stopped charges with underpowered flintlock rifles?
 
I wouldn't call it a massive fear... i'd call it a healthy fear... bears are WILD ANIMALS.. they were engineered by God... our creator to KILL and EAT other animals. I just wouldn't take a 30 caliber bullet to protect my life... its good for hunting purposes but for solitary hikes through thick bear country wher eyou can't see more then 40 yards I would rather have ATLEAST 12 gauge shotgun with 3" slugs.
 
For the record I did contact Jeff Quinn from Gunblast.com about the M1A as a all-around camp rifle and he agreed it was a good selection.
 
And I'm in Tenneesee...no griz here, but plenty of blackies.

And I have been up close and personal with a few of them...different bears with different attitudes, I know.

But some things are the same...such as a predatory attack, its a bad place to be...no matter what species or how big the bear is.
 
I'm not allowed to disagree? I'm not allowed to have an opinion. Its ok for everyone else to force there opinion about .30 caliber rifles being okay to take down a chargin bear but its not okay for me to disagree? What kind of message board is ithis... you get reported and attacked for disagreeing?
 
I have that same healthy fear Greg but I'm not going to pack a unreasonable canon around with me just out of fear when something more accommodating will work just fine.
 
Greg you are a serious piece of work.

30-06 and 7,62x54R have been put an end to bear charges for several decades and you still debate that??

Do yourself a favor and talk to Caribou...send him a PM and get some schooling about firearms for bears...
 
Thats not what happening Greg. You can have an opinion but back it up with some kind of evidence of history or ballistics. The fact is much lesser rifles than .30 cal have stopped big bears and you act like they have not.
 
What evidence bro.. I don't need EVIDENCe to tell me that a 180 grain chunk of lead the size of a GOYA BEAN is not gonna stop an angry mean charging bear in a Worst case scenario charges and sometimes 1000 pd plus animal

I don't have a massive fear bro.. but its good to prepare for WORST CASE SCENARIO

you gotta prepare for WORST CASE SCENARIOS in everything you do in life ... and it makes sense to question hmm will that bean sized bullet be able to stop a chargin bear intent on killing me?
 
saturno_v said:
Greg you are a serious piece of work.

30-06 and 7,62x54R have been put an end to bear charges for several decades and you still debate that??

Do yourself a favor and talk to Caribou...send him a PM and get some schooling about firearms for bears...
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do yourself a favor bro don't give me advice and talk down to me.. thats right i'm a piece of work and its kept me safe and out of trouble for all 24 years i've been walking this planet.
 
OK then Greg can you point me to the nearest grenade launcher dealer? Those small beans you refer to have stop more charges than your Beowulf.
 
mini14gb said:
Thats not what happening Greg. You can have an opinion but back it up with some kind of evidence of history or ballistics. The fact is much lesser rifles than .30 cal have stopped big bears and you act like they have not.
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The fact is bro I don't need "ballistics" and other BS .. i have common sense... it doesnt matter how fast the bullet is travelling its still too small to cause enough damage.. maybe get one of those armor piercing incendiaries they use for armored vehicle in iraq, maybe that'll work
 
Greg,
You are allowed to have an opinion and to disagree, but forums being what they are...you need to be prepared with facts to back up your opinion before shouting it from a soap box.

FWIW...I agree with you, the .308 is not a stopping round, but that does not mean that it won't work if everything goes right (placement).

That is why I said a large caliber lever gun would be better...because if I need to put a bullet through a mad bears brain...I want to be able to do it even if I'm shooting him in the ass.

And before anybody asks "Why shoot a bear that is running away?" Maybe...just maybe, he is going after my wife, kid, hunting buddy, dog, or my mule...see what I'm saying?
 
mini 14 your obviously a .30 caliber advocate and believe all the BS in the magazines put out there saying that .30 calibers with extra super duper short cases and speacial "Advanced" bullet design will take down everything from deer to lightly armored battleships... if you wanna believe the BS hype that gunmakers produce about new rounds they make to get sales... i'd rather have my mossberg 12 gauge rifled barrel with 3" slugs or .45-70
 
the .308 will stop a chargin bear with proper placement I agree, but don't you want something that can stop a bear with imperfect placement which is what is usually the case
 
i dont know about everyone else but for bear protection you wanna prepare for worst case scenario and if my life is on the line i don't wanna waste my time trying to stead a crosshair to get a perfect shot... because the truth is in most situations that are life threatening your not gonna have the time to have perfect shots. I'd rather have something that can put the animal down from any angle
 
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