Help bettering my gun club!

[George Dickel]

OP, you keep mentioning how expensive a membership to the club is, do you pay attention to the treasurers report? If you did you might realize that it doesn't operate for free. The report should detail every dollar brought in and every dollar spent and for what. The club, if it has smart leadership, maintains liability insurance which can be extremely expensive and premiums rise every few years if not annually. On top of the liability insurance there is insurance for property damage due to weather, fire, etc. There are property taxes, utilities such as electric and water, expendables required to maintain the range. Lawn mowers are expensive to purchase and to maintain as well as trimmers and other equipment. A bit of money is needed to be on hand to pay for unexpected repairs such as a new roof on the clubhouse and other such things. There is probably a reason the snow removal tractor is limited to one operator, like knowing how to operate it without damaging it. How many members check the lawnmowers for proper oil level and loose or broken parts? A ruined engine due to negligence costs the club money. The membership costs aren't all that outrageous even though the use of the ranges is difficult to deal with. As for me, if the "clique" wants to do all the work, let them it do because I'd be willing to pay the $15 and hour to avoid the hassle and annoyance of doing the work myself.

You state you haven't made a meeting since January. If you and your friends don't show up to vote you have no grounds to complain about the way the club is run. If you don't like the club, leave, join that other club but something tells me that within 2 months of belonging to that club you will be posting here wanting help to change that club.

 

[Axis II]

Just sending one letter expecting that to change everything isn’t realistic. Anyonmous letter will go in the trash.

Letter seems to have a lot of points. I’d pick the most likely to pass / most popular and just start with that. Probably not the money one. Then move on to the next. All these changes will be a long game.

You say there are meetings? Can you arrange to speak at a meeting?

Is this a privately owned club? Is sounds like a coop. Is there a leadership board that you can become a part of?

Private club owned by the membership. leadership board has been the same for 20yrs, speaking at meetings turns it into a giant argument because all the attendees are 20-30-40yr members that don't like change.

 

[Axis II]

Oh yes i see there is a board. I suggest you run for election.

IMO elections are fixed. The last two years I've noticed 2-3 people run for president, VP, treasure, trustee, etc only to "decline" the position shortly before the vote.

 

[Axis II]

OP, you keep mentioning how expensive a membership to the club is, do you pay attention to the treasurers report? If you did you might realize that it doesn't operate for free. The report should detail every dollar brought in and every dollar spent and for what. The club, if it has smart leadership, maintains liability insurance which can be extremely expensive and premiums rise every few years if not annually. On top of the liability insurance there is insurance for property damage due to weather, fire, etc. There are property taxes, utilities such as electric and water, expendables required to maintain the range. Lawn mowers are expensive to purchase and to maintain as well as trimmers and other equipment. A bit of money is needed to be on hand to pay for unexpected repairs such as a new roof on the clubhouse and other such things. There is probably a reason the snow removal tractor is limited to one operator, like knowing how to operate it without damaging it. How many members check the lawnmowers for proper oil level and loose or broken parts? A ruined engine due to negligence costs the club money. The membership costs aren't all that outrageous even though the use of the ranges is difficult to deal with. As for me, if the "clique" wants to do all the work, let them it do because I'd be willing to pay the $15 and hour to avoid the hassle and annoyance of doing the work myself.

You state you haven't made a meeting since January. If you and your friends don't show up to vote you have no grounds to complain about the way the club is run. If you don't like the club, leave, join that other club but something tells me that within 2 months of belonging to that club you will be posting here wanting help to change that club.

The other club doesn't hold meetings, work parties are either volunteered or pay someone to do it. 1200 members @$125yr along with farm land and the new natural gas line going through there they have a lot of $. I don't go to the meetings because its 30-40min of the same arguments. Pick up brass, don't shoot cans, who wants to rent the range, arguments of renting the range because multiple people want for the same day so then it goes to the longest member or whoever the board wants, "turn the GD coffee pot off cause we are tired of buying GD coffee pots, idiots!" we spent xyz on fuel, electric, etc. We spend maybe $800 month on actual bills and somehow certain people have club prepaid visa cards that need replenished monthly at $500. I pay attention and when we ask why they purchased a $400 backpack leaf blower to blow the snow off the gravel walkways but its locked up and only the president and VP can use it doesn't make sense. Only reason that passed was a 40yr member got pissed and threw a fit so they voted it in. Purchase a $1500 rider that actually has blade guards, engine doesn't shake when you hit bumps, doesn't backfire, smoke, etc. If you question the treasure report they say well we will look into it and let you know next meeting and its never brought up. Someone flat out asked why $10k was missing from the account and we were told officer expenses, building and lands materials, etc. That member said why are you spending $1k on foam board to hold targets and spread mulch once a month when you can do gravel, concrete, wood backboards that turn into mulch. It was answered that's they way its been done for 20yrs! Next!

I have to cut grass tonight and in 2 more weeks and find something else to do for my work hours before school starts! $250yr is quite expensive with a 4 bench 100yard line and 75-25yard in front of that. As for checking equipment there is a committee rep present when we mow and he is in charge of checking that. I check mine just incase. They wont even fill the gas cans up because they are afraid people will steal them. Just enough to run a weed whacker and mower.

You cannot vote on anything! If one person doesn't like it they say bring it up next meeting and then when its brought up its always next meeting. The background check thing was brought up, literally argued about during a meeting where the membership guy told everyone shut the hell up or take your ass somewhere else. Next month brought up again and told we are looking into it and next month the same and now its gone because people seen it was going nowhere. They asked about building a berm for pistol so rifle guys can shoot while pistol matches and what not are happening and from what i was told anyone with 20yrs + membership shot it down saying we didn't need a separate pistol range even though all other clubs do it. I asked for the riding mower to get a new tire last year because it had a huge hole in it and was told in a very nasty way they would take care of it and to use a push mower! Im not push mowing 10 acres of land your crazy! Weeks later someone got pissed off and purchased a tire with their own money.

 

[kmw1954]

I just spent 1+hr reading these 4 pages of rant. My take. You are not happy with the organization and rules of this club but you stay because it's cheap and close by. The other clubs offer much more yet also cost more which you also complain about. I'm having trouble discerning just what it is you want, or what you believe is either a fair practice or a fair pricing on membership fees.

I see it this way, the current club is cheap to be affiliated with as long as you work off dues by working hours, which is basically what you are doing. It is not up to the board or the membership to assure you that you meet those hours to reduce your dues.

You say there is a clique that is restricting you and many of the other members from obtaining those hours to reduce your dues and that very well sound as if that is the case. The thing with cliques is either you are in or you are out. It's that simple. This same clique is controlling the whole club. From dues, to work schedules to who's running the thing. Essentially it is their private club and they allow you to come in and pay for using it. They are all retired and everything there meets their needs. Why change, We're happy!

You are not going to change this clique. Not even if you find a small group to back you up and vote as a block. Even then the odds are not good that you could hold control over this group. Even if you formed another clique to fight off the 1st one. They have been there too long and have too much power.

Now I will relate the state of gun clubs in my area. There are 3 outdoor private clubs within a 1 hour drive for me with the closest being about 40 minutes.

One is a small Sportsman's club like you describe. Yearly dues are $35.00 plus a $5.00 per day daily range fee. But they are only open Sundays and Tuesdays! Took the wife there for her 1st shoot because I didn't know anything about this place other than what a friend told me. We went to the pistol range, it was packed, elbow to elbow with no lane dividers. We left after 30min and my wife was just about in tears.

The next club which we haven't been to is private and the first year is $180.00 with a $100.00 initiation fee for the first year. They also had the "Work to reduce dues." offer and now looks to be all volunteer. This club also has limited hours and access being closed Mon., Tues., and Thur., accept on Thursday nights when they hold a steel pistol league. They also have a daily use fee of $5.00 per member.

Lastly in another private club. Membership dues are $75.00 per year for family with a one time initiation fee of $100.00 plus a one time $15.00 administration fee. Only they offer a senior discount on membership which is only $25.00 per year. They have a pistol range, 100 and 200yd rifle, shotgun, black powder, 22 LR range, archery, airgun and Cowboy range. This range is also limited to Fri., Sat., Sundays. Though they do hold Action Pistol matches on Wed. and these are open to the public.

Indoor ranges! There are 8 that offer memberships and most start above $300.00 per year and are very restrictive, Like 10 hours of free range time, 3 free guest tokens, 2 yearly free transfers, a free T shirt and a few targets and after your Free range time is used up range time costs only $15.00 per hour and this is a single person membership not a family! But for a mire $1000.00 per year you get unlimited range time but limited to 2 hours per visit.

 

[BilliamB.]

After a couple threads about this club, I don’t think I’m going too far out on a limb when I say this club is ridiculously unprofessional and run very sloppily.

Coming from a rural area where clubs are $25ish a year with no other requirements and the ranges are nice and well kept, I’m baffled how people have to join clubs that are such a pain. When I lived near a bigger city, the rates were much, much higher (hundreds a year) and there were waiting lists, and some had twice a year work days, but for the most part it was just really, very nice and easy and expensive.

It sounds like the club in this thread needs a leadership overhaul. Use the existing governing structure to make it better, or get out. Or pay more and stop dealing with the insanity.

Nice, close and cheap - pick two I guess and just enjoy shooting.

If it was me, I’d factor in the cost of just paying cash and not participating. There’s no amount of money worth dealing with some people...

My club is only $50 a year. It offers no amenities, has no bureaucrats, and there's never a wait for a bench. With a range out to 200 yards (rare here in the Northeast), I can't think of a club that suit me more. It's all shootin' and no BS.

 

[Axis II]

I just spent 1+hr reading these 4 pages of rant. My take. You are not happy with the organization and rules of this club but you stay because it's cheap and close by. The other clubs offer much more yet also cost more which you also complain about. I'm having trouble discerning just what it is you want, or what you believe is either a fair practice or a fair pricing on membership fees.

I see it this way, the current club is cheap to be affiliated with as long as you work off dues by working hours, which is basically what you are doing. It is not up to the board or the membership to assure you that you meet those hours to reduce your dues.

You say there is a clique that is restricting you and many of the other members from obtaining those hours to reduce your dues and that very well sound as if that is the case. The thing with cliques is either you are in or you are out. It's that simple. This same clique is controlling the whole club. From dues, to work schedules to who's running the thing. Essentially it is their private club and they allow you to come in and pay for using it. They are all retired and everything there meets their needs. Why change, We're happy!

You are not going to change this clique. Not even if you find a small group to back you up and vote as a block. Even then the odds are not good that you could hold control over this group. Even if you formed another clique to fight off the 1st one. They have been there too long and have too much power.

Now I will relate the state of gun clubs in my area. There are 3 outdoor private clubs within a 1 hour drive for me with the closest being about 40 minutes.

One is a small Sportsman's club like you describe. Yearly dues are $35.00 plus a $5.00 per day daily range fee. But they are only open Sundays and Tuesdays! Took the wife there for her 1st shoot because I didn't know anything about this place other than what a friend told me. We went to the pistol range, it was packed, elbow to elbow with no lane dividers. We left after 30min and my wife was just about in tears.

The next club which we haven't been to is private and the first year is $180.00 with a $100.00 initiation fee for the first year. They also had the "Work to reduce dues." offer and now looks to be all volunteer. This club also has limited hours and access being closed Mon., Tues., and Thur., accept on Thursday nights when they hold a steel pistol league. They also have a daily use fee of $5.00 per member.

Lastly in another private club. Membership dues are $75.00 per year for family with a one time initiation fee of $100.00 plus a one time $15.00 administration fee. Only they offer a senior discount on membership which is only $25.00 per year. They have a pistol range, 100 and 200yd rifle, shotgun, black powder, 22 LR range, archery, airgun and Cowboy range. This range is also limited to Fri., Sat., Sundays. Though they do hold Action Pistol matches on Wed. and these are open to the public.

Indoor ranges! There are 8 that offer memberships and most start above $300.00 per year and are very restrictive, Like 10 hours of free range time, 3 free guest tokens, 2 yearly free transfers, a free T shirt and a few targets and after your Free range time is used up range time costs only $15.00 per hour and this is a single person membership not a family! But for a mire $1000.00 per year you get unlimited range time but limited to 2 hours per visit.

Thanks for your response.

Yes, you are correct I am not happy! I complained about the cost of the other club because i was going by what i found on the internet and old pictures. I finally had a day off where i could drive out there when someone was in the office to be shown the grounds. Pics on the website showed ranges, old wooden benches, etc. Sunday when i went there i was met with a massive clubhouse that's only about 10yrs old, 6 trap and skeet fields and very nice rifle benches and lanes and a golf cart to use to change 300yard targets. I was also advised that instead of dues reaching almost $300 which was depicted online it would be about $150 to start and $125yr.

Last night i skipped my normal 2hr long gym session and made a mad dash for the current club to cut the grass. I arrived to find one mower broken down, going from low to high speeds on its own and almost sending a 70yo man into the creek! The issue has been brought up but no one will fix it. 3/4 of the range was already cut by someone either that morning or the day before so 3 of us drove all the way there for 30min of work when usually its 2hrs. Someone got bored that morning and cut the grass and from the sign in sheet it shows they have like 30 work hours and only 12 are required. The range is quiet, nicely maintained other than the mud pit at the pistol line so i finished weed whacking with the broken weed whacker that wouldn't turn off and fired my handguns so not that big of a deal. I just feel for $250yr without work hours x 150 members, $75 week if not more in match fees we should have a little better equipment. Brand new leaf blower, power washer, welder, saws, etc and no one but the president, VP, and a few friends can use them. I could have found 4hrs of work last night instead of 30min but no access to equipment. I also noticed the benches were fixed and stained since Sunday so that means someone was up there Monday or Tuesday morning fixing and painting. When i inquired about getting wood to fix benches i was told 2 retired carpenters do it and no one else. Again work hours gone.

The current place is close, cheap and i do really like the guys i mow with but I advised them i cant cut grass starting next month so now what work can i do if i only have weekends free? I honestly don't feel its right for me to have to pay extra dues when hours are available but not announced in the monthly flyer or the clubs members only website or done Monday morning at 9am.

I am debating on keeping the current membership and just telling them look I'm going back to school for a year and will not be able to do work unless its weekends so if you guys don't want to lose me as a member either fix something or I'm out. I wont pay $250 for a 100yard range when i can pay $125 for separate ranges 25-300yards with better setups. I have guys ask me all the time why we cut grass on Tuesday nights because they have to work they would gladly help on Saturday or Sunday. If they cannot tell the group of 5-6 guys who spend every morning up there to leave some weekend work for us i will gladly drive the extra time and pay $125yr for better services.

 

[SSN Vet]

I belong to a club that offers credit off of your membership dues ($60 year) for volunteer work, up to a a max of like half off. The club is well organized and very safe, even though there are not RSOs.

It's so popular, however, that they have capped membership. But they struggle to get people to volunteer as officers, committee members and for work groups.

It sounds like your club isn't concerned about adding or keeping members and has structured their rules to emphasize member participation.

Not a bad thing... but it's hard to fit into a busy work schedule.

 

[George P]

I am debating on keeping the current membership and just telling them look I'm going back to school for a year and will not be able to do work unless its weekends so if you guys don't want to lose me as a member either fix something or I'm out. I wont pay $250 for a 100yard range when i can pay $125 for separate ranges 25-300yards with better setups. I have guys ask me all the time why we cut grass on Tuesday nights because they have to work they would gladly help on Saturday or Sunday. If they cannot tell the group of 5-6 guys who spend every morning up there to leave some weekend work for us i will gladly drive the extra time and pay $125yr for better services.

I just don't get why you want to stay at your current club with all of its issues you seem to hate. Go join the nicer place, invite some your friends from the current club to come and join that one.

 

[redneck2]

In life you have three and only three choices...

1). Accept what they offer

2). Work to change it

3). Do something different

Every post you start is whining about something. Look at my sig lines. Go back and read those lines about a dozen times.

You are the only member I have ever put on my ignore list. Don’t bother to respond as I will never see it.

Good bye and good luck

 

[Axis II]

In life you have three and only three choices...

1). Accept what they offer

2). Work to change it

3). Do something different

Every post you start is whining about something. Go back and read those three lines about a dozen times.

You are the only member I have ever put on my ignore list. Don’t bother to respond as I will never see it. And, read my sig line, probably multiple times

Good bye and good luck

Thanks for blocking me! Don't like it don't ready it. I only complain about the club and cabelas screwing over woman! Plenty of reloading and hunting posts.

 

[Axis II]

I just don't get why you want to stay at your current club with all of its issues you seem to hate. Go join the nicer place, invite some your friends from the current club to come and join that one.

To not have to start over. Only pro to the current one is distance. If they changed the work issue she is stay at both. 99% I'm going to the other place.

 

[George P]

Start over how? I just moved and now I have to start over making new friends, finding shooting companions, etc.

 

[2bfree]

I only complain about the club and cabelas screwing over woman!

You can't really be serious. If so, maybe that explanes some of your other problems, memory

 

[Axis II]

You can't really be serious. If so, maybe that explanes some of your other problems, memory

You do realize that you only oi

Start over how? I just moved and now I have to start over making new friends, finding shooting companions, etc.

just probations where I cannot take friend and family, get to know people, work around grounds, meetings, finding people to sponsor me.

Now having said this I found sponsors, etc. I will be either joining the new one and leaving the old one or keeping both. After I first brought this back to life my buddy who is also a member says it's nice for checking zero before a hunt or load workups after work cause it is so close. I'm slightly playing with the idea of keeping both. I'm more leaning towards ditching them tho.

 

[Axis II]

Seeing how this has turned into a pissing match ill end it here.

I brought this back just stating I found something a lot better. I would like to keep the current place cause of distance and about 5 people I've become friends with as well as quick shooting after work. Now weighing the current place and the new place the new place has a lot more to offer for a way better price so I will most likely be going there but there are a few cons I found today. No guests during probation period, 30min one way drive which isn't terrible but the trips would be all day trips, trying to get on grounds keeping crews again (I enjoy landscaping) Notary, 2 people to sponsor, etc. Right now I've got a lot going on with school starting in a month so unless I come into a few free days I wont get in anytime soon.

 

[George P]

30 minutes for a better place would be an easy decision for me.

 

[Wisco]

Seeing how this has turned into a pissing match ill end it here.

I brought this back just stating I found something a lot better. I would like to keep the current place cause of distance and about 5 people I've become friends with as well as quick shooting after work. Now weighing the current place and the new place the new place has a lot more to offer for a way better price so I will most likely be going there but there are a few cons I found today. No guests during probation period, 30min one way drive which isn't terrible but the trips would be all day trips, trying to get on grounds keeping crews again (I enjoy landscaping) Notary, 2 people to sponsor, etc. Right now I've got a lot going on with school starting in a month so unless I come into a few free days I wont get in anytime soon.

So, you have the money to buy a second membership, but not just pay to opt out of the work hours for the current club, which is the source of so much bellyaching?

 

[Axis II]

So, you have the money to buy a second membership, but not just pay to opt out of the work hours for the current club, which is the source of so much bellyaching?

If i got into the $125yr club the membership would be paid for. My buddy said if i got in he would pay half the membership and my brother countered that he would leave his current setup of $300+yr and pay for my whole membership. If it went down that way i would either have to pay $65 for the current place and still work which i don't mind just quit screwing me over like cutting the grass the day before and $65 for the new club or not have to pay for the new club at all.

I enjoy doing the work and seeing how they cut grass during the week at 4pm when 99% of the members cannot i get 25-30hrs a year because the other two guys who cut are 70yo and i feel bad leaving them to cut the grass. What i bellyache about is showing up Tuesday at 4pm after working all day, changing and driving to the club to find out someone cut the grass already and the secret squirrel crap of when major work is being done. My buddy owes $15hr x6hrs now and they will not release the new gate code to him until he pays. He told them screw off because he has asked about work hours and everything is either hush, hush or done on a Wednesday at 10am when everyone is working. I found out another guy i know there quit for the same reasons. He says look I'm a truck driver i can work party weekends and that's it. Oh well we painted the club house, cleaned the gutters, painted benches, replaced target stand, spread mulch, split wood last weekend. If you look at the work board there is nothing listed and nothing on the website which is updated monthly. When asked if it was brought up at a meeting they said no it was word of mouth!

 

[2bfree]

Seeing how this has turned into a pissing match ill end it here.

Well. I guess not

 

[Axis II]

Well. I guess not

You have a lot of nerve to ridicule me but every single post ever posted on one of my threads is negative or trying to stir the pot. I mean if you think I'm cute just say so ill send you some pics.

Mr. Wiso asked me a question so i replied. ! Move along trouble maker!

 

[2bfree]

Well you are wrong again. In the past I have offered you help a number of times.
I have seen that you have had the same problem with many others in the past. I would think at some point you would realize maybe the problem is not us.
Thanks for your last post though, I must say I have not had that good of a laugh in a long time.

 

[buck460XVR]

I only complain about the club and cabelas screwing over woman!

Well......the Cabela's snibble got locked, I'm surprised this one has lasted as long as it has.

 

[dcloco]

Might I suggest, a SECOND work committee sign up sheet? Designate the time allowed to work as 6 to 9 pm weeknights and 9 to noon weekends (you get the idea).

The other group WILL cherry pick the heck out of ANY upcoming projects. You can help this out, by asking for new concrete to be poured (most concrete places only deliver 8 to 5 pm weekdays).

 

[luger fan]

I would NOT belong to a club like that.