Open carry in Colorado.... continued!

[Nightwing]

Guys... feel free to take a read. I had a rough situation with a friend. Just did the best I could to handle the situation as well as I could on the fly in a public place. Feel free to read on!


I'll tell you..... I have had a great experience open carrying so far! It's been very peaceful and I have some new found confidence. Certainly not showboating or anything. Just saying, I feel a little safer in weird parts of town. But certainly am not going to use it as an excuse to have a big ego!
But here's something I noticed.....

My wife HATES that I am taking a gun with me now. She's sort of rolling her eyes a lot and all that. This is one thing I won't comprimise on. I asked her if she will be more comforterable with me carrying concealed? She says "It's stupid either way. Might as well wear it in the open so everyone knows it, and not just me." She has said a few times... "My dad had a gun! He didn't go carrying it around!"... to which I can easily reply... "Honey. Your dad's only gun is a vintage tommy gun. I'm glad he didn't carry it around. But I love you, and I love our son, and I love being alive, and so do many other people me meet every day. It's just a tool, and you know that. Don't worry. There are a million laws, and I'm abiding by every one. If you'd like to read them I'll print them out for you, and then I can be accountable to you, and you can keep me in check if you feel like I'm crossing any lines that I shouldn't be, but for now... just trust me a little bit on this one thing, OK?"
She rolls her eyes but doesn't argue anymore.... most of the time.
Of course 6 months ago my wife was SOOOO anti Gun it made me think she might want us to move to DC!! hehe.

So anyways on to the real situation....

We went to dinner with friends 2 nights ago and walked around the lobby, sat and talked, were seated, and had almost 3 hours of dinner and conversation without them noticing I was OPENLY CARRYING! It wasn't a big deal!

We were joking around after about 3 hours and just being sort of silly. Well my wife finally goes "You wanna know something stupid? Joel is carrying a Gun!"
Both of my friends go to complete seriousness. My buddy says "You are? Where?"
I say "In plain open view. It's no big deal. So what were we talking about"?
He says "Yes it is a big deal, you idiot! You're going to shoot someone".
"Why would I shoot someone"?
"Because you have a gun"!
keep in mind this friend of mine likes guns. I don't know where he was coming from with this.
He says "Dude. You are making a childish decision to carry that thing, and you're drawing attention to yourself".
"But we've been sitting here for 3 hours and I've gotten up to go to the restroom twice. You haven't noticed and we're sitting right next to eachother. Now, please.... I don't need this to be an open conversation. I don't want other people overhearing the publicity you guys are creating and getting all concerned over something that is perfectly legal and I am doing in a perfectly safe manner"
So he says " I used to have another friend that openly carried a huge Booie Knife (spelling?) and he thought it was so cool. Cops always noticed, and people always gave him bad looks. you're doing the same thing."
So I say "Why was he carrying that big knife? What was his purpose?"
He says "To impress people"
I said "Then that's where where we're different. I'm not carrying to impress ANYONE! I'm carrying because I value my life, and I value my wife's, even though she hasn't warmed up to me carrying yet. I'm carrying because you are my friends and I care about you. I expect I will go my entire life without ever even having to put my hand on the grip of this thing (not touching it at this moment, by the way, and also speaking very low), but the world is full of people with no regard for human life. I don't intend on giving up providing for my family, or enjoying my life, just because someone else wants to ruin it for me. I choose to increase my odds of living a long and happy life. Now, as I asked before, can we change the subject. We don't need to be overheard and make anyone uncomfortable."
My friend sort of sat back and just was quiet for a minute. I don't know.... he was thinking.
After like a minute he leans over and says "You're being an idiot. I could disarm you so fast!"
I said "Well, good for you. But I'm sure that we both know that would be an obviously bad decision even if you were just messing around. It's not a toy... it deserves a little more respect than that."
He looked a little insulted so I added "Besides.... you're too slow anyways, ya' big softie".
He laughed. Situation dissolved. I still have a friend and sometimes this particular friend likes to play "dad" to people around him. This is one area where I simply don't feel it's necessary to appease his ego. This isn't about ego's. This is about me exercising my right to defend myself and LIVE!!!!


After dinner we went to my parents house to visit. My parents are very anti gun, but know I am pro-gun in most cases. I carried in their home for 2 hours. they never noticed, or at least didn't say anything.

I have had a few people notice (not that I'm going for that! I guess it just comes naturally in a place where not a lot of people openly carry).
Have gotten comments at Home Depot, 2 local deli's, and a bunch of other little places. Most are positive, or the local businesses give you the "We like having customers like you!!!" routine.

Even my pastor was excited to see me carrying. He wanted to see my gun... which I wasn't crazy about doing, but he is one of the few people in my life I really have respect for on a high level. Plus he's thinking of getting a pistol so I was glad to see his enthusiasm.
We were alone at the church, but I still required that we go into his office, and shut the door. That he allow me to completely unload the gun and that he can hold it but there will be no magazine in the gun (remained in my hand at all times). He thought it was great and I was able to answer a lot of questions for him about his own desire to purchase and possibly obtain his CCW in a class I'll be taking with some other churchgoers next month or so.

I've had 2 other requests to "see my gun" to which I've kindly declined and said "I'm really sorry, but it's not leaving the holster. Please understand." And they both have.

So...... here's what I think...

The big issue is my wife I guess. My friends wouldn't have even noticed I was carrying if it weren't for her blurting it out. Anyone know how I should get the ball rolling on talking about this with my wife and asking her not to draw attention to the fact that I am now carrying? I mean... she's gonna get us shot or kicked out of a place!!!! OR something.
Thanks in advance THR! This posting is a mess because while writing it I've gone back in and added and edited it a lot. Sorry if it doesn't seem like coherent thoughts. Just kept adding stuff.

 

[Rich K]

I would ask her not to make a big deal out of this, which i see you already have as well.
My next step would be to TELL her to keep quiet and not bring the subject up in public again.

Personally, if my wife didn't respect my wishes on this particular subject, I would start looking form a new one.
I am divorced by the way, but guns had nothing to do with the divorce.
She really does not respect you very much, it seems.

 

[Vermont]

It sounds to me like you have handled the situations that have come up perfectly. I find it hard to believe that no one would notice your gun for 3 hours. Any chance you could post a picture so we could see how obvious it is? It's not that I don't believe you, I just want to see how unobservant most people are.


Rich K,
I don't think it is quite fair to make judgments about someone's wife based on a post on an internet forum. Maybe she doesn't feel safe with her husband carrying. She may be wrong (or not) but I doubt it is about disrespecting him. Husbands and wives are allowed to disagree. Expecting someone to agree with you all the time is what would really be disrespectful.

 

[misANTHrope]

Sounds like you handled the friend situation extremely well.

 

[WayneConrad]

Rick K, you wrote that it seems to you that Nightwing's wife must not respect him very much. To her, it be as though her husband has suddenly changed well known and established rules, unilaterally. I think you've judged her harshly. Also: No man has a right to "TELL" his wife to keep quiet. "Urge," "ask" and "request" are ways that people who respect each other ask someone to hold their tongue. If "tell," then respect is already lost (or never was gained) and the relationship is based on power alone.

Nightwing, Nice job deflecting slings and arrows. You are quick thinker under pressure, I think. Please keep your marriage strong. Your wife has come this far with you. Don't push open carry so quickly and so far that the strain on her is too much. You carry to protect your family. Don't let your mission--to protect your family--end up causing too much strain with your wife, or you may end up fracturing what you mean to protect.

 

[Pilot]

Edited. Except in Denver, I would not expect too much reaction to OC in Colorado. Good luck.

 

[jerkface11]

You'd be amazed by the things people will refuse to notice.

 

[GeezerwithGuns]

Hello from Littleton Colorado:

I like the fact that I can open carry in Colorado and I do - sometimes. It really depends on where I'm going and what I'm doing and also what I'm wearing.

I also have a CCW permit, so most of the time (90%) I carry concealed and nobody knows. If they don't know, they don't care. My wife, fortunately, supports me in this and a large percentage of my friends are also armed as well. So I've never really been put in a situation like yours where I've been challenged about carrying. I have, however, had a couple of people ask me when I'm carrying openly if I'm an off-duty LEO. More often than not, people don't say a thing - or whisper, "Look he's carrying a gun." No challenges though.

The "let me see you gun" stuff does bother me - nobody gets to handle my carry gun - Repeat nobody. It only comes out of the holster for two reasons: Either to use it in an emergency, or when I remove it and safe it at the end of the day...... Period.

When you went out to dinner carrying, I hope you were not consuming any alcohol. That could and would be a real problem.

Another thing to consider is if you are "open carrying" and do not have a CCW, and you happen to be wearing a coat or article of clothing that happens to conceal (even partially obscure) your firearm - you are breaking the law, so be careful.

With all that said, I would really suggest you carry concealed. If you don't have a CCW, then get one. They are relatively easy to come by in Colorado. Costs a little money and takes a little time, but well worth it and best of all, avoids the situations you described.

 

[TheReeves]

If I remember correctly, Nightwing is not yet able to get his CCW.

 

[JWarren]

It is not my place to say, but I would be very disappointed with my wife's behaviour at dinner.

Regardless of her views, my wife has enough respect for me not to call me out to others-- including "friends." Fortunately, my wife reminds me to get a handgun before we go anywhere.

I frankly see what you described as one of the issues of our society-- lack of respect for our partner.

Jenn has no problem voicing her views with me... in private. Jenn has no problem criticizing me... in private. I am the same with her.

Neither of us would make an effort draw out issues in public. There, we are a team. A united front.



Jenn and I have a unique perspective. Either of us pull a stunt like your wife did, we are both quite capable of demonstrating that the "Or Worse" part of 'For Better or For Worse" can truly mean. And we both know better.


YMMV.


-- John

 

[Harpo]

We were joking around after about 3 hours and just being sort of silly. Well my wife finally goes "You wanna know something stupid? Joel is carrying a Gun!"

Aside from her rather rude willingness to criticize your decisions in front of your friends, this raises another issue. When you are out and about with your family, you comprise a "tactical unit". If one member of that unit disagrees with your defense tactics, you could find yourself facing an extra enemy in any confrontation. Perhaps you should rethink carrying when she is present, until you two resolve this difference.

Harpo

 

[Standing Wolf]

"Why would I shoot someone"?
"Because you have a gun"!

Heck. I guess my guns have been slacking off the past 40 years now, because they've never made me shoot anyone.

 

[DWH]

Nightwing,
Forgive me if I didn't read this in your posts, but what side arm are you carrying? What holster are you using? Good luck on swaying your wife nearer to yourside! And... here's a pat on the back for a job well done, and well wishes for your future promotion of responsible firearm use.

 

[torpid]

We were joking around after about 3 hours and just being sort of silly. Well my wife finally goes "You wanna know something stupid? Joel is carrying a Gun!"

Red card
Player, please leave the field immediately.

(loves me the footie!)

 

[frankie_the_yankee]

The big issue is my wife I guess. My friends wouldn't have even noticed I was carrying if it weren't for her blurting it out. Anyone know how I should get the ball rolling on talking about this with my wife and asking her not to draw attention to the fact that I am now carrying?

What I can't quite understand is why you are kidding yourself into thinking that you are carrying openly and not trying to "draw attention" to the fact that you're carrying. Because the fact is that you will sometimes draw attention, whether you are "trying" to or not. So in effect, your intentions are immaterial. You're doing what you're doing, no matter what you think about it.

Other people may have better things to do than check you out while you're in public, but you can't realistically expect to OC without it sometimes being noticed.

If you actually do want to carry without drawing attention to yourself, cut the baloney, step into the real world, and carry concealed.

 

[PennsyPlinker]

If you actually do want to carry without drawing attention to yourself, cut the baloney, step into the real world, and carry concealed.

Frankie, lots of people carry openly on a daily basis, and the last time I looked, we all live in the real world. If you want to disagree, fine, but leave out the insults. How many proponents of OC tell you you are behaving like a criminal because you are carrying concealed? None? Right. But the time was, a man who concealed his gun was a criminal. What are you frankie?

 

[NickEllis]

I don't agree with you, frankie. Most places around here (Colorado), you really can open carry, and not draw attention to yourself. Perhaps not where you're from (yankee?), but its certainly not unusual around here to OC, and the vast majority will not notice.

 

[Jorg Nysgerrig]

If Nightwing has only been open carrying since Friday, has already had 3 people as to "see" his gun and has "gotten comments at Home Depot, 2 local deli's, and a bunch of other little places", it sure doesn't sound like he is doing an outstanding job not drawing attention to himself.

 

[romma]

I would carry the way I want to carry, instead of asking a girlfriend or wife how they would like me to carry... That is the only thing in your story I might comment on.

Personally, I would conceal rather than open carry, especially going out with friends, but I still think it should be your choice..

 

[frankie_the_yankee]

Frankie, lots of people carry openly on a daily basis, and the last time I looked, we all live in the real world.

Fine. Just don't try to kid yourselves, or to kid me, into thinking that you are not expecting to draw any attention.

Because if you really weren't intending to draw attention to yourselves, you'd carry concealed.

 

[JWarren]

If you actually do want to carry without drawing attention to yourself, cut the baloney, step into the real world, and carry concealed.

In defense of Frankie, he DID qualify his statement with "If you actually do want to carry without drawing attention to yourself."

I'll take that as his meaning.

If that's not it, I'll have to point out that the "REAL" world is often interpreted largely through one's own eyes and perspectives. I doubt anyone here is qualified to make a blanket statement as to what the "real" world is for everyone.

Around here, the REAL world doesn't bat an eye at Open Carry 99% of the time. Now, around here, we have basic customs of not OC'ing into certain places. Around here, we use common sense, and it seems to work really well.


-- John

 

[FerFAL]

We were joking around after about 3 hours and just being sort of silly. Well my wife finally goes "You wanna know something stupid? Joel is carrying a Gun!"
Both of my friends go to complete seriousness. My buddy says "You are? Where?"
I say "In plain open view. It's no big deal. So what were we talking about"?
He says "Yes it is a big deal, you idiot! You're going to shoot someone".
"Why would I shoot someone"?
"Because you have a gun"!
keep in mind this friend of mine likes guns. I don't know where he was coming from with this.
He says "Dude. You are making a childish decision to carry that thing, and you're drawing attention to yourself".

Seems that your friends, and what’s even worse, your wife, have little respect for you. I’d change my attitude a bit, make people respect you more.
Your friends? “I’m an adult and I wont discuss this with you, ok?. If I bother you so much maybe I should find other friends. So, should we continue with our dinner or should I be leaving?”
Your wife? Ask her to follow you for a word, and when you are in a private place, explain to her that you wont have people referring to you as “stupid”, specially your wife!

And by the way, yes CC is wiser. If I’m a nut looking to kill people and I see you are armed, you are the one getting shot first.

FerFAL

 

[JesseL]

Frankie,
What draws you to post these comments every time OC comes up?

I don't particularly want to be noticed when I OC. I know that it will occasionally draw attention, and I know that most of the time it won't draw any attention. What I want is for OC to be unremarkable, even to those who notice. It shouldn't be too hard as we're already 99.9% there. I get a verbal reaction to my openly carried sidearm about every 6 months, and 7/8 of those are positive.

Nightwing's wife's remark would have been pretty inconsiderate and disrespectful, regardless of whether it was about his gun, or his shirt, or anything else.

If my wife and I were out with friends and I said "You wanna hear something stupid? Look at the awful color Mish dyed her hair!", I'd be in the doghouse for a long, long time . It doesn't matter that it's right there in the open anyway. You don't call your spouse stupid in public and you don't try to humiliate them about their personal choices in front of friends .

Because if you really weren't intending to draw attention to yourselves, you'd carry concealed.

Unless you're a psychic, don't try telling people what their intentions are. They know better than you do.

 

[PennsyPlinker]

And by the way, yes CC is wiser. If I’m a nut looking to kill people and I see you are armed, you are the one getting shot first.

Once again, the dreaded, I'm going to shoot you first argument. Last time I asked a guy for any proof that this actually happens anywhere except in the minds of internet posters. The best he could come up with was a guy who robbed a bank and shot the floor on the way out, with a ricochet managing to cause a minor flesh wound to a person.

Please document this instance if you can.

And frankie, I actually think we need to draw attention to the guns we carry. There are too many people in society today who are scared stiff of the "man with a gun". They NEED to see normal people carrying guns as a matter of daily living. They need to see that a gun is just one more tool hung on a belt, and that not all gun owners are people bent on mayhem. Just look at the reaction of the one "friend" in the OP's story. An alleged gun guy automatically assumes that because someone has a gun in their possession, they are intent on shooting someone with it! :banghead:

How idiotic is that? Do you, or anyone else here, carry a gun with the intent of shooting people? I would hope not. But the only difference between you and me is that I carry mine out in the open whenever possible.

It is more comfortable.

It is more accessible.

It is a sign that I am willing and able to fight back, not surrender meekly and hope that the bad guy will give me a merciful head shot.

It has nothing to do with being macho. I don't need a gun for that. I can do that all by myself. But the more people who see normal, law abiding gun owners carrying their guns openly, the more guns will be seen for what they really are - normal tools. I am sorry that you feel you are not able to help us, but if you are not going to help, please do us the service of not hindering us.

And for the record, as anyone can see, my screen name carries my location, Pennsylvania. I carry openly in an "eastern" state, as do a number of my fellow Pennsylvanians. It is not for the wild west only.

 

[ridata]

I think I'd agree with Jorg above at post 18.

And TheReeves was correct in stating that Nightwing said he was waiting on his ccw to come.