Open carry in Colorado.... continued!

[torpid]

If Nightwing has only been open carrying since Friday, has already had 3 people as to "see" his gun and has "gotten comments at Home Depot, 2 local deli's, and a bunch of other little places", it sure doesn't sound like he is doing an outstanding job not drawing attention to himself.

Well, those noticing seem to have been actually fairly positive about it.

It was a great experience! actually very calm, as I expected. Got 2 funny comments from some older ladies that were very nice. A small local restaurant owner told me she was glad to see me, and happy to have someone around to protect them (smiling. very nice older lady and her daughter own this little kraut burger place by my house).
Really good experience and I'll be doing it most of the time from now on...
Totally comforting. Very calm and enjoyable day for me...

Have gotten comments at Home Depot, 2 local deli's, and a bunch of other little places. Most are positive, or the local businesses give you the "We like having customers like you!!!" routine.

Even my pastor was excited to see me carrying.

 

[Patrick_Henry]

I think ya'll missed the point on Nightwing's not wanting to be noticed. I don't think he was saying that OC is not going to draw attention, I believe his point was that he is not carrying as a status symbol. This of course is an important difference. Of course OCers draw more attention than CCers even in OC states, it's just gonna happen. And consider that while OC might bump you up the target list it also gives you a faster draw in other situations. The two balances significantly...

 

[FerFAL]

Originally Posted by PennsyPlinker
Once again, the dreaded, I'm going to shoot you first argument. Last time I asked a guy for any proof that this actually happens anywhere except in the minds of internet posters.

So you are what? Posting this through Morse Code?? I love internet posters that try to put down others calling them internet posters, it’s so…ironic.

Please document this instance if you can.

If I can?
Dude, think whatever you want. I wont waste a second explaining to you what is obvious to everyone with two functioning brain cells.
Guy with a gun = guy that can fight back.
If you want to carry openly for political reasons, knock yourself out, but from a strategic point of view, its’ better to go unnoticed until you make your move.

How idiotic is that? Do you, or anyone else here, carry a gun with the intent of shooting people?

Yes, as a matter of fact I do.
I intend to shoot anyone that wants to harm me or my family.

Since there are bad people in this world that are willing to do just that, it is understandable that such people would see me as a problem.
Guns, specially big bore defensive handguns, are intended for just that, shooting people.
If you have a problem when it comes to shooting people, don’t carry a gun. One day you may need to do it.

It is more comfortable.

I’d rather be a bit less comfortable and gain the tactical edge of keeping my weapon hidden.

It is more accessible.

If carrying your weapon concealed slows you down you need to train more, or re evaluate the way you are carrying it concealed.

FerFAL

 

[Kind of Blued]

I'm right with you Nightwing, in both your feelings and your actions, as a fellow Colorado resident, and occasional OC'er.

The biggest and most profound statement that I have heard on open carry recently (read it here) is that the forumite was "Glad that somebody has the balls to (open carry)" implying that he did not, but that he saw the good message that it puts forth to those around you in public.

I think the misunderstanding seems to come from culture, and the way that guns are talked about or thought about where you live. I find it odd (add REALLY discouraging) that people on here (usually CCW'ers) are vehemently opposed to the idea of law-abiding citizens proudly carrying firearms. When there are crooked criminals walking around every day, often shooting up places and injuring innocent people, the only time the average person hears the word "gun" every day is right after the word "robbery" or "rape", etc. I don't see how you would not be thankful that someone like Nightwing here is going through life every day informing people (passively or actively) that guns don't magically kill people. Honest, law-abiding citizens carry guns as a tool, and effectively spread the word of responsible gun ownership, FREE OF CHARGE for YOU, the nay-saying Second Amendment supporter. It seems a little hypocritical to me to shun open carry. It also seems that it is one of the most effective ways to achieve to goal of The High Road, that is to educate or spread the word of responsible firearms ownership.

I do not mean to cause or point out and exacerbate any rift amongst us as Second Amendment supporters, but that is what we (supposedly) are. People who support the right to keep AND BEAR arms. I doubt (jope) anybody here would go as far as to say that Nightwing or I should NOT be able to legally open carry, but the point of many peoples' posts here are that he should do something else.

It boils down to this for me. This is directed at ANYONE that tells ANYONE ELSE not to open carry:

We are proud Americans and we have the right to keep and bear arms. We are doing so and we are thankful for the opportunity. Many people around us are (apparently) not aware that they too have the right to keep and bear arms. The vast majority are excited when they are informed that they are gifted the same right as Americans.

Our families are safe, we are safe, our friends are safe, and we are protecting your and our rights as Americans. Stop telling us that it is a bad idea.

 

[rs25.com]

Nightwing,

My experience with carrying has been somewhat similar to yours. About 6 months ago I started carrying every day. While she protested that I was carrying, the complaints have slowly died off. I never said anything much more than "You'll never know when it might come in handy." and left it at that. Now she doesn't blink an eye.

A few weeks ago I went out of town for business. She called me one night to let me know that someone in a van had pulled up to our house (the only home in a cul-de-sac) in the middle of the night. She told me that she had my gun in hand. I told her to relax, as it was probably nothing, but to keep an eye on the van and try to identify the occupants and get the plate. I then called the local police on the other line and asked them to send someone by to check up. Right about then our roommate came home and the vehicle left. Funny thing is she doesn't really complain about the guns any more...

Therefore, if I were you, I just wouldn't make much of a deal about it. I'm not saying she needs to be scared into using them, but I would bet that she's just testing your maturity level, so I would prove to her that you're competent, cool, collected, and very responsible about it. That's what she really wants to know. IMO.

 

[Kind of Blued]

FerFAL, with all due respect,your points are all sterile and show signs of missing facts in the reading. Maybe you are in a hurry, but it seems you are reading everything and not giving the grace necessary to understand what the text is meaning.

ANYTHING regarding being targeted first by a criminal is an irrelevant point here. Nightwing is signed up for a CCW class in the near future with some people from his church (EVERYBODY missed that thus far...) and open carry is currently his ONLY OPTION.

If you want to talk about the tactical advantage, or being targeted, you should do so properly, by considering the alternative (unless one were to commit a crime) to be unarmed.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that it is the indisputable truth that a guy with a gun on his belt has the tactical advantage when compared to his other option, being unarmed. Is that disputable?

The logic of the original poster's friend was this:

You have a gun. Therefore you ARE going to shoot someone.

You just displayed that you either agree with this, or you didn't read properly. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you are in a hurry.

I also challenge you to do this exercise:

With a timer designed for shooting sports and a friend (like they do in IPSC, IDPA, etc.) compare your draw and fire times from concealment to your times when carrying on your hip, openly.

If you can draw and fire as fast or faster from concealment, please explain how you did so, as I would like to make use of your technique.

I'm nto attacking you, I'm just saying if we're going to discuss an issue amongst ourselves, we should respond to what we are responding to, and not respond to a distorted view of what we read because we didn't read it very carefully. It is for the good of the discussion. Thus, please let me know if I have been out of line anywhere, as I took the liberty to do so under the assumption that we are all looking for a form of understanding on this topic... understanding, not agreement.

Thanks.

 

[PennsyPlinker]

Wow, FerFAL, I see a lot of anger, a lot of bombast, but not a lot of information being conveyed. Is this the best response you can manage? I did not put you or anyone else down. I merely stated that the scenario of a bad guy shooting an OC person first in a crime has only been seen in the assertions of posters on the internet. How is that a put down? Since you are so sure it happens, you should have the evidence to back up your ideas at your fingertips. Apparently you don’t. Instead, you insult me, insinuating that since I asked you for evidence, I must not have two brain cells to rub together.

For the record, most people who carry guns legally do not go out with the intent of shooting other people. They go out armed, as do I, with the intent of protecting themselves if need be. I am sorry my language was not clear enough for you to make that distinction. Do you get it this time? Millions of people in our country carry guns every day without shooting people. I’ve actually drawn my weapon twice in situations where threats were made to my safety, and in neither case did I have to shoot. Using your criteria, I would have unloaded my magazine on the bad guy. I don't need to live with that if I don't have to. I wonder if you have ever really confronted that situation yourself.

Perhaps you think that your last fling at me, that I should not carry a gun since I might not be comfortable with shooting people, is a real dig. Not so. What makes you so angry FerFAL? And you are angry. Maybe you should reconsider carrying a gun until you get a handle on all that anger.

 

[FerFAL]

HI MdeViney,
Maybe I sounded a bit harsh, just have little tolerance for those that quickly start hitting others with the internet commando stick.
This is the internet, and everyone here, we are all internet users and posters, so accusing people of doing that as if it were a bad thing got old already 5 years ago.
Maybe someone has a big mouth when he’s truly a 40 year old startrek fan fried chicken cemetery still living in mom’s basement? Maybe, but if the idea of not seeming one another’s faces is too much then don’t do it, simply don’t go on line to discuss theses issues.
Of course, open carry versus not carrying at all, open carry is better.

And I applaud the people that open carry due to principle, really do, love the idea of educating the public, but going unnoticed ( when CC is an option) is better from a defensive perspective. And isn’t that really the purpose for carrying the weapon in the first place?
Seriously, if spreading the word is what you have in mind, I think you can do your part by doing other, better things, like talking to people about their rights, take people shooting, educate them. Think is better than just carrying a gun openly and let people push you around like it happened to the original poster. Is he really doing much good that way?
I’m taking a guy from work shooting next week, I feel it’s a good thing, and I’m firm about not allowing people to ridicule the idea of armed self defense when the issue is discussed. That’s my way of doing my part.
About drawing and shooting faster when carrying openly, exactly how do you carry openly? If it has some kind of retention piece, it slows you down, if you don’t then it would be awfully easy for someone to grab your gun when in close quarters, with others near by.
I carry concealed with an IWB holster, covering the gun with a shirt. Its pretty fast, and the gun is out of sight, out of mind.

FerFAL

 

[Markbo]

Just because nobody says anything, does not mean they haven't noticed. I see OC'ers in my business at least weekly. Since it is not legal in Texas, I always presume they are LEO. Plain clothesed Cops, Rangers, Detectives... whatever... are a fact of big city life. Even in the suburbs. But I don't go running up to them and tell them I see they're carrying.

Neither have I ever asked to see ANYone else's gun except in the confines of someone's home or while hunting. I don't carry open. If it were legal, would I? Probably not. Why? Mostly I do not want to attract the attention.

I'm not worried about the being the first one shot (although it is very easy to document this is true... have you never read or heard about the security guard at a bank robbery being the only one shot?), I just prefer to go through life outside of work as anonymously as possible. It's a humility thing with me.

It is a lifestyle choice, not a political decision. I prefer to be humble, quiet, respectful of others, helpful and friendly and when I can float in and out of Home Depot without feeling I am being stared at is fine with me. Would OC change that? I believe it absolutely would. Nightwing even mentioned he 'has a new found confidence'.

That statement alone strikes me me that something is not settled within Nightwing. I don't carry to make me confident. I am a confident person already. If carrying a gun makes you feel confident, you are placing a very human need on a very inanimate object. Not to get too psychiatric about it, but what within you is NOT confident that you think a gun will fix?

 

[FerFAL]

PennsyPlinker,you think you made me angry? Dude, you have no idea what I’m dealing with right now. A guy with a bit of a confusion regarding guns and tactics is the last thing I worry about, specially these days.

Look, I didn’t mean to insult you, but you have to be pretty hard headed or pretty naïve if you can’t see why displaying a weapon isn’t wise. Not because weapons are bad or anything, but because it’s information that is none of other’s business, and can be used against you.

Yes, I know of many cases where the guy with the gun was the first one to get shot, or that got shot right away by robbers because they saw his gun.
If you don’t believe me or you don’t grasp the idea of this ever happening, I wont be loosing sleep over it, I don’t have the need to go looking for something that may convince you of that.

FerFAL

 

[frankie_the_yankee]

Frankie,
What draws you to post these comments every time OC comes up?

Because I think that a lot of people who OC are doing it for what essentially amount to political reasons. Yet they kid themselves or try to kid others that this is the furthest thing from their minds.

I don't particularly want to be noticed when I OC.

Yeah, right. That's like the people swinging leather tassles from their bodies in the annual SF Gay Pride Parade saying that they do not want to be noticed. They want for that behavior to be unremarkable, so that no one pays any special attention to them while they are doing it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by frankie_the_yankee
Because if you really weren't intending to draw attention to yourselves, you'd carry concealed.

Unless you're a psychic, don't try telling people what their intentions are. They know better than you do.

I'll tell people what ever I please. I disagree that they necessarily know their intentions better than I do. I see people kidding themselves all the time.

And OC'ers who claim that they do not want to be noticed are right up near the top of the list.

Say you do it because you like to.

Say you do it because you believe it is a deterrent.

Say you do it because it's more comfortable.

Say you do it because you can draw faster.

Say you do it to make a political statement, or to raise people's consciousness.

Just don't try to kid yourself or to kid me into thinking that you don't want to be noticed. Because in today's society, that is utter nonsense.

 

[Nightwing]

Wow. Huge discussion here!

First of all... I have a life long history of letting people walk all over me. I was always the guy in my group of friends that people called "Loser" and "Stupid" and "fat ass" and stuff like that. Well... now that I've gotten older I've gotten past the fact that those words were spoken. I realize that people are selfish and egotistical and need whipping boy to make themselves feel better. Problem is that I have a hard time getting out of this rut.
My wife has sided with some of these friends on many occasions and goes to a disrespectful level. Now it's part of my life. I'm trying to change that but it's a long road to re-program your friends. Friends it's a little easier to do. But my wife.... well... here's how it goes.

"Joel. That's stupid! You're being stupid"
"Honey... I don't appreciate you being disrespectful towards me"
"Well I'm allowed my own opinion. You're disrespecting me by no allowing me my own opinion".

Uphill battle. It'll take a few more years to get past it, but I'm rejecting everyone's suggestion of divorce. Sure we got married young and maybe it was a mistake, but I made a commitment and I have a kid. Gotta stick it out and try. God knows it's been hell for a few years.... it's getting better... I think.


Second, to the guy that said I'm doing a lousy job of not drawing attention..... I'm sorry to disappoint you. I have the gun 100% openly displayed. If someone notices.... so what? If the comment... SO WHAT? It's totally legal and I really don't care. I'm not carrying it to impress anyone, and I'm certainly not making sure that anyone sees it. If it happens, it happens. If it doesn't, then good for me!



I have become a more self confident person in the last 2 years. Through major problems with my wife, my weight, and my confidence.... I needed a change.
I have started taking care of my life. I eat healthier, get much more exercise. Spend good quality time with my son. Spend MORE time helping other people in my community, even if it means sacrificing things I WANT TO DO. I also am more interested in my legal rights and the world around me. I want to always know as much as I can. I am learning to demand respect from those around me, just as they demand of me. And I am aware of the fact that there is very real evil in this world. I may never encounter it in it's truest form first hand, but if I do I refuse to willingly become a victim. I choose the option of life for myself, and anyone around me that didn't choose it for themselves.

Thanks for the good words guys. And don't waste your time fighting with the 3 guys in this thread that just want an argument. Not worth it. People that carry on like that need a reminder that: "It is better for people to think you're a fool and to keep your mouth shut, than to open it and remove all doubt".

Much love THR. Good to nestle my way into this community. This board actually has helped me learn a lot of things. I appreciate all of you.... even the jerks.


AAAAND......

I'll tell people what ever I please. I disagree that they necessarily know their intentions better than I do. I see people kidding themselves all the time.

Man.. .you'd be good in politics! Assuming you know people better than they know themselves..... good for you. Just.... good for you!

And OC'ers who claim that they do not want to be noticed are right up near the top of the list.
Say you do it because you like to.
Say you do it because you believe it is a deterrent.
Say you do it because it's more comfortable.
Say you do it because you can draw faster.
Say you do it to make a political statement, or to raise people's consciousness.
Just don't try to kid yourself or to kid me into thinking that you don't want to be noticed. Because in today's society, that is utter nonsense.

Never claimed I didn't want to be noticed. I claimed I was not going to try and draw attention to myself. If I'm noticed or not isn't in my control. Only my reaction can be controlled. And the word "controlled" should well define my reaction. Then again.... you know me better than I know myself..... so.... maybe I don't even know what I really believe?

 

[LKB3rd]

It is a lifestyle choice, not a political decision. I prefer to be humble, quiet, respectful of others, helpful and friendly and when I can float in and out of Home Depot without feeling I am being stared at is fine with me. Would OC change that? I believe it absolutely would. Nightwing even mentioned he 'has a new found confidence'.

That statement alone strikes me me that something is not settled within Nightwing. I don't carry to make me confident. I am a confident person already. If carrying a gun makes you feel confident, you are placing a very human need on a very inanimate object. Not to get too psychiatric about it, but what within you is NOT confident that you think a gun will fix?

Maybe the confidence of being able to defend himself effectively is missing when he doesn't have a gun.
I think it is reasonable to feel more confident in your safety with a gun on your person, and I would not recommend any psychiatric evaluations for that.
I have open carried a few times. When I did it in New Hampshire, I left my driver's license in my car, because I was concerned that a leo would ask me to "produce my papers." You are not required to show papers to walk down the street in the United States. Nor do you need permission(carry permit) to carry a gun as long as it is openly carried in New Hampshire.
It felt great!
When I posted about it over at opencarry.org, and mentioned how I left all ID in my car, I got a response along the lines of.. "Ah yes, sterile carry. It does feel great. That is the feeling of being a free man." Perhaps this is the feeling he is talking about.

 

[misterwhipple]

I don't carry to make me confident. I am a confident person already. If carrying a gun makes you feel confident, you are placing a very human need on a very inanimate object.

In my own case, which may or may not be similar to Nightwing's, it is not the gun or the carrying that makes me feel more confident. It's the decision to take responsibility for myself, as expressed in the carrying of a gun, among other things.

The act of confronting my fear of what people will think of me also probably has something to do with it.

 

[Treo]

I can smell the lock coming & I want to get my two cents in before it hits.

I choose not to open carry, not for any tactical reason but because I see it as a way of handing people I don't want in my life in the first place an open invitation into my life. When I'm out in the world I'm not looking to interact W/ a bunch of random strangers, I want to be left alone. I don't want people I don't want people I don't know trying to start conversations W/ me about my gun.

Second reason I won't open carry, is all it takes is one idiot to pick up the phone, call 911 & say "Man W/ a gun" and my life just got much more complicated than I ever wanted it to, and there's nothing I can do to stop it happening.

I just don't need the hassel.

 

[JesseL]

Just don't try to kid yourself or to kid me into thinking that you don't want to be noticed. Because in today's society, that is utter nonsense.

"Today's society" is an incomplete term. Society isn't any more geographically homogeneous than it is temporally. Wherever you happen to be, it might be the case that anyone open carrying is looking for attention. Around here, people have been open carrying ever since Europeans settled the region and it's never stopped. In my neighborhood, OC still falls withing the range of "normal".

So at what point in the time since my town was founded (1864) do you believe everyone who open carried here suddenly switch from being "sensibly armed" to "attention craving show-offs"?

I'm not kidding myself and I'm not kidding you. I know that OC will be noticed to a small extent, and I know that that has nothing to do with why I do it. Telling me that I'm wrong when I tell you my reasons for OC means you either think I'm a liar or an idiot, and I don't appreciate either implication, so why not admit that you don't know it all when it comes to people's motivations or their regional societies?



BTW, what was your reason for open carrying when you visited AZ?

 

[chris in va]

My (female) friend used to do the same exact thing every time I carried. I'd get ready to go out and strap on my Sig, and she'd roll her eyes calling me 'paranoid'. One time in public she loudly asked if I was carrying.

I told her very firmly do NOT ever do that again. Didn't explain further either. She said, "But I can't help it", whatever that means.

However, all that ceased when we started hearing about attempted kidnappings in the local WalMart parking lot and several home invasions. Once she saw what was REALLY going on around us, it struck a chord with her and she hasn't said anything in over a year.

When I'm out in the world I'm not looking to interact W/ a bunch of random strangers, I want to be left alone

+1. Totally agree. I wish we could open carry here without having to hear endless comments from the bug eyed locals.

Oh, by the way guys. In VA we're required to open carry if we eat at a restaurant serving alcohol...or leave it in the car. Not a political message, just the way things are.

 

[frankie_the_yankee]

BTW, what was your reason for open carrying when you visited AZ?

Curiosity, and because I could.

 

[JesseL]

BTW, what was your reason for open carrying when you visited AZ?

Curiosity, and because I could.

Are you sure you weren't subconsciously trying to be noticed and draw attention to yourself?

 

[jrfoxx]

For those making comments about the OP's decision to open carry, I have to ask.....Did you even read his question in the first post? Becasue I dont recall him asking your opinion on the wisdom of open carry.I dont see why you feel the need to make conclusion based on you OPINION, not FACT about what his intentions are, why he does what he does, or the wisdom of OC. All of that has NOTHING to do with what he asked, and, like it always does when the topic of open carry comes up, will just end up into a huge, long debate about OC vs. CC, and derail the OP's thread, and he ends up getting no help on the question he asked.If you want to debate open carry, wait for someone to start a thread on that topic, or start one yourself, and have at it.Otherwise, its pretty freakin' rude to threadjack Nightwing's thread, and send it off topic, and likely locked, becasue you cant read and/or control your opinions.All your doing is likely screwing him out a a chance to get HIS question answered and HIS topic discussed.The open carry vs. concealed carry thing always has both sides making the same arguments, no one has any actual facts to back anything up, it just gets ugly, nobody is changing anybody's mind on the subject, and its a lot like the .45 vs 9mm, AR vs AK thing at this point.Just not cool, IMHO.
I apologize for the rant, but this happens EVERY time someone mentions open carry at all, in any way, no matter if they actually want to discuss debate the merits of OC, or just want to offer thier experiance, get a legal question answered, or something else that is in no way related to the merits/opinions of OC vs CCW.



Now, to join those who ACTUALLY bothered to discuss the topic the OP wants discussed, I would simply ask my wife why she felt the need to bring up the topic, when it was clear than no one had noticed, or if they did, didnt seem to care to discuss it.Once she answers, you politely tell her you dont appreciate discussing it in public, and ask nicely for her to not bring it up, especially if no one else has, and then just go from there depending on what her answer/response is.

 

[savetheclaypigeons]

As of now it's a Right. As long as you are respectful, representing gun owners in a very positive light, and legal everyone here should support anything you do.

Now more importantly, what gun did you carry?

As for the wife, treating her how you are treated could help. Not quite a psychiatrist but here's what I would do. She says something degrading. I ask her to stop. She cries, I try to reason. Within the next half hour if she says something you don't like, turn her words around. She hoots and hollars about your lack of intellect and personal appearance(1 thing every girl has an issue with), sarcastically rip on her about the 1 college class she failed, and her ugly new curtains. Immediately ask her how it feels and reinforce how you do not appreciate it and ask her to stop. Finally mention that her curtains are pretty, you were only making a point. May get the dog house treatment for the night, but it'd get worse otherwise IMO. Just reading your post, it sounds as if you are a little passive. 'Biting back' may shock her and make her take a step back and remember who you are, not the person who gets the emotional baggage and chores passed to.

Whew. May have saved you a few bucks in marriage counseling. now back on topic!

 

[Treo]

Ok original question, tell the wife privately that you didn't appreciate what she did & ask her to stop doing it. Since you seem to be active in the church I'd say suggest she read Ephsieans 5:20 to the end of the chapter.

 

[Sage of Seattle]

"Joel. That's stupid! You're being stupid"
"Honey... I don't appreciate you being disrespectful towards me"
"Well I'm allowed my own opinion. You're disrespecting me by no allowing me my own opinion".

"I cannot -- will not -- respect anyone's opinion if it's an insult, especially directed at me."

Oh, the heck with it. There's nothing you can say at this point to change any of those negative dynamics in your relationship, except "see ya."

I was always the guy in my group of friends that people called "Loser" and "Stupid" and "fat ass" and stuff like that. Well... now that I've gotten older I've gotten past the fact that those words were spoken.

I'm sorry, my friend, but you "were" always the guy people berated, and you still are.

By the way, you are in an abusive relationship and she is the abuser. It happened to me and it happens to way more men than are ever willing to admit. Emotional abuse is just as severe, sometimes more so, than physical abuse. Depression, dependency (on her or on drugs/alcohol), suicide/thoughts of suicide, anger management issues... it gets bad. Insuting you and dismissively defending her nasty behavior, especially in front of others, does not show a loving, caring woman.

I'll say this about the gun, I'm glad you're open carrying. Just think what would have happened if you were CCing and she ran her big mouth like that. Boy, being outed in that way would've given many THR members an f'ing heart attack (going by how high-strung some of them seem).

One final question to you, Nightwing, just something to think about: if it came right down to it, which would you rather show your son? A father who left an abusive relationship and still spent quality and quantity time with his son, or a father who stayed and showed him exactly how to demonstrate a lack of self-worth and shameful submission to a domineering and abusive spouse? Whether you realize it or not, you're teaching your child. It's up to you to teach the right thing. The really neat part about it is that you get to learn too, in the process!

 

[DerbyDale]

I may be wrong, but it sounds to me like you are pushing this on her, and that is a bad thing.

My wife was very anti at one time, and didn’t even want a gun in the house. The key word there is WAS. She grew up in a home without guns around, and had been indoctrinated by the schools and media that guns are evil killing machines. I knew I had my work cut out for me, but I knew if I didn’t push it down her throat. I could gradually educate and change her mind. I just had to do it one baby step and a time.

Get her used to even having a gun in the home:
When I brought my first pistol home. I promised to keep it unloaded and with a trigger lock on it at all times. I also promised not to even get it out, unless I was headed to the range. Let her know that with it unloaded and a trigger lock on, it was just a big hunk of steal and was not dangerous at all.

Once she felt at ease with this single hunk of steel in the home. I brought home my first 22 rifle that my Dad had given me when I was 7. Let her know that this would also be unloaded at all times and was safe. Also told her this was a little 22 I would shoot with my Dad when I was 7! Not exactly a machine-gun, and I let her know because there was no recoil it was very FUN to shoot. Even hinted she should go with me to the range for the first time. (she refused to go)

Give her a few weeks of getting used to now having two guns in the home. I was making weekly trips to the range and coming how telling her how nice the day was and how I wish she would go and see for herself. If she didn’t like it, I wouldn’t ask her to go again. Who knows if she liked it, that would be one more thing we could enjoy together! The key word there is TOGETHER since we are a team. Once at the range I went slow and let her watch me shoot the 22 a few times. Then I slowly explained all the safety rules and how to shoot it. Turn out she was a pretty good shot. I also brought some cans, as we all know shooting paper can get a little boring. The smile on her face every time she made those cans jump was priceless. We now had a sport that we BOTH enjoyed.

Now that she is at least a little comfortable with the guns in the house and shooting them. We can now have intelligent conversation about guns. We can talk about the idiocy of “Gun Free Zones” and that the only people who are going to obey that sign are the Good Guys. So now we have a place where only the bad guys are armed. Every time a shooting at a school, mall, or restaurant would come on the news. I would just comment that if someone other than the psycho had been armed, how many more people might have been saved. The police are always minutes away and how many times can you pull the trigger in 6-20minutes? I would email her videos like THIS. Soon she is the one making the comments and sending me videos. Next thing I know we are watching the news and a woman in a church saves hundreds of people because she was armed and stopped a mad man at the New Life Church. What do you know, a gun in the hands of the “Good Guys” is a Good thing! Now she enjoys reading "The Armed Citizen" every month in my American Rifleman magazines.

I just got my CCW permit and I do carry when I can. I don’t make a point to tell her when I do. She just knows that I do and she is OK with it. I don’t recommend open carry even though its legal here. It just upsets too many sheepeople and I don’t have time to educate them all. Open carry can also make you a target if someone wants to steal a gun. Ever notice that OD LEOs don’t open carry… They don’t want the attention that it attracts and not being noticed is a good thing.

 

[PennsyPlinker]

Well, to get back to the OP myself - as I am guilty of digressing as well...

Nightwing, I think you have problems on several levels that you need to deal with. First and foremost is your wife. Guns aside, she should not be insulting you like that in public. Teasing is one thing, but real insults are the sign of a deeper issue, and the contention over your gun is only a symptom. I am one of those who think kids need two parents, and if at all possible, the two who brought them into the world, so I would urge you to continue with your plan of getting along with her. That does not mean you have to give in every time she pitches a fit, but it will require a lot more effort in some cases when you really want what you know is right.

Your friends are that - friends. But are they really friends, or just acquaintances? A real friend is not going to run you down. If these people can't come around, then you need to get some new ones. If you are, as you describe, the one who is always picked on as the loser, then maybe you should get some new friends anyway.

Carrying openly or concealed is a choice to be made. There are lots of factors. I am a strong proponent of open carry, and do so myself on a regular basis. Still, there are times when I find it prudent to conceal. I realize that you do not have your concealed permit yet, so if you have not already initiated the process, get it going. Mrs. Plinker was sure I was going to be arrested or at least hassled when I started OC. She grew up in a household where guns were not present. My in-laws were not so much vocal antis as they were people who never mentioned guns - ever. So, to make her more comfortable, I did not do it when she was out with me. But I have had 25 years plus to work on her. She is almost ready to carry herself, both CC and OC.

So get your permit, and carry concealed when you are out with Mrs. Nightwing. Give her a chance to get comfortable with it. Allow her to see articles regarding people who have suffered assaults and could have, or even better, did defend themselves. It is a gradual process. But you do not need to back down. And tell your friend you must not be drawing too much attention to yourself, since it took over three hours and someone calling his attention to your gun for him to notice it.