Those of you who feel a .380 is underpowered for ccw, would you carry a 9X18?

[Dr_2_B]

I realize this is an obscure question, but my interest in the 9X18 (some call it 9mm makarov) has been piqued again lately. For those of you who consider the .380 just below your threshold for ccw (i.e. you wouldn't carry a .380 but you carry 9mm or 38spl), would you carry 9X18?

 

[GRIZ22]

I carry a 380 once in a while. I don't really consider the 9x18 a significant improvement.

 

[INSULATION TIM]

Isn't that the 9mm Makarov?

 

[speaksoftly]

.380 hurts...anyone who disagrees is welcome to post a vid of him taking a shot from one and keeping a straight face. ;-)

 

[Evil Monkey]

All I know is that 9mm Makarov is much cheaper to train with than 380. Trigger time with your handgun and being proficient with your handgun is all that matters.

 

[David E]

For the same size and weight of a 9x18, if not less, you can have a 9mm, .40 or possibly even a .45

The 9x18 is nothing more than a .380 + P

 

[Snowdog]

My short answer would be "no", it's not enough.

To elaborate, my reason for carrying a concealed firearm is quite simple: to provide safety for my family should deadly force be require to ensure our safety/survival.

I want every advantage I can get if pressed to use lethal force. When I have at least a couple locked-breech handguns chambered in 9x19 that are every bit as compact as most blowback handguns chambered in 9x18, why would I opt for something in 9x18?.
Not to say that I would feel particularly vulnerable if I were toting my CZ82, but I would much rather carry my equally reliable (and equally sized) UC9 or Kahr K9. There are smaller 9mm's still.

I personally know plenty who will argue the merits of carrying even a .25acp for primary carry and that's all fine and dandy; their choice doesn't directly affect the safety of my family.
Besides, I certainly wouldn't want to get shot with a .25acp (or stabbed with a knife, clubbed with a bat, hit with a rock, shot-in-the-eye-with-a-paintball, etc) as I'm no enthusiast of pain. I suspect the same from those with criminal intent. Indeed, simply having a gun is sometimes enough.
Just not for me.

Bottom Line (of this long-winded elaboration):
Though I'm quite aware both the .380acp and 9x18 are fully capable of halting an attack, it's not enough for me. I would prefer at least a 9x19 to use when "the balloon goes up" if given a choice (which I am), especially when halting the attack is a matter of life-and-death for my family.

 

[JohnKSa]

I consider them both to be underpowered but I have carried and would still carry either one. Just because they don't measure up to the cartridges in the service pistol performance class doesn't mean they're useless--not by a long shot.

 

[harmon rabb]

You know, my personal problem with .380 isn't so much the round itself, as I think modern jhp designs overcome a lot of the past inadequacies of .380. It's that .380 is typically carried in pocket pistols, like my LCP, that I can't shoot worth a damn with. I'd feel 10x more comfortable carrying a .380 that I can actually shoot with, such as my Bersa Thunder. Of course, I wouldn't bother carrying the BT, when I have a PT-709 and a PF-9, which are 9mm's and smaller.

So, yes, I'd carry a 9x18 if it's in a pistol I can shoot with. I have carried my cz-82 in the past and did not feel underarmed at all. 13 rounds in a reliable gun with a great trigger that I can shoot well with ain't bad for carry.

Of course, for the weight of my cz-82, I can carry my G27, and move several notches up the ladder in terms of ballistics.

 

[Nasty]

The 9x18 simply has too many advantages...

- Ammo availability
- Ammo cost
- Better performance than the .380

On top of these, the firearms available for 9x18 are just so danged *sweet* as well as being historic and built to military and police standards in real steel.

So yes...I'll carry 9x18 and be fully confident in it power, function and application.

 

[Dr_2_B]

.380 is typically carried in pocket pistols

I believe this is spot-on. The .380 coming out of a 6 inch barrel might be a passable manstopper. But we carry it in mouseguns which don't do much for its performance. I'm afraid that even the 9mm or .40 in those little pistols like the Kahr and Kel-tec don't perform too well.

 

[easyg]

I voted the third option only because I personally don't have much experience with the 9mm Makarov.

From everything that I have read and heard it seems weaker than the 9mm Para.
And since the 9mm Mak pistols tend to be as large as 9mm Para pistols, I can't see any reason to choose a 9mm Mak over a 9mm Para.

 

[harmon rabb]

And since the 9mm Mak pistols tend to be as large as 9mm Para pistols, I can't see any reason to choose a 9mm Mak over a 9mm Para.

Cost. You can pick up a cz-82 or pa-63 for under $200 and the ammo is half the price of 9mm.

For the person needing protection on a tight budget, the 9mm mak pistols are the best out there.

 

[mbt2001]

The 9x18 and the .380 are both historically proven rounds. Are there better rounds. Yes, no question. Are there better rounds that fit in a small, reliable, gun that is light weight, easy to shoot and conceal? Maybe. Are there better rounds that fit all of the above and can be had for under $350? No.

None of the 9mm can be had for that. While the .380's and 9x18's can be had in many packages for $350 or under. Don't forget either that the guns themselves are reliable designs and that those designs would still be shooting when the Kahr, Rohrbaugh, and kel tecs were smoldering.

The Soviets and Eastern Bloc countries have used the snot out of that round. The euro's have used the hell out of the .380 and .32. Those rounds performed well.

 

[FirearmsEnthusiast]

I'd even carry a .22LR let alone a .380 Auto or 9x18mm lol.

 

[gearhead]

While there certainly are more powerful rounds out there, I don't feel that either the .380 or the 9X18 is underpowered per se. A lot depends on the barrel length of the weapon and the choice of the particular round, there seems to be as much as 20%-25% difference in muzzle velocity between the weakest and strongest factory load across the .380/9X18 spectrum. And I own a .45ACP compact pistol with a Crossbreed Supertuck holster for when my wardrobe and my needs make more firepower something I want to consider.

I prefer carrying the 9X18 because I like the choice of weapons that are chambered for the round. My pocket carry is a P64 that's all steel and still comes in at approximately 25 oz. loaded with 6+1 and comes with a safety/decocker and DA/SA trigger. I can sit on it, cinch my seat belt around it, or toss it in the glove box when I have to disarm for the Post Office or some other place where carry is prohibited and I don't have to worry about it being damaged, flexed, tweaked, or otherwise rendered less reliable.

As has been stated already, 9X18 is plentiful and cheap and the stuff that's readily available is as least as powerful as the expensive and still somewhat scarce .380. Honestly, once I have a gun that's light enough to carry comfortably and that is concealable in the pocket of any pair of dress or casual pants I own then I really don't need to keep searching for something that's even lighter and smaller. As long as I'm comfortable and don't feel weighted down by the pistol in my pocket I really prefer to NOT forget that I'm carrying it.

These are my preferences, your priorities will be different.

 

[GLOOB]

Cost. You can pick up a cz-82 or pa-63 for under $200 and the ammo is half the price of 9mm.

? It seems to me that 9x19 ammunition is the same or slightly cheaper than 9x18.

 

[zxcvbob]

Hell with the straight face, I want to see his underwear. I am sure it be full!

And you want to see that? (Pervert.)

I carry a .380, but I'd be much happier carrying a 9x18 -- not because it is marginally more effective, but because I can shoot it better. Haven't found a left-handed holster I like for the CZ82 yet.

 

[harmon rabb]

It seems to me that 9x19 ammunition is the same or slightly cheaper than 9x18.

nope.

www.classicarms.us
www.aimsurplus.com
www.jgsales.com

to name a few selling 9x18 at a much cheaper rate than 9mm

 

[wyocarp]

You know, my personal problem with .380 isn't so much the round itself, as I think modern jhp designs overcome a lot of the past inadequacies of .380. It's that .380 is typically carried in pocket pistols, like my LCP, that I can't shoot worth a damn with.

People don't complain about the Porsche 911 not being able to carry as much or have the ground clearance that my F-350 does, why do we talk about the LCP like it was made for shooting in a bullseye league?

It is strictly a better than nothing form of defense when clothing is going to be light and the threat very close. That being said, I've seen numerous people shoot the LCP out to 30 or 40 feet and be quite effective on human size targets which is further than what the gun is really designed for.

 

[M2 Carbine]

I have 16 Makarovs, 3 P64s, 1 PA-63 and 2 CZ83/82 9x18 pistols, but I don't carry any of them.
Not because I think they won't do the job (I have a good JHP handload that is close to the 9x19).
I don't carry them because, for the weight and size I can carry a 45ACP.

 

[benzy2]

My problem with the 9x18, like others have stated, is that the firearms are the same size as many 9x19 pistols which begs the question of why not step up to 9x19. The one reason I like the .380 is that pistols for it are pocketable. Having tried both 9x18 and 9x19 pistols, I just can't get them into a pocket with any comfort and if I have to draw it is going to be slow to get out. The .380 sized pistols ride much better in a pocket and draw from one much better.

I have faith in the .380 for a CCW. I don't carry often. I live in a low crime area in which most of my daily activities are within 2 miles and I don't feel a need to carry. Obviously I have come to the point where I see any firearm as enough since I am willing to spend the bulk of my time without a firearm. That said, there are instances where I have a bit more fear and do carry. For those I feel comfortable with the .380 as again they typically aren't anywhere that is close to being a rough area. If you could get 9x18 in a .380 sized package without being a wrist breaker I would switch. As is though I find them to be IWB carry pistols and for that I can bump up in firepower. I do feel picking the most powerful option in a certain package size to be a smart goal, and when money becomes a little more available I'm seriously considering a Rohrbaugh R9.

So I voted I don't fit in either category. From a pure ballistics point of view I have no problems carrying a 9x18. From a pistol selection I pass for CCW.

 

[bdb benzino]

? It seems to me that 9x19 ammunition is the same or slightly cheaper than 9x18.

I just got 500 94gr 9x18 HPs from ammo to go for $115, I'd like to see that price on 9mm HP!

 

[benzy2]

I'd like to see that ammo open up like 9mm HP as well.

 

[jeepguy]

i think .380/9mm mak. are both ok to carry. my jeep/truck gun is a cz 82. but my carry is a .45 1911 commander. i feel confident with my cz 82 though & it is the one that i have with me most of the time.