Erich
Member
All right, who wouldn't know that was fake? That's great! By the way, they caught a canis latrans in Central Park yesterday . . . .
http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/03/22/nyc.coyote/index.html
Up until now I respected Ayoob.
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All right, who wouldn't know that was fake? That's great! By the way, they caught a canis latrans in Central Park yesterday . . . .
http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/03/22/nyc.coyote/index.html
larry minn, if you have "no first-hand knowledge" of the allegations, or in fact even any remotely reputable attribution for them, why would you even bring them up? It's this kind of thing that presumably made Mr. Ayoob direct some well-deserved scorn on the internet gun community in general.
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Lobotomy Boy
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Default, sometimes when another poster takes such a low blow at someone else, it's best to ignore it. In dog training it's called negative reinforcement, ie. reinforcing negative behavior. A dog will act out to get attention, and if it gets that attention it will continue to act out. The only way to make it stop is to not give it the attention it seeks.
Justin
Moderator Emeritus
If I see anyone repeating one more rumor, posting any more innuendo, or anything unfounded or untoward in this thread, I will lock it.
The BS to fact ratio is tilting horribly in the wrong direction in this thread.
The BS to fact ratio is tilting horribly in the wrong direction in this thread.
That's interesting, and says something in and of itself.
Cops are civilians. Take it from a military guy - I've seen neither a declaration of war issued by the LEO powers that be, nor by those public officials who would commission law enforcement and issue their badges.
Regarding dragging out all the Herculean rumors attributable to Mas Ayoob and throwing them in his face to personally debunk - methinks Mr. ISP2605 would probably protest less and feel all warm and fuzzy were he to have the respect garnered by Mr. Ayoob, with maybe a Paul Bunyan-esque tale or two thrown in for good measure. You can be my hero, Herr Major. But I have to warn you, I may make a poor acolyte, because I'm one of those LFI graduates. I also carry factory loads in my CCW firearms and home defense weapons, since I have absolutely no desire to be the test case in a post-shooting civil rights trial. Risk management techniques and all...
Cops are civilians. Take it from a military guy - I've seen neither a declaration of war issued by the LEO powers that be, nor by those public officials who would commission law enforcement and issue their badges.
Regarding dragging out all the Herculean rumors attributable to Mas Ayoob and throwing them in his face to personally debunk - methinks Mr. ISP2605 would probably protest less and feel all warm and fuzzy were he to have the respect garnered by Mr. Ayoob, with maybe a Paul Bunyan-esque tale or two thrown in for good measure. You can be my hero, Herr Major. But I have to warn you, I may make a poor acolyte, because I'm one of those LFI graduates. I also carry factory loads in my CCW firearms and home defense weapons, since I have absolutely no desire to be the test case in a post-shooting civil rights trial. Risk management techniques and all...
Ayoob was quite complimentary of THR, but gave a very real caveat:
Well, you're quite welcome, Mr. Ayoob. But it's Bartholomew Roberts. (The name was given correctly earlier in the piece.)
I thought that he summed it up neatly.
Combat Handguns April? March? 2006, page 86.
Well, you're quite welcome, Mr. Ayoob.
But it's Bartholomew Roberts. (The name was given correctly earlier in the piece.) I thought that he summed it up neatly.
Erich
Member
Quite right.
And, I'd note, it's the mark of a real expert to happily direct others to additional sources of expertise (with appropriate caveats). The folks who want to be held up as the sole source of guiding light, in my experience, are often pretty basic in their knowledge. This speaks well of Mr. Ayoob, not that his writings over the past few decades aren't enough to recommend him in and of themselves.
And, I'd note, it's the mark of a real expert to happily direct others to additional sources of expertise (with appropriate caveats). The folks who want to be held up as the sole source of guiding light, in my experience, are often pretty basic in their knowledge. This speaks well of Mr. Ayoob, not that his writings over the past few decades aren't enough to recommend him in and of themselves.
Byron Quick
Moderator In Memoriam
After reading the article completely, I concur with Matt's comments. I found the article to be quite fair and evenhanded in its references to Internet forums in general and to THR in particular.
Sgt Stevo
Member
I keep a roll of coins in my pocket. But not for defense...
massad ayoob
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Matt G:
Ouch! I missed that.
Thanks for the correction, and my apologies to Mr. Roberts.
Ouch! I missed that.
Thanks for the correction, and my apologies to Mr. Roberts.
I love this! We have been given outstanding examples of obviously good and bad net behavior and in spite of this we see people that just won't learn.
For those of you who have maintained the high road as their path of choice, Mr. Ayoob being the most prominent person doing so, thanks! For the rest of the folks that take themselves or the internet too seriously, you've got some excellent examples here of the best behavior to be emulated, try to learn from this.
Much of what's seen on the net is like the medical advice my wife hears in the salon when she's getting her hair done. As a medical professional she gave up trying to correct people years ago in these settings, but when someone says something dangerous that someone else is apparently about to swallow she can't keep quiet. It's amazing the number of times the self-professed medical expert insists upon the accuracy of their advice even when my wife explains her credentials and that the “patient” should seek the advice of their own physician on the question before implementing the measures sworn to.
Remember that a lot of folks come to the net to be heard more than listen and when they run out of useful things to say just can’t seem to stop talking. They love the “sound” of their own “voice” so much that they’ll elaborate and embellish and eventually make crap up just to keep their audience (much like kids tell insane stories about sex and the sex lives of others). This makes the net one of the worst places for information, if you just take it all as of equal value. If you sort the dross from the gems by critical reading you can find more good information faster than anywhere else, but only if you sift all of it.
Thanks Mas, and others, for keeping the standards high here.
For those of you who have maintained the high road as their path of choice, Mr. Ayoob being the most prominent person doing so, thanks! For the rest of the folks that take themselves or the internet too seriously, you've got some excellent examples here of the best behavior to be emulated, try to learn from this.
Much of what's seen on the net is like the medical advice my wife hears in the salon when she's getting her hair done. As a medical professional she gave up trying to correct people years ago in these settings, but when someone says something dangerous that someone else is apparently about to swallow she can't keep quiet. It's amazing the number of times the self-professed medical expert insists upon the accuracy of their advice even when my wife explains her credentials and that the “patient” should seek the advice of their own physician on the question before implementing the measures sworn to.
Remember that a lot of folks come to the net to be heard more than listen and when they run out of useful things to say just can’t seem to stop talking. They love the “sound” of their own “voice” so much that they’ll elaborate and embellish and eventually make crap up just to keep their audience (much like kids tell insane stories about sex and the sex lives of others). This makes the net one of the worst places for information, if you just take it all as of equal value. If you sort the dross from the gems by critical reading you can find more good information faster than anywhere else, but only if you sift all of it.
Thanks Mas, and others, for keeping the standards high here.
I have two thoughts.
First, Ayoob's comments regarding internet forums and bulletin boards are correct - on some levels and with respect to certain individuals.
Second, for those to whom his comments do not apply that fact is as plain on as the nose on your face. However, to those about whom Ayoob speaks this is not at all obvious, and therein lies the rub.
s
First, Ayoob's comments regarding internet forums and bulletin boards are correct - on some levels and with respect to certain individuals.
Second, for those to whom his comments do not apply that fact is as plain on as the nose on your face. However, to those about whom Ayoob speaks this is not at all obvious, and therein lies the rub.
s
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