What Kind of Check-Out Do You Do?

[Minute_Of_Torso]

Besides the choices of caliber and size, what kind of check out do you do on a handgun before it becomes a CCW? Is there a certain amount of rounds that must be fired without a failure? Is there a minimum amount of accuracy at a certain range? Would you even consider carrying a CCW that you had never fired? Is there any requirement for the type and function of controls?

For me, I typically put about 500 rounds through a new or used handgun and test my accuracy with it from anywhere between 7 and 25 yards. As far as accuracy goes, I'll never be a competition shooter again and I don't get to practice as much as I think is necessary, but I like to be able to keep it (as my nickname says) somewhere in the torso of a human-sized target at any reasonable range. I also don't like to carry a gun that has had gun-related failures within that 500 round window. I also like to have a handgun that is an "instinctive pointer" so that I don't have to concentrate too much on where my sights are lined up.

I would be very interested in what everyone else does for consideration of a CCW just in case I've been missing something all these years.

 

[HSMITH]

I run a couple hundred rounds of ammo through a new autoloader before I do anything else to get to know it. Then I like to put at least 250 rounds of carry ammo through a new autoloader before I think about using it for defensive purposes, including several mags as fast as it will cycle to see if it and I are compatible at "OH S__T!!!" speed. Weak hand unsupported shooting sees several mags too. Basically I try to shoot as many different ways as I can with the ammo I intend to keep in the gun.

Wheelguns get a checkup for health, I make sure they SMASH CCI primers and then I check my defensive load for POI. I also pound several cylinders through very quickly, and get the gun HOT. You would be surprised how many revolvers will hang up when hot, particularly stainless guns. One that hangs up when hot tells me it has a tendency to hang up that needs to be addressed. Usually less than 150 rounds before I pronounce them "ready".

Any problems at any point gets the testing started over after the gun is repaired.

 

[Sean Smith]

500 consecutive rounds with no malfuctions using the magazines I'd carry it with. I initially like to test a gun with a couple different kinds of hollowpoints and a couple different kinds of practice FMJ loads.

Accuracy? Two things go into that from the hardware point of view:

- Hardware capability. That's group size @ distance from sandbags or a machine rest. You can never outshoot your gun's mechanical capability, except by random chance. Most factory guns are OK, but some can be pretty appalling, grouping a half foot or even foot at 25 yards under ideal conditions with no operator error.

3" @ 25 yards with good factory ammo is a reasonable minimum expectation here. I've gotten greedy as hell and like <1" @ 25 now, but I wouldn't tell anybody that they "need" that, myself included. Remember that your "wobble" (read: operator error/skill limitations) ADD to this group size to result in your final "real" accuracy shooting the gun. So going from 12" or even 6" to 3" hardware can make a real impact on how accurate you can shoot.

- Ergonomics. How shootable the gun is for you. Here I'd include grip shape, sights and trigger pull... everything that influences your ability to use whatever hardware capability is there. This is a personal choice, but sights that are too small, triggers that are too heavy or uneven, and grip shapes that are awkward are bad news for anyone.

 

[Sean Smith]

Forgot to add: I shoot the gun 2-handed, weak hand only, and strong hand only. Good skills to have, and it is good to know if you are prone to limp wrist a gun into jamming or bump controls under recoil that you aren't supposed to.

 

[cratz2]

I personally think any firearm should have at the very minimum 200 rounds of ball ammo put through it then cleaned and lubed. Then 100 rounds of your choice carry ammo through it, cleaned and lubed and another 100 rounds of carry ammo through it before I would consider it a carry-able gun. Another couple hundred rounds of carry ammo certainly doesn't hurt but I'd say 200 ball and 200 carry would be the miminum.

Obviously this applies more steadfastly for semi autos than revolvers. As long I have dry-fired the gun many times, and as long as quality new ammo is used, I would feel comfortable with a revolver with fewer shots fired through it than a pistol. Still, 200 rounds of carry ammo is a good goal though.

 

[Jim K]

I recommend a MINIMUM of 200 consecutive rounds of the carry ammo without a failure of any kind before considering the gun as a carry gun. For an auto pistol, I will add that that is 200 rounds per carry magazine if you carry more than one.

This should be done after a field strip, checkout and cleaning to make sure there are no factory defects or other problems like burrs or factory grease that could cause problems.

A big mistake is to check out the pistol with cheap ammo, then carry another kind on the street. I have actually heard from folks who had never fired a round of their "good" carry ammo, because it was "too expensive to waste". One guy took my advice and fired a magazine of his "good" ammo - with 7 failures to feed. And that was the ammo he had been carrying for months.

Jim

 

[Moparmike]

250rds of carry ammo is alot of $$$. Hydra-Shok runs $1 per one bullet here, at least for 10mm.

 

[Hal]

250rds of carry ammo is alot of $$$.

MoparMike,
Consider the alternative. Think about a worst case scenerio where some puke has a gun to your head or a loved one's head and demands money. In that type of situation you'd gladly poney up a million times more than the cost of the ammo.

 

[Devonai]

I'm perfectly happy with 50 rounds of FMJ and 50 rounds of my favorite JHP. However, I always buy used handguns with the exception of my Beretta 92FS, my first firearm. I carried that immediately without test-firing it at all. Perhaps I was taking a chance, but the next seven years and 6000+- rounds have proved my confidence right.

I've owned over a dozen different pistols: Berettas, H&K, Sigs, Glocks, Dan Wesson, Norinco... and none of them had any problems. I guess that's one benefit of buying used versus new, unethical sellers notwithstanding.

 

[SMLE]

When I got my Beretta 96, I happened fo find a SUPER deal on the internet for Remington 165grn Golden Sabers. $7.15 per box(they retail for $19.95!)
I bought 800 rounds and was thus able to really wring the gun out at the range with the ammo I intended to carry. I tested ALL of my magazines too. I put 200 rounds through it the first session at the range an was most satisfied with function and accuracy. I still regularly fire all 3 of my mags full once each with Sabers whenever I shoot.

try these folks, check out their ammo specials.

http://www.kieslersonline.com

 

[TonyB]

My ccw is a revolver(SP101)....I practice w/ 200 rds of 38+p+ and about 50 rds of 357's that I carry.....
all 3 of my handguns are 99% reliable(Taurus pt99,Glock 17 and the SP101)
The Tuarus and G17 are for home defence and feed everything(9mmJHP and 9mm+p+ being my loads of choice)....my autos will feed rocks if I put them in there

 

[JiminCA]

I'd say somewhere arounnd 1000 rounds total through the piece if it is a semi-auto. Then 200 rounds trouble free with carry ammo of choice. I want to know that the gun runs, and I want to shake out any parts that might be about to break because of manufacturing defects or poor installation. Also I'll shoot it 3 or 4 IDPA matches. No better way to shake out your total gear setup than a match IMO.

For a revolver, maybe 100 rounds. Seems to me they either work or they don't. Less scenarios for failure in the revo case.

 

[Maddock]

For autos –
500 rounds without malfunction. 100 rounds of carry loads. I also use all the magazines that I am going to carry during this test. I’ve found pistols that function fine but not with a certain magazine that works fine in other pistols. At least twice I run through four magazines as fast as I can just to see if there would be an issue with heat or fouling or anything. Also I do at least 8 magazines weak hand with as light a grip as I can manage. If I need to shoot I can’t depend on being all locked up. With 45ACP autos I try 20 cases that I have cut down that have large rifle magnum primers (primed cases only) just to make sure that the strike is adequate. I try shooting in all positions just to see if there is anything in a different attitude that can cause a failure.

For revolvers –
500 rounds without malfunction. 100 rounds of carry loads. At least twice I run through 30 rounds as fast as I can just to see if there would be an issue with heat or fouling or anything. Also I try CCI magnum primers in a hundred or so reloads, just to make sure that the strike is adequate.

Lack of accuracy really doesn’t seem to have been an issue with the guns I have tested to carry. Ergonomics, yes. Fixed sights being off, yes. Mechanical failure, yes.

 

[Gocart]

I wouldn't ccw with a new gun until I'd taken a weekend pistol class. They usually require 750 - 1000 rounds, but the rounds are shot in drills that build skills you need to win the fight. That's a lot different than standing still on a firing line and putting a couple of hundred rounds down range waiting for a malfunction.

I'd take a new glock in 9mm or .40 fresh out of the box and ccw with it, not because of reliability, but because of around 10,000 rounds per year for the past five years training with that gun.

 

[ceestand]

For the reason of expense, I find that I have to compromise in ammo selection. I carry loaded with Magtech .38spl SJHP - just bought a 1000 rounds for $165 delivered. An extreme alternative: 1000 rounds of MagSafe .38 costs $1540.00 before shipping. Everytime I shoot my gun I will get the same performance and I can shoot often enough to remain at the top of my game.

However, that debate can go on for a while.

Other check out items: I concur with what you touched on, Minute_Of_Torso. Some guns you just pick up and wonder Where did that front sight get to? Guns like that get cut pretty quickly.

Also, I look for things that will hang up on clothing. The exposed hammer is an obvious one, but sometimes decockers, safeties, mag releases and the such have a habit of changing position during a draw. I would carry any gun being considered for CCW around the house wearing the clothes you would likely wear on the street.

 

[444]

The guns I carry, are guns that I had owned for years prior to obtaining a CCW. I had probably fired close to 10,000 rounds out of my primary carry gun before I ever carried it concealed. I owned what I considered to be the ultimate self defense handgun and made my CCW carry options fit the gun and not the other way around.
If I got a new one, I guess I would take it out and fire a few hundred rounds through it. But it would be a clone of the one I have now.

 

[Stevie-Ray]

Mine have been different. For my G26, I've run about 200 rounds of Hydra-Shoks through it, along with about 500 rounds of hardball. My CDP has about 150 rounds of Hydra-Shoks, 100 rounds of Golden Sabres, 50 rounds of Silvertips, and 200 rounds of hardball through it. Never a failure of any kind with the G26, 1 failure to eject with a Silvertip the first day I had the CDP; no failures since. And no more Silvertips.

 

[W Turner]

I don't quite shoot the hundreds of rounds thru a gun that some here do, but here is my normal routine.

2 months of IDPA competition with any suitable gun (app. 200-300 rounds total) without cleaning and just a light oiling. I use FMJ and any old HP carry ammo I have laying around and frequently mix HP and FMJ in the mags

PLUS

three mags of carry ammo.

This is enough for me to feel comfortable with semi-autos.

For revos, I usually shoot a few boxes of CCI ammo thru them, dry-fire them a lot and leave them alone.

Mino

 

[Jim March]

For revolvers:

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=57816 - long thread starts there, "bounces" to THR...