ATF now has records of everyone who purchased from RH custom

Two year old necro thread restarted by a one time poster.

Any wonder why nobody can respond with accurate info? It should have been all over the net by now. It wasn't happening, none of the low count posters has returned at all.

Goes to the climate at the time - during a panic - and an apparent lack of any credibility in the stories at all.

As I said, we could do a lot better. Two year old threads shouldn't be restarted by first time posters.

We're being played.

It is not fishy

A local ATF agent contacted me yesterday on a purchace from RH-Custom.
I was like really this has to be a joke coming from a local number and informed him I would like to see proof. They faxed it over to my work within 3 minutes coming from the Department of Justice, Bureau of Alclcohol, tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.

This is no joke! They had proof of the payment for the product.

I will have to meet with him tomorrow and turn over my product.

What product are you even talking about?

A Glock auto-sear or something?

You shoulda known better in the first place!

rc

Yeah your great help. I figured if If i can buy it, it has to be legal right?

I bought the Neilson dummy supperssor. Of course I upgraded to the washer kit.

Anyone smart that know's what to do?
Should I lawyer up before?

Thank you Robert for unlocking this!

Anyone?

That is how you ask for assistance?

Hire a lawyer, ignorance is no excuse...

TennJedd said

What happens if you do not have record of what you bought or any proof?

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In the unlikely scenario this was to occur,, they would first have to have enough evidence to have probable cause to make an arrest. At that point you'd be charged and appear in court. They would have to prove, beyond a reasonable doubt, you bought the items you state you didn't buy. If they can prove that you bought them despite your denials, you'll be found guilty. Proving you bought something you didn't buy would be, in my estimation, extremely unlikely. However, if they have verifiable "proof" you bought it, and you have nothing to back your version of events, its going to be a long 10 years or so. However, little details, like needed the PC to make the arrest, the proving you broke the law beyond a reasonable doubt, etc...... I just can't wrap my head around any possible scenario where an innocent person could be wrongfully convicted of possessing something that has never been in their hands or that they don't even have any knowledge of. I have as much fear of that scenario going down as I do having a house randomly smash me ala Wizard of Oz. While not impossible, the odds in infinitesimally small that one could somehow be convicted in the complete absence of any tangible evidence of any kind.

I figured if If i can buy it, it has to be legal right?

Click to expand...

Seriously? THATS your defense? In two minutes or less, I could likely acquire nearly any popular street drug. Just because I can buy them, they must be legal, right? Companies can be criminal just like an individual can be....buyer beware, and know the darn law, especially when dealing with something that could cost several years of freedom! SMH....the things I read some days :banghead: :banghead:

Ok, guys; i have postponed typing long enough: this is indeed a real phenomenon. The ATF is really and truly doing a systematic interview of all who bought from Hillman.

Hillman has operated many websites over the years, not just RH.

In my own case, i was visited by 3 agents (2 from ATF and one from DHS) about an item they think I purchased(*). The item was not illegal in-and-of-itself, and they claim they are wondering if I knew of any other people who purchased from this guy. WHich i didn't.

Still, being leery, i contacted my lawyers who unanimously said to refer all contact to them and not to contact the agents anymore.

This was a bit over 1 year ago, and I havent heard from them since.

But this is real, don't doubt it. i imagine if anyone HAD done somethign illegal or even questionable, they woudl not be posting or would be not allowed by their counsel to speak on it. Thats probably why there has been a lack of hard facts posted.


Hope this helps. And dont buy illegal stuff!


C-
(*) in my case, this was purchased w a credit card that was compromised, i.e. someone got the number and was buying him/herself stuff; so i had not owned the card for several years. i tried to contact the bank to get the records, but apparently they destroy them (or at least they dont release them to customers) after 5 years.

I've been wondering what kind of resources ATF has to supervise foreign companies in any way. I've got a bunch of M16/M14 lowers, some of which I literally use as paperweights at the office and they were made by a local company which used to sell them over the counter or by mail to anyone. In most European countries FA lowers and frames aren't regulated in any way, but I've never heard that numerous companies who CNC them would (or essentially, could) be supervised by US ATF or by local officials at ATF's request.

A few years ago M16 lowers were all the rage around here, lots of semi AR:s were built on them because they were cheaper and easier to source than brand name semi lowers. Unlike in the US, they're not jailbait, just regular gun parts.


All it takes is the ATF making a call to a fellow NATO country explaining illegal activity for them to pursue in another country. Our governments work together way more than you think. The world gets smaller everyday.

I figured since this is the first site that comes up in a search for RH and the ATF some people should be aware that the ATF has the purchase orders from this company. They are under federal investigation.
According to the agent I turned my property into, this is their third time around with the same company country wide, even tho they are still up and operating at this time.
All I had to do was turn over the property and sign a warning letter and a notice that I have turned it over willingly.

And yes I will stick with "Plausible Deniability" any time.

Well this is suprising. I remember contacting him with interest to purchase a few items a couple years ago. I looked into his company and was about to pull the trigger until I researched that he didnt have an export license, and I needed the same FFL import/export license to receive it, so I never bothered to purchase anything. On top of that, even if I had the license, I couldnt buy that particular weapon because of the 1986 ban. The only was I could obtain one is to build it myself after getting an FFL 03/02 SOT license and obtain a damn demo letter from the sheriff. I mean seriously, If Im going to go though the hassle of paying the government 4k a year for a license, then passing all the background checks, it just sounded pretty ridiculous to go back to the sheriff each time to build something that I could never sell anyway except to someone else who has the same license, and in that case why in the hell wouldnt they just build it themselves? In essense, I didnt buy anything, and by the looks of it, Im grateful I didnt.

And that, my friends, is the magic of the '86 MG ban. BBT, you forgot to toss in another two grand for ITAR fees.

Support Hollis v Holder, folks!

TCB

Old or not, this is an interesting thread...

as my first engineering officer often said... "the stupid shall be punished"

One report based on a compromised credit card and their was no direct purchase.
Another report from someone who bought a dummy suppressor and washer kit.

Other than that, all we have is the ATF doing it's job - throwing it's weight around and making circumstances look as bad as possible. That falls in line with the current administration's agenda to make NFA items as evil as possible.

"We're being nice and you can just turn it over" has another interpretation - "We don't have enough to convict or the resources to do it." Which fits their current enforcement. Jawbone the minor issues for the maximum public effect, put the real money on the bad boys who are actually gun running.

For those better versed in the NFA and construction of a silencer, where do you cross the line for having components to construct vs owning an illegal silencer? Reading NFA threads, my limited understanding is you can have parts, apply, on receipt of the stamp you finish construction.

If all you have is a box of parts that by their nature cannot become a silencer without further fabrication, then you don't have a silencer. You just have a pile of parts.

If you have an AR and a full auto sear, but your lower isn't drilled for the third pin, then exactly how is it illegal?

I understand the constructive intent issue - but relate where in a court's decision that the line is crossed. Not "the ATF might do something!" which has no bearing. Please point out where the ATF DID do something and on what grounds the Judge agreed. If there is no conviction there is no point of law.

Cutting thru the uninformed hysteria and spelling out what the law actually requires then highlights exactly how our rights are being denied. So far after two years all we have determined is that some agents have contacted about three people.

Which might be about all the customers RH actually had.

It very much does go to this being about the only thread on the internet about it - if hundreds were getting a knock on the door wouldn't there be posts on a dozen gun forums?

It still smells fishy. As in, the ATF is just fishing.