Beren
Moderator Emeritus
Sigh. Craig just got his reds and blues backwards, didn't he?
CSPAN thread for Tuesday 03/02/04
- Thread starter Preacherman
- Start date
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Gray Peterson
Member
Indeed. If AWB is still added in with DC repeal set aside, I'm going to be very angry.
ClonaKilty
Member
But now that she got herself declared a Fed. Marshall I'm sure she has a standard 13-round mag...anyway on with the show!
Bartholomew Roberts
Member
Also remember that there are two good Second Amendment cases pending on the DC gun ban that have the opportunity to establish some pro-Second precedents at the federal level.
If the DC gun ban passes, those cases are dead in the water before any higher court decisions have been reached. So as long as we get SOMETHING for the trade, I'd say that it is a good trade.
If the DC gun ban passes, those cases are dead in the water before any higher court decisions have been reached. So as long as we get SOMETHING for the trade, I'd say that it is a good trade.
answerguy
Member
Blue was Gore, Red was Bush. I didn't catch what Craig said.
Moparmike
Member
Anyone else's CSPAN connection really crappy?
Kingson
Member
yes mine sucks
armoredman
Member
Yes. Was perfect yesterday.....hmmmm, tin foil beanie, anyone?
NightWolfe
Member
same here Ironbarr ..
and good morning everyone ..
let's hope it's a good day ..
and good morning everyone ..
let's hope it's a good day ..
kingfisher
Member
Larry Craig almost makes me wish I was living in Idaho again.
Moondancer
Member
I called Senator Lugar's office about five minutes ago (Republican from Indiana) and was put on hold for a few minutes as soon as I connected.
Told him I expected him to vote "NO" on all amendments and "YES" on the bill itself. Staffer was pleasant but made no responses. Time spent talking was about 1/4 of the time spent on hold.
Hopefully the fact that I was on hold meant that a large number of calls are coming in on this subject. For those of you from Indiana, make sure you email / fax AND call!
Told him I expected him to vote "NO" on all amendments and "YES" on the bill itself. Staffer was pleasant but made no responses. Time spent talking was about 1/4 of the time spent on hold.
Hopefully the fact that I was on hold meant that a large number of calls are coming in on this subject. For those of you from Indiana, make sure you email / fax AND call!
Craig: Reed said many states have already closed the loop-hole. He mentioned how NC had closed the loop-hole, and then gun shows flourished. NC requires a handgun permit, so they do a check. None of the states have the kind of regulatory structure being imposed by the McCain-Reed amdt. It's also been argued that gun shows are a venue for terrorists. It's interesting they suggest that because those that tried to do this were arrested. Because if you are an illegal alien, you can't buy a firearm. Does 3 purchasers make the gun show venue a wide open opportunity? No. The reality suggests there are perhaps 1 or 2% of firearms used in crime are from gun shows, according to the FBI. Those are the realities of the issue. Say an individual sees some firearm at a gun show they like, but decide not to buy it. So he gets the card of the seller, go home and think about it a few days and talk to their spouse. Finally, they call and decide to buy it. Was that legal? Under this amdt, it might not be. What about 2 or 3 years later, does it then require a background check? It's a critical area where you are throwing citizens into the middle of a federal bureaucracy. We're placing a risk on citizens when we've never before seen this as a problem. If there is a loophole in a gun show, there is a loop hole outside gun shows because the laws are the same both ways. Let's stay with the laws we've got, and go after the criminal element.
Campbell: What if person sees something they like at a gun show, don't buy it, see it later outside the gun show, then buy it through an ad or such? That's a big grey legal area.
Craig: Steps up and agrees.
Campbell: Rises and voices support for 1805. Talks about how it has support from many Senators and police orgs, etc. Talks about support for the LEO CCW amdt. We need a blanket protection for LEO when they cross state lines. We are in a new war without rules. Firefighters, LEO, etc. are often the front line of this war. I would hope my fellow Senators will support this vote.
Craig: Steps up and agrees.
Campbell: Rises and voices support for 1805. Talks about how it has support from many Senators and police orgs, etc. Talks about support for the LEO CCW amdt. We need a blanket protection for LEO when they cross state lines. We are in a new war without rules. Firefighters, LEO, etc. are often the front line of this war. I would hope my fellow Senators will support this vote.
Moparmike
Member
I admit I have shamefully slacked...
I just sent this off to my senators via email. I should have sent it Sunday or something:
I just sent this off to my senators via email. I should have sent it Sunday or something:
Gray Peterson
Member
Utah's giving the smackdown on Feinstein, pointing out the Assault Weapon means "Fully Automatic", which were regulated heavily in 1934 and since then.
bfieldburt
Member
Senator Hatch.....my man! When here, he lives just down the road from me. Doing Utah proud.
kingfisher
Member
Thank you Senator Hatch.
Assault weapons ban has not done anything but strip the 2nd amendment rights of law abiding citizens. It has not been responsible for any reduction in crime rates.
Assault weapons ban has not done anything but strip the 2nd amendment rights of law abiding citizens. It has not been responsible for any reduction in crime rates.
SaLted_peanUTs
Member
Ya I'm jealous. I'm stuck with McCain..........
Bartholomew Roberts
Member
Senator Hatch finally points out that there is no such thing as a legal unlicensed dealer. He points out that if you sell guns for business, you have to have an FFL.
Hatch - legislation created gunowner registration. Gun show events must sign ledger of gun show in order to comply with amendment - list of who attended gun shows would be kept at Department of Justice.
Someone says that Hatch must have read old legislation that this amendment does not have the paperwork requirement mentioned above.
Hatch - legislation created gunowner registration. Gun show events must sign ledger of gun show in order to comply with amendment - list of who attended gun shows would be kept at Department of Justice.
Someone says that Hatch must have read old legislation that this amendment does not have the paperwork requirement mentioned above.
Moparmike
Member
Why cant the left listen to logic? Why cant they look into the facts and try to dispell them with reason?
Orin Hatch kicking a$$ and taking names. Go Baby Go!
Ooooh, he just busted out the firearm codes. He is like a freight train. I would pay to see the dumbfounded look on the left's face: "Logic and reasoning? What is this witchcraft and sorcery you bring before us?"
Orin Hatch kicking a$$ and taking names. Go Baby Go!
Ooooh, he just busted out the firearm codes. He is like a freight train. I would pay to see the dumbfounded look on the left's face: "Logic and reasoning? What is this witchcraft and sorcery you bring before us?"
Hatch: I'm speaking against the AWB. An assault weapon is a select-fire weapon, a machine gun already regulated. The firearms under the AWB are semi-automatic, and sometimes look like assault weapons, but are mechanically different. 5x were murdered with knives than any type of rifle. According to the FBI, this is the same before and after the ban. Law-abiding men and women were stripped of their 2nd amdt rights, we cannot make that mistake again. The suggestion that the AWB is responsible for crime drop is misleading. There is no more evidence for this than the setting sun turns on street lights. Instead of banning firearms, we need to prosecute criminals. Rather than eroding rights, we should channel efforts at enforcing current laws. Bush made a commitment to Project Safe Neighborhoods. PSN is a comprehensive strategy against violent crime, which has dropped violent crime 68%. We need to get tougher on those who abuse the RKBA. Based on some arguments for McCain-Reed, there is major misunderstanding on how gun shows operate. They attract a broad range of people. Gun shows are an opportunity to pass along a tradition. What federal laws currently apply? There are no special exemptions at gun shows. No such thing as an unlicensed dealer. In 1986, FOPA authorized FFLs to do business at gun shows. Dealers are required to do a NICS check, same at gun shows. McCain-Reed would effect law-abiding citizens, who are out to hurt nobody. It would hurt gun collectors. If we adopt this amdt, it will effectively create gun owner registration. Operators would have to submit the name of all vendors at their shows. This amdt also purports to provide for NICS. Anybody who knows about NICS knows they have up to 3 days to do this. A few large states could drag down the whole scheme, shutting down dealers at gun shows. In a study on imprisoned felons, fewer than 1% got a weapon through gun show. Criminals get their guns on the street, or robbery. LE use gun shows to weed out corrupt dealers. Those few that do deal unlawfully would be driven back into the streets and ally ways.
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