Guns in God's House?

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When I'm there in church, (or anywhere else for the most part),
I'm armed.

Google "Larry G. Ashbrook" Wedgewood Baptist Church .(He walked into a church in Ft. Worth and shot seven people, three were teenagers, then shot himself). That's as good a reason as any to be carrying in a house of worship.

I actually knew Ashbrook back in the early '70's. We were in the same squadron in the Navy back then.

Deranged sociopathic killers don't observe any set rules as to where the carry out their sick agendas. Non deranged killers don't either, for that matter... It could be in a Luby's, a church, a mall, a school, your house or your car, so being armed and willing is a 24/7/365 proposition.

(Places I'm prohibited from going armed, I just don't go.)
 
It depends on your religion.

A gun at a Quaker meeting place? You've got to be kidding.

At a synagogue? Nope.

At a mosque? Even though there is a hadith which says that the merit of prayer is multiplied fivefold if you wear a sword I doubt that Mullah ibn Big Beard would be too happy if you wore a scimitar and stood behind him and to his left :)

At a Sikh temple? All religious Sikhs are armed all the time.

Choose your faith and make your choice...
 
I wonder whether the UN will grant a waiver to the Sikhs when they 'cleanse' the world of personal weapons.
 
Yup.

I sit in my pew every Sunday wearing a gun. My wife and son are with me in church, on the way to church and home from church. I wouldn't go to a place of worship that held their safety in so little regard to disarm the one man who swore to protect them.

That's my choice. If you made a different one, fine. I'll support your right to do so. Just don't tell me I can't be there for my family when the chips are down. That's wrong according to any religion.
 
Not in TX...legally anyway

Not sure if this is new for the 2005-06 batch of revisions, as I seem to recall reading this several years ago, but the following is a quote from the state regs..page 41...

PC 46035..."Unawful carrying of a Handgun by a lisence holder"
"(6) on the premisis of a church, synogogue, or other established place of religious worship."

I recall an incident from I think the 80's, when a BG walked into a church service in Daingerfield and shot up a bunch of folks. A number of fatalities resulted- it seems to me stuff like that makes the anti's blind. Maybe we should have resource officers at all churche services, just like we do in our schools...

OR...
allow CCW in school and church... WE aren't the bad guys....
 
When I took my Texas CHL class (2005), three of the seven people in the class were ordained ministers. They stated that unless the senior pastor/priest/rabbi forbid it, and the church was posted with the appropriate signage, it was ok to carry with a CHL in a house of worship in Texas.

Just my .02,
LeonCarr
 
any body counting?

I'd say there's been at least 8 Baptist churches burned down in the last year.

Another string of them happening this week in the Carolinas.

I don't need proof beyond a reasonable doubt to figure out that American society is throwing off all semblances of restraint and as it does so is becoming more and more hostile towards those insitutions that advocate concepts like absolute truth, morality, sin, etc... (notice which denominations are getting torched).

But burning a church at 2:00 a.m. isn't my concern......someone walking in on Sunday morning and going postal is.

When I attend services, my wife and kids and most of my best friends with their wives and kids are all their too.

Not a difficult decision on my part.

The sheeple will all sing you praises if you're the one who stops the rampage and saves their childs life. But then again......common sense is a little more common in some places than others and I don't know of two many sheeple types in the group anyways.
 
Clarification?

Leon,

Do the wishes of the senior pastor, etc... trump state law? I'd still feel like I was in violation... "if" I were to so choose..
 
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Mostly, when I go, my NAA .22LR derringer is in my side pocket. But I don't feel guilty, either legally or securally, because according to many, carrying a NAA .22LR derringer isn't really carrying.
 
Guns in God's House?
Do you carry in church?
Click to expand...

I'm in Illinois.

Oft discussed, here and in similar Internet venues.

I did notice something interesting the other day, while reading Rev. Ron Gleason on the death penalty. He points out the Westminster Larger Catechism, on the 6th commandment:
Question 135: What are the duties required in the sixth commandment?

Answer: The duties required in the sixth commandment are, all careful studies, and lawful endeavors, to preserve the life of ourselves and others by resisting all thoughts and purposes, subduing all passions, and avoiding all occasions, temptations, and practices, which tend to the unjust taking away the life of any; by just defense thereof against violence, patient bearing of the hand of God, quietness of mind, cheerfulness of spirit; a sober use of meat, drink, physic, sleep, labor, and recreations; by charitable thoughts, love, compassion, meekness, gentleness, kindness; peaceable, mild and courteous speeches and behavior; forbearance, readiness to be reconciled, patient bearing and forgiving of injuries, and requiting good for evil; comforting and succoring the distressed, and protecting and defending the innocent.

Question 136: What are the sins forbidden in the sixth commandment?

Answer: The sins forbidden in the sixth commandment are, all taking away the life of ourselves, or of others, except in case of public justice, lawful war, or necessary defense; the neglecting or withdrawing the lawful and necessary means of preservation of life ; sinful anger, hatred, envy, desire of revenge;all excessive passions, distracting cares; immoderate use of meat, drink, labor, and recreations; provoking words, oppression, quarreling, striking, wounding, and: Whatsoever else tends to the destruction of the life of any.
Click to expand...

Italics are mine.
 
Houses of worship in TX must be posted or you have to be personally told.

As far as the theology - I have yet to see a crime stopped by a legion of angels or a lightning bolt.
 
I said it in the last thread, and I'll say it again here - the practice of forbidding arms in places of worship dates from the Middle Ages, when Vikings, brigands, and thieves would make off with altar plate/chalice, usually made from silver or gold, to melt down for "recycling". That theory worked about as well as modern gun control, as only those who believed in The Lord would worry about divine retribution. Those who worshipped Odin or money, were deterred none at all.
I carry any time I am vertical, with the exceptions being work or shower. I carried at my own wedding, and will carry the next time I attend church, as well.
Remember, Jesus was a Jew, and I believe that no less than three times in the Talmud, it proclaims a duty to kill those who would kill you. No specifics on that one.
Anyone remember the guy in South Africa, who used a snub .38 to defend a church from AK weilding thugs? Wrote a book about it, too, I believe.
 
'In God's House'..

Say 'Hello' and 'Thanks' in your own way. Whenever and wherever.

Religion and the contentious nature of the subject, I think, does not belong here.


I have to object to the continuation of this thread.

salty.
 
"Religion and the contentious nature of the subject, I think, does not belong here.


I have to object to the continuation of this thread.

salty"

I'm sorry you feel that way, salty. The thread was not meant to be centered around religion but rather carrying in a particular but very common segment of our society.

The thread has been instrumental in my mind making a decision on whether to carry or not in places of worship.
 
I am a frequent visitor to a nondenominational Christian church, and I carry every time I am there. In Missouri it is legal if you have the permission of the pastor. This is not the case in all states (such as Kansas). The Bible has no probation to carrying a weapon or to protecting yourself or a loved one from harm. In fact, the Bible never has said "Thou shalt not kill". The original Greek translation is "Thou shalt not murder". The difference is that murder is defined as taking an innocent life. A crazed man shooting people in the pews is not innocent and should be stopped by any means available. Now I know some popular translations are incorrect, but the truth is, God does not expect us to be sheep lead to the slaughter. To ignore evil when confronted by it, is to allow that evil to flourish. I do not believe that is Gods will at all! I do not believe it is a sin to take a life if you do so to save you’re own or that of a loved one. I hope I never have to hurt anyone, but I think God will still love me and forgive me if I am forced to exercise deadly force to save innocent lives.
 
You've made a fine post for your first entry to the forum gmilty!

Welcome and enjoy like I have, I made my first post a couple weeks ago and have learned much since.
 
Absolutely.

I attend church every Sunday, always with my normal CCW gear.

Being at church does not protect one from evil. It is my Christian duty to protect the weak and innocent. These include my family as well as others in the congregation.

For what it's worth, I have a seminary degree, was ordained, and served as a minister, though in a different denomination than the one of which I am now a part. I know the theological arguments for Christian pacifism, and I disagree with them, as do many other people with theological educations. I respect Christian pacifists for the strength of their convictions, mistaken though I think they are. A non-pacifist who does not carry a weapon in church simply because it is a place of worship is simply inconsistent. If it is permisable to carry a weapon at all, it is permisable in church. Indeed, I carry a weapon not just because it is my right, but because I believe it is my responsibility. If I did not carry in church I would be shirking my responsibility.
 
The pastor encourages it :)

There is a local church where the pastor ENCOURAGES people to carry in church. The local police hate the guy. :)

Edited to add:

Salty, if we dropped every objectionable topic this forum would not exist. If you object, don't play. Seek a alternate thread. By the way, may God bless you.

Doc2005
 
God helps those who help themselves...

I'll train to be accurate and fast, and I'll carry my gun... GOD can do His (or Her) part to see that I never NEED to use it...

Should He, (or She) forget their part, you can darned well be sure I won't forget mine!
 
bsam4me, and LeonCarr

bsam4me, you are wrong and LeonCarr is correct. It was that way at first, but before George Bush left the Governors Mansion he signed an addendum to that part of the law.
It is now LEGAL for a Texas CHL holder to carry in church unless the church has the appropriate 30.36 sign displayed in accordance with Texas state law.
The PC46.03(5) you quoted earlier, now reads "in or into the secured area of an airport". Read the latest CHL handbook.
I just finished qualifying again Saturday and got that clarified AGAIN, one more time!!
That part of the CHL law has been changed now for several years.
I carry LEGALLY every Sunday at church in Garland, TX.

Jim
 
Since this is somewhat topical, it seems to me that most Christians these days are overall "socialists", in that they ascribe to a lot of socialist dogma - public schools, welfare and government healthcare, ban guns, etc. I've noticed that being a "gun owner" in a church doesn't mean you're likely to be a kindred spirit; if it doesn't have t odo with saving aborted babies, there's little that most Church people I've met these days can agree with "Republican" politics.
Click to expand...

Caimlas, I think that you have been going to the wrong churches! Some of us Christians are anything but Socialists. We want to get our kids out of government schools, and we want to get the government out of our lives. We especially want the government to get out of the church's business and quit taxing us to death so as to waste our tax dollars on failed social programs. We would rather cut out the middle-man and care for our neighbors according to the dictates of our conscience and in obedience to the commands of our Savior. We believe, along with the Apostle Paul, that if a man doesn't work he shouldn't eat, but we also understand our responsibility to care for the widow, the orphan, and the crippled. We also know that the right to self-defense comes from our Creator, and we are willing to defend our families, even when they are engaged in Worship.
 
you should give yourself a limit since having a gun even though makes u feel safe and prepared only reminds you that a bad thing can happen like a terrorist running in or a mugger or a drunk catholic priest named Father Patrick whos drank a months supply of the holy wine.

or a plane hitting the church.

shoot your way out of that one, Jack!:neener:
 
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