Trouble in the Big D
- Thread starter 95XL883
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You, your wife and child all walked away unharmed. You did good. Don't let anyone say you should have done this or that. The goal is to walk away unharmed, and you accomplished that.
It would likely be a good idea to inform the local cops and supply as good a description as possible. The next family might not have someone as thinking as yourself.
It would likely be a good idea to inform the local cops and supply as good a description as possible. The next family might not have someone as thinking as yourself.
robmkivseries70
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- 241
A real dilemma here, once you see the weapon, you are behind the curve on any self defense move. I'd suggest practicing verbal disengagement with a bit of anger thrown in for good measure. Work and practice with the family here so they will know whats going on. Cooper mentions the anger in his "Principles of Personal Defense" btw. I have an easy going personality and get targeted occasionally.
Best,
Rob
Best,
Rob
Auf Grosser Fahrt
Member
Lived my first 48 years in Oak Cliff area of Dallas. I, too feel safe, cause you develop a skill of knowing what's OK and what likely isn't just by a quick look around. Many times I've parked, looked around at the "clientele", and decided, "I don't think so".
95XL83, I think you did OK as a totally inexperienced person. Your first experience like it. Gotta start somewhere before you can get better. I've never felt the need for a gun, actually, as I'm very alert to my surroundings.
JustinJ
Member
He may or not have been dangerous, i would guess not in such a public place but one never knows.
From the start it should have been no thank you and certnainly do not admit to being an out of town tourist. Giving a criminal a little in the hopes he won't go for more is never a good idea.
That aside, when he demaned the $100 i would have pulled out my phone and said fine, we'll let the police sort it out.
From the start it should have been no thank you and certnainly do not admit to being an out of town tourist. Giving a criminal a little in the hopes he won't go for more is never a good idea.
That aside, when he demaned the $100 i would have pulled out my phone and said fine, we'll let the police sort it out.
Thanks for sharing this, 95LX. Some mistakes made, some avoided. The most important thing you did right was to keep you and your family from harm. Your situational awareness, though not expert, was still pretty good, and likley the biggest factor in avoiding a really bad outcome.
None of us were there in what seems to have been a very dynamic and dangerous situation. Not much value in beating you up for your mistakes when reasoned discussion can be so much more productive. I think we all learn from this kind of discussion, so again, thanks for sharing your story.
None of us were there in what seems to have been a very dynamic and dangerous situation. Not much value in beating you up for your mistakes when reasoned discussion can be so much more productive. I think we all learn from this kind of discussion, so again, thanks for sharing your story.
Deaf Smith
Member
95XL883,
Ricky was right in just saying 'no'.
Tell me, can you describe the man? I've been downtown Dallas many times in the West End. Sure like to know what that guy looked like.
And do you have some H2H skills? Never know when you might have to stop a sucker punch or grappling lunge.
Oh, and when you told him you had a 'friend' to, hey.. I'd have said, "I have my six best friends with me to", to give him a better hint.
And make sure your gun is more accessible (or get a small TCP/LCP style gun for the pocket!)
But as in SouthNarc's school, just say "I cannot help you" while backing away all the while using your peripheral vision to check for his 'friends'. And I suggest your wife get a CHL to!
Deaf
Ricky was right in just saying 'no'.
Tell me, can you describe the man? I've been downtown Dallas many times in the West End. Sure like to know what that guy looked like.
And do you have some H2H skills? Never know when you might have to stop a sucker punch or grappling lunge.
Oh, and when you told him you had a 'friend' to, hey.. I'd have said, "I have my six best friends with me to", to give him a better hint.
And make sure your gun is more accessible (or get a small TCP/LCP style gun for the pocket!)
But as in SouthNarc's school, just say "I cannot help you" while backing away all the while using your peripheral vision to check for his 'friends'. And I suggest your wife get a CHL to!
Deaf
xXxplosive
Member
After reading this...IMO.................what a mess......you should have known better.....your actions could have put your family in a severe situation.....Geeezzzz
I have found in big cities, world wide, try not to look like a tourist. Know where you are going and walk with purpose. Look at a map before you leave the hotel, car etc. and plan the route. If you have to pull out a map as you're walking do it discreetly. This cuts down on the offers for "guided tours".
If offered a tour, or anything else, a direct look in the eye and no thanks works most of the time. Keep walking as if you don't have time for chit chat. A change of direction or quick stop at the nearest store if they are persistent and/or you feel threatened.
In my experience, the "tour guides" in touristy areas are only looking for a quick buck, not hassle from the police. First they try to sell it, if that doesn't work sympathy, then possibly intimidation. The guy is there tonight doing the same thing to someone else.
If offered a tour, or anything else, a direct look in the eye and no thanks works most of the time. Keep walking as if you don't have time for chit chat. A change of direction or quick stop at the nearest store if they are persistent and/or you feel threatened.
In my experience, the "tour guides" in touristy areas are only looking for a quick buck, not hassle from the police. First they try to sell it, if that doesn't work sympathy, then possibly intimidation. The guy is there tonight doing the same thing to someone else.
You and the family are safe, so I'd say it went well.
I'm so tired of being hassled in urban areas by guys like this that 90% of the time when someone I don't know approaches me I wait till the moment they open their mouth to begin to speak, then just look at them in the eye, say "no" in a loud voice, and just keep walking.
The other 10% of the time is when I'm not 100% certain they are a slimeball, just in case it is someone with a legitimate reason to talk to me (ie someone legitimately asking for directions, etc). If I'm in doubt, I let them get about 7 words in to evaluate what they want, THEN cut them off if necessary and keep walking.
The good news is, I spend less time dealing with these people. The bad news is, every once in while one of them gets really upset, and starts yelling at me, sometimes words not to be repeated in mixed company. This leaves me wondering if I should try to find a slightly less abrasive way to tell people in the clearest way to leave me alone.
I'm so tired of being hassled in urban areas by guys like this that 90% of the time when someone I don't know approaches me I wait till the moment they open their mouth to begin to speak, then just look at them in the eye, say "no" in a loud voice, and just keep walking.
The other 10% of the time is when I'm not 100% certain they are a slimeball, just in case it is someone with a legitimate reason to talk to me (ie someone legitimately asking for directions, etc). If I'm in doubt, I let them get about 7 words in to evaluate what they want, THEN cut them off if necessary and keep walking.
The good news is, I spend less time dealing with these people. The bad news is, every once in while one of them gets really upset, and starts yelling at me, sometimes words not to be repeated in mixed company. This leaves me wondering if I should try to find a slightly less abrasive way to tell people in the clearest way to leave me alone.
+1, at some point in time, you simply have to stand up to these creeps. A couple of days ago I had someone come up to me and stand closer than I wished. He was obviously homeless but alone since I had surveyed the area prior to walking outside.
He asked me where he could find services. Since I came out of our church and already locked the door, I thought he was talking about religious services. Instead, he wanted a shower.
He ended up getting very aggressive verbally. At that point, I had already assumed a defensive posture with my legs in a fighting stance and I looked at him and said, sorry, I can't help you very firmly.
He hesitated and then turned around muttering about me. I had no choice but to call his bluff and show him I was ready to engage if that is where he wanted to go. It worked thank the Lord.
It didn't hurt that I hadn't shaved for 3 days, was wearing my Army cap and had a leather jacket on as well. He blinked pure and simple. Once again, thank the Lord it ended there.
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Dear 95XL883, I had another encounter about 15 years ago that cost me 20 dollars. I went to an ATM at a bank that had a parking lot in the back and I had to walk to the front for the ATM. My wife was sitting in the car.
As soon as I accessed my account, two men walked up to me from different angles. I was trapped with no where to go or run. I was flanked by one and approached by the other.
I gave the creeps 20 dollars and never put myself in that kind of position again. I understand that sometimes you just have give them the money and go on living, especially with your wife and family right there.
Glad you made it minus the money. Hopefully your wife will understand at some point. I choose my ATM's very carefully now.
As soon as I accessed my account, two men walked up to me from different angles. I was trapped with no where to go or run. I was flanked by one and approached by the other.
I gave the creeps 20 dollars and never put myself in that kind of position again. I understand that sometimes you just have give them the money and go on living, especially with your wife and family right there.
Glad you made it minus the money. Hopefully your wife will understand at some point. I choose my ATM's very carefully now.
95, I'm glad you and your family are safe. I've never been in anything resembling the situation you describe, but wanted to add my .02 to something snorky brought up that can head off these situations early.
I've used this tactic too, though not in what I would call a loud voice. It's not an aggressive tone, it's not mean. It's more a way of conveying in a word 'I'm not threatening you, but I'm not afraid of you, and we have nothing further to discuss.' I read it on here years ago and started using it to cut off contact with bums in my college town (mostly harmless). Since then, I've also used it in NYC, Fayetteville, Phoenix, and other large cities.
When I've posted about it here, I often get called out for machismo grandstanding. I suspect this is by people that don't have regular contact with homeless or chemically dependent individuals. However, using that 1 word answer is simple, it's engrained at this point, and it doesn't distract me from maintaining situational awareness. Most importantly, it has never failed to disrupt the OODA loop of the person who approached me. This buys me time, which gains me distance, and ultimately they take their aggressive panhandling, solicitation, or other approach elsewhere.
I've used this tactic too, though not in what I would call a loud voice. It's not an aggressive tone, it's not mean. It's more a way of conveying in a word 'I'm not threatening you, but I'm not afraid of you, and we have nothing further to discuss.' I read it on here years ago and started using it to cut off contact with bums in my college town (mostly harmless). Since then, I've also used it in NYC, Fayetteville, Phoenix, and other large cities.
When I've posted about it here, I often get called out for machismo grandstanding. I suspect this is by people that don't have regular contact with homeless or chemically dependent individuals. However, using that 1 word answer is simple, it's engrained at this point, and it doesn't distract me from maintaining situational awareness. Most importantly, it has never failed to disrupt the OODA loop of the person who approached me. This buys me time, which gains me distance, and ultimately they take their aggressive panhandling, solicitation, or other approach elsewhere.
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Thanks for that valuable contribution.
Thank you all for your input. Clearly there are things I can do better. Probably the biggest thing would have been to change to my other route at my first sign of uneasiness.
Deaf Smith, the guy was about 25, medium brown and clear skin, green eyes, about 5'8" and 150 lbs, clean shaven and closely cut hair. He is clean, decently groomed and and not an obvious druggy. He wore an untucked horizontally striped green, blue and white striped shirt with the green stripes being largest. He had a circular patch on his left sleeve that I never could get a good look at. He had long blue shorts. I didn't see an obvious bulge around his waist but the shirt was baggy enough to conceal a lot. If you see him, watch his right front pocket. There was something in it, to me it looked like a knife but I'm speculating on that.
Bikerdoc, thanks again for your suggestion on separating and the wife (or child) saying "No thank you. Not today." Silence and separation can be very unnerving. I discussed it with my wife and she is now showing an interest in some training. Thanks again.
Deaf Smith, the guy was about 25, medium brown and clear skin, green eyes, about 5'8" and 150 lbs, clean shaven and closely cut hair. He is clean, decently groomed and and not an obvious druggy. He wore an untucked horizontally striped green, blue and white striped shirt with the green stripes being largest. He had a circular patch on his left sleeve that I never could get a good look at. He had long blue shorts. I didn't see an obvious bulge around his waist but the shirt was baggy enough to conceal a lot. If you see him, watch his right front pocket. There was something in it, to me it looked like a knife but I'm speculating on that.
Bikerdoc, thanks again for your suggestion on separating and the wife (or child) saying "No thank you. Not today." Silence and separation can be very unnerving. I discussed it with my wife and she is now showing an interest in some training. Thanks again.
ChCx2744
Member
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- 1,228
Yeah from the first incident where he made contact, I would have never proceeded to follow him anywhere. Period.
Him: "I know where the secret tunnel is that the policeman who really shot JFK used. I’ll take you..."
Me: "No thank you. We'll be on our way now."
Him: "But..."
Me: "No thank you. We'll be on our way now."
Him: "You should..."
Me: "No."
Him: "How about..."
Me: "No."
Him: "Well..."
Me: "Honey, call 911."
If his advances continue into even the slightest demeanor or gesture of performing any physical action towards me or my family, I will respond with appropriate measures.
Him: "I know where the secret tunnel is that the policeman who really shot JFK used. I’ll take you..."
Me: "No thank you. We'll be on our way now."
Him: "But..."
Me: "No thank you. We'll be on our way now."
Him: "You should..."
Me: "No."
Him: "How about..."
Me: "No."
Him: "Well..."
Me: "Honey, call 911."
If his advances continue into even the slightest demeanor or gesture of performing any physical action towards me or my family, I will respond with appropriate measures.
WilleRupert
Member
Remind me to never go to Dallas.
Hoppes Love Potion
Member
Reminds me of an uncomfortable "night out" in a bad part of town with myself and 3 teens.
I was in my 40s. My stepson was 17 and a good-sized kid, maybe 6'2". He had friends visiting from a small town up north, two girls maybe 16 or so. They wanted to go to a "nightclub" and see a band. There is an underage club downtown, so i said I'd take them. My wife was working that night.
We parked 2 or 3 blocks from the club and as we left the parking lot I noticed we had picked up 2 "friends" from out of nowhere. They made a pitch about "making sure nobody messes with your car" for $10. I told them no thanks but if anything happens to the car I'll be sure to check with them since they patrol the parking lot. They thought that was extremely funny.
We continued toward the club, with the girls in front, my stepson and I between the girls and the 2 gents who had decided to walk along with us.
They were 2 or 3 steps behind and keeping up a steady banter. I was worried because one or both of them could have closed the space in a short second. I wanted to turn around but didn't have a reason to. But they quickly supplied one by making an inappropriate comment about the girls.
I snapped around and they practically ran into me. With what i hoped was the right measure of outrage I said loudly, "That is my daughter you're talking about. Get the %$^@ away from us."
And they did. I'm glad my stepson was there or I think they would have tried something. Those 3 blocks were totally empty of foot or auto traffic.
Too bad it was a non-alcoholic club because I certainly could have used a drink when we got inside.
I was in my 40s. My stepson was 17 and a good-sized kid, maybe 6'2". He had friends visiting from a small town up north, two girls maybe 16 or so. They wanted to go to a "nightclub" and see a band. There is an underage club downtown, so i said I'd take them. My wife was working that night.
We parked 2 or 3 blocks from the club and as we left the parking lot I noticed we had picked up 2 "friends" from out of nowhere. They made a pitch about "making sure nobody messes with your car" for $10. I told them no thanks but if anything happens to the car I'll be sure to check with them since they patrol the parking lot. They thought that was extremely funny.
We continued toward the club, with the girls in front, my stepson and I between the girls and the 2 gents who had decided to walk along with us.
They were 2 or 3 steps behind and keeping up a steady banter. I was worried because one or both of them could have closed the space in a short second. I wanted to turn around but didn't have a reason to. But they quickly supplied one by making an inappropriate comment about the girls.
I snapped around and they practically ran into me. With what i hoped was the right measure of outrage I said loudly, "That is my daughter you're talking about. Get the %$^@ away from us."
And they did. I'm glad my stepson was there or I think they would have tried something. Those 3 blocks were totally empty of foot or auto traffic.
Too bad it was a non-alcoholic club because I certainly could have used a drink when we got inside.
Deaf Smith
Member
What?
Well then you better say out of every metro in existence.
And surely don't go to NYC or San Fran as you can't pack anything to protect yourself.
Deaf
I've been to Dealey plaza. Sadly, the area around it has a lot of panhandlers, some aggressive about it. "No" is a good first response and usually makes them move on to find a someone else. Sad what drugs and alcoholism does to people.
Probably don't want to talk to the conspiracy wierdos selling books or newspapers either. They never seem to be in a happy mood, just bitter.
Probably don't want to talk to the conspiracy wierdos selling books or newspapers either. They never seem to be in a happy mood, just bitter.
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