Which SHTF Pistol: Glock or 1911?

[RyanM]

Except, I've never felt a Glock trigger that I liked.

3.5# connector, NY-1 (olive) trigger spring with the metal part taken out, Wolff increased power striker spring. Gives a smoth, even, pull with very little stacking. Starts at about 6 pounds, breaks at 8. Pretty similar to today's revolvers.

 

[echo5tango]

Hey...I tried to find info on Glocks. Found what I could. You do better than that..then post it. At the very least I QUESTIONED something. You accuse me of zealousness..when it actually looks like you are the zealous one.

But you're right. This is going nowhere. You "won" your argument. You keep your Glock. I'll keep my steel frame. And nothing else need be said.

Just like I predicted earlier.

But I can show you how little I really care about this and just admit that you've beaten me down. I won't post another comment on this thread. Which thankfully means I won't have to learn anything more about Glocks and can continue on in my "weakly pretending" belief that steel is good.

Good day to you.

Borachon,
I applaud your attempt at enlightening and questioning. From a newb, 3rd party view, Paladin, you look like a teenager who is doing nothing more than regurgitating

 

[PaladinX13]

Borachon,
I applaud your attempt at enlightening and questioning. From a newb, 3rd party view, Paladin, you look like a teenager who is doing nothing more than regurgitating

Borachon, you embarass yourself further by making a new account just to make this post. No reader would look at your posts and consider them enlightened. You out and out admited bias, emotional debate approach designed to agitate, and said that you were on a mission to talk people out of guns you considered inferior (ALL from a position of UTTER ADMITTED IGNORANCE, mind you)... then Flip Flopped not a moment later saying "I'm not trying to down anyone's gun", but watch as you then research with an agenda, report half-truths with your own made-up conclusions, and then play martyr when it's all done.

Frankly, if someone can't see through your BS, their opinion on anything isn't worth a whole lot period. Your own post damn you more than anything I say.

You've done little but write a thinly veiled "I Hate Plastics" thread despite the ban on them stickied to the top of the forum. Questions are questions. Research is research. When you start interjecting your own half-assed interpretations without reporting all your research based on an agenda, you've long since left the arena of enlightenment or truth-seeking.

 

[Old Dog]

Borachon, you've fought the good fight. If nothing else, this thread clearly displays the oft referred to, but seldom witnessed, effects of drinking the Glock kool-aid, and the amazing lengths Glocksters will go in the promotion of "Perfection."

I predict GlockTalk will post a link to this thread to demonstrate to all Glocksters far and wide how they must dedicate themselves to overcome the spirit of all us 1911 and steel handgun dinosaurs ...

 

[echo5tango]

Borachon, you embarass yourself further by making a new account just to make this post. No reader would look at your posts and consider them enlightened. You out and out admited bias, emotional debate approach designed to agitate, and said that you were on a mission to talk people out of guns you considered inferior (ALL from a position of UTTER ADMITTED IGNORANCE, mind you)... then Flip Flopped not a moment later saying "I'm not trying to down anyone's gun", but watch as you then research with an agenda, report half-truths with your own made-up conclusions, and then play martyr when it's all done.

Frankly, if someone can't see through your BS, their opinion on anything isn't worth a whole lot period. Your own post damn you more than anything I say.

You've done little but write a thinly veiled "I Hate Plastics" thread despite the ban on them stickied to the top of the forum. Questions are questions. Research is research. When you start interjecting your own half-assed interpretations without reporting all your research based on an agenda, you've long since left the arena of enlightenment or truth-seeking.

Mods can check the IP address, this is not Borachon. Personally, though I haven't read all however many pages all at once, what I've seen from you has sounded like a teenager. I really don't know how else to put it.

BTW, I don't hate plastic pistols ... I've owned more plastic pistols than steel. However, I don't think that really is the point. Simply questioning something in the hopes of opening the mind results in elementary school reprisals.

-Greg Thomas

 

[echo5tango]

Borachon, you embarass yourself further by making a new account just to make this post.

Just to make it easier on you ... my IP address is 138.162.128.43 just go to http://www.geobytes.com/IpLocator.htm and put that in there

 

[PaladinX13]

However, I don't think that really is the point. Simply questioning something in the hopes of opening the mind results in elementary school reprisals.

Then you're a fool making a judgement without research just like him, read his posts.

The FACTS:
- From a place of admitted ignorance, without facts in hand, B has an opinion.
- B argues strenuously for this opinion- DOG WITH A BONE- despite having no proof, believing it religiously.
- B continues on a campaign of sheer stupidity bringing in sledgehammers and terminal velocity.
- B out and out admits he believes others guns to be inferior and has been on a crusade to talk people out of them, only now snidely saying he won't so that he'll have the superior gun.
- B goes on to argue a point from ignorance, then decides to "research"
- B puts out a call looking for the weakness he wants to find

The LIES:
- He posts busted weapons without context.
- B cites a single post as coming from "two sources"
- B leaves out Hydrolitic
- B leaves out what TYPE of degrees
- B concludes Glocks fall apart at 120 degrees
- B leaves out Glock composition, posts only UV vulnerability
- B concludes Glocks fall apart in sunny weather
- B concludes Glocks unsuitable in Phoenix

All for what? The bottom line is he wants to put down a gun. That's not The High Road. Disguising it as "questioning" when the agenda is clear is disgusting and he needs to be called on it. The fact of the matter is, the only people that swallow it are the similarly inclined cultists like Old Dog.

Those are the facts and the lies. B's behavior is a High Road embarassment. If there's ANYWHERE where I have promoted polymer beyond its capabilities or put down steel or anyone else's gun like B has, I hope someone calls ME out on it. I've never claimed Glock "perfection" or campaigned against another's gun. I've SOLEY pointed out how disgusting B's behavior has been.

 

[Old Dog]

Cultists? Wow, first time I've ever been called a "cultist." Okay, I'll buy that ... 1911s are my pistol of choice ... But I also am a member of the SIG Cult, the Smith & Wesson Revolver Cult and the Winchester Rifle Cult.

Lighten up, PaladinX13 ... I was simply trying to inject a bit of levity into what (somewhat alarmingly) turned into an acrimonious, albeit entertaining, exchange of posts ... Seems as though you may be taking all this a bit too personally ...

 

[echo5tango]

Then you're a fool making a judgement without research just like him, read his posts.

The FACTS:
- From a place of admitted ignorance, without facts in hand, B has an opinion.
- B argues strenuously for this opinion- DOG WITH A BONE- despite having no proof, believing it religiously.
- B continues on a campaign of sheer stupidity bringing in sledgehammers and terminal velocity.
- B out and out admits he believes others guns to be inferior and has been on a crusade to talk people out of them, only now snidely saying he won't so that he'll have the superior gun.
- B goes on to argue a point from ignorance, then decides to "research"
- B puts out a call looking for the weakness he wants to find

The LIES:
- He posts busted weapons without context.
- B cites a single post as coming from "two sources"
- B leaves out Hydrolitic
- B leaves out what TYPE of degrees
- B concludes Glocks fall apart at 120 degrees
- B leaves out Glock composition, posts only UV vulnerability
- B concludes Glocks fall apart in sunny weather
- B concludes Glocks unsuitable in Phoenix

All for what? The bottom line is he wants to put down a gun. That's not The High Road. Disguising it as "questioning" when the agenda is clear is disgusting and he needs to be called on it. The fact of the matter is, the only people that swallow it are the similarly inclined cultists like Old Dog.

Those are the facts and the lies. B's behavior is a High Road embarassment. If there's ANYWHERE where I have promoted polymer beyond its capabilities or put down steel or anyone else's gun like B has, I hope someone calls ME out on it. I've never claimed Glock "perfection" or campaigned against another's gun. I've SOLEY pointed out how disgusting B's behavior has been.

WOW, I came here because of the gentlemanly nature of the majority of posts I read. I really hope you are not representative of what I have to look forward to. You seem to be taking this way too personally. A pistol is a tool ... that's it. Do you think carpenters get in verbal altercations over what brand of hammer is "better"? I doubt it.

 

[goon]

Is it really that big of a deal?

 

[PaladinX13]

Cultists? Wow, first time I've ever been called a "cultist." Okay, I'll buy that ... 1911s are my pistol of choice ... But I also am a member of the SIG Cult, the Smith & Wesson Revolver Cult and the Winchester Rifle Cult.

You become a cultist when someone blindly defaming another gun is congratulated as "fighting the good fight" because it's the opinion you want to see enforced. For the record, by your definition of "cult" (mere ownership) I'm in all the same and more. I own more steel than polymer and in my very first post of this thread, said I'd pick the 1911 for some applications over the Glock, but not some nebulous and undefined SHTF situation.

Lighten up, PaladinX13 ... I was simply trying to inject a bit of levity into what (somewhat alarmingly) turned into an acrimonious, albeit entertaining, exchange of posts ... Seems as though you may be taking all this a bit too personally ...

Mostly because I'm being portrayed a cultist despite a well rounded and deep collection of guns, and a guy blindly carrying your banner is an "enlightened fighter". Disgusting.

 

[Old Dog]

Wow, you are definitely taking all this a bit too seriously ...

 

[PaladinX13]

WOW, I came here because of the gentlemanly nature of the majority of posts I read. I really hope you are not representative of what I have to look forward to.

BS B.

You seem to be taking this way too personally. A pistol is a tool ... that's it. Do you think carpenters get in verbal altercations over what brand of hammer is "better"? I doubt it.

Again, call me out on ANYWHERE where I put down another's tool, much less with the fervor or consistency B does from an admitted position of ignorance. He wasn't saying, "I personally dislike the trigger. Polymer guns aren't for me." He went the extra mile to say "Your guns are inferior and aren't right for anyone." Then backed that bigotry up with page after page of posts.

I'm calling him out on it because while that kind of nonsense happens in other forums and goes on and on endlessly, THR has consistently stayed ABOVE that kind of behavior. A few diplomatic false-faced guestures of backpedalling isn't enough for a guy to suddenly become an "enlightened" truth seekerk.

 

[Too Many Choices!?]

Let's both take enjoyment from your victory.

I sure did, as I celebrate even the small victories lol...

PaladinX13, wow! How did it get from me having Borachon ,"against the ropes", to you being ,"rope a doped"? I think you do protest too much, and a little to vehemently. Borachon , has admitted to all the eveil of arguing emotionally with an agenda, and has been docked the required ,"two cool points", now either use your own advice and drop the emotion from your arguments ,or people will jump on you just like the reformed and now fairly even handed and still biased and agenda driven Borarchon...

 

[echo5tango]

... and a guy blindly carrying your banner is an "enlightened fighter". Disgusting.

Whoa there hoss, I'm not blindly carrying anyone's banner. If you honestly believe by me voicing my agreement with him means I'm "... blindly carrying [his] banner", you have a lot of learning left in you.

Again, call me out on ANYWHERE where I put down another's tool, much less with the fervor or consistency B does from an admitted position of ignorance. He wasn't saying, "I personally dislike the trigger. Polymer guns aren't for me." He went the extra mile to say "Your guns are inferior and aren't right for anyone." Then backed that bigotry up with page after page of posts.

And where did I say you put down another man's tool? All I said was:

Do you think carpenters get in verbal altercations over what brand of hammer is "better"? I doubt it.

You obviously took it personally, hence your attack.

 

[Ares]

Me thinks this thread hit the proverbial fan

 

[Biker]

Yup. Art will be around soon with the old 'anything more than 5 pages' speech.
Seems he's usually right about that.
Biker

 

[PaladinX13]

Whoa there hoss, I'm not blindly carrying anyone's banner. If you honestly believe by me voicing my agreement with him means I'm "... blindly carrying [his] banner", you have a lot of learning left in you.

You'd have to be blind to swallow his BS as delinated by his posts... alternatively you read two of his posts then decided that's enough research to judge him by as I've been judged a Glock Kool Aide drinker despite never promoting Glock anywhere else save the SHTF context of this thread. So blind or ignorant, I suppose.

You obviously took it personally, hence your attack.

You misunderstand, I take offense that putting down a tool- to B's degree- ISN'T considered an offense. I specifically said it upsets me because I see that kind of poster degenerate thread after thread in other forums, whereas THR has been ABOVE that. That's WHY it's a rule. To see it as "no harm, no foul" is to let THR degenerate into those other forums.

 

[Too Many Choices!?]

He lost,"two cool points", what more do you want?

I could dock him two more,"cool points", for arson, or setting a thread on fire, and running, but he stuck around and tried to put it out. Now you are the only one left fanning the confligration, let it go:banghead:. Again, it's just a gun...

PS- I do drink the ,"Glock-ade", and damn is it sweet, doesn't stop me from trying or liking new ones though. What is that saying? Something about an,"old dog," and ,"new tricks"?

 

[echo5tango]

You'd have to be blind to swallow his BS as delinated by his posts... alternatively you read two of his posts then decided that's enough research to judge him by as I've been judged a Glock Kool Aide drinker despite never promoting Glock anywhere else save the SHTF context of this thread. So blind or ignorant, I suppose.

funny, how is this post of his bashing:

I understand that in the Warsaw ghetto uprising, it was common to hide your firearms inside a stove, up a chimney or buried at the base of a chimney. That way, if the house was destroyed or burned out, the weapon might survive and the chimney would serve as a location marker for where the weapon was at.

Also, one of the classic methods of smuggling items is to put them under your car hood...secreted under some oily and dirty part of the motor (or hot part of the motor). In a survival situation, you might actually NEED to store your gun in a hot place. The trunk and all the other parts of the car can be searched easily. Thieves...or others....might hesitate to take off the air filter cover or push their hands on top of the oil pan in order to search. So I'll ask now...do you feel confident laying your Glock on a part of the engine for 3 hours? (I've been at some checkpoints that lasted longer) If you ain't 100% confident....well, just think on it.


I guess what I'm saying is that the materials that go into the construction of my weapon are important, and I'd rather err on the side of proven durability versus more modern, but with less track history.

I believe that was his first post in this whole mess of a thread, and I believe it shows he was trying to throw out things people haven't thought of before (some of us call that "out of the box thinking").

You misunderstand, I take offense that putting down a tool- to B's degree- ISN'T considered an offense. I specifically said it upsets me because I see that kind of poster degenerate thread after thread in other forums, whereas THR has been ABOVE that. That's WHY it's a rule. To see it as "no harm, no foul" is to let THR degenerate into those other forums.

I've only had time to go through about six or seven pages of the 15+ pages containing all his posts. But in the ones I've gone through, none (other than those in this thread) have even mentioned a brand or composition of pistol.

 

[PaladinX13]

I could dock him two more,"cool points", for arson, or setting a thread on fire, and running, but he stuck around and tried to put it out. Now you are the only one left fanning the confligration, let it go:banghead:. Again, it's just a gun...

You're missing the point now and confusing me as someone zealously defending Glock. It's not about the gun. My whole debate with B has been an attempt to get an informed opinion out of him, which is a forum integrity issue. When someone posts an informed criticism, that's VALUABLE... when someone repeatedly posts feeling-based put-downs that's degenerative. I was eventually hoping to get to an informed opinion, but instead he just twisted his research showing his stripes weren't going to change. Uninformed put-downs are worthless.

I'm an informed poster... been on this board since it's conception and I can tell you the value of posters who post informed opinions rather than gut-based put-downs (worse yet, congratulated for it) compared to those other forums I've seen. Threads debate actual merits and everyone's better for it. But if you've got an uninformed poster blathering on without stopping, everyone's a little stupider for it.

Again, it's not about the gun.

 

[PaladinX13]

I believe that was his first post

Good job, you've increased your reseach by a total of 1 post and amended your judgment by it... no doubt seeking the result you want- a valuable asset in forming an objective opinion, I might add- I've already summarized his offending posts, if you're not going to read them then obviously your uninformed opinion's going to differ from mine. What you've done is degenerate, seeking to debate me personally, rather than posting from information... like in your first post, while claiming he's enlightened and I, a teen.

You see... this is why uninformed posters providing views suck.

 

[echo5tango]

Good job, you've increased your reseach by a total of 1 post and amended your judgment by it... no doubt seeking the result you want- a valuable asset in forming an objective opinion, I might add- I've already summarized his offending posts, if you're not going to read them then obviously your uninformed opinion's going to differ from mine. What you've done is degenerate, seeking to debate me personally, rather than posting from information... like in your first post, while claiming he's enlightened and I, a teen.

You see... this is why uninformed posters providing views suck.

Odd, I have all of his posts which I've been referring to for reference. And how informed do I have to be to draw a conclusion after reading this entire thread? I think reading the entire thread is informed enough, but just to be sure, I started going through his other posts, those NOT in this thread. Me thinks that's more than informed enough.

Also, I didn't call you a teen:

what I've seen from you has sounded like a teenager. I really don't know how else to put it.

I really think you need to take a deep breath and relax. No one is attacking you. Honestly, I find this whole exchange amusing ... kind of like dealing with one of my devil pups LOL

 

[Biker]

Ya know, I've pretty much said my piece concerning the original subject of this thread, but I'll be damned if I'm not starting to think that "echo5tango" isn't an 'aka'. It begins with 'echo'...just a gut feeling.
Biker

 

[Riktoven]

Heh...just skipped from page 2 to page 10.

You guys have too much free time