armoredman
Member
That better be a typo....too many people watching this for them to get away with it....
7/29/05 - Senate S.397 Discussion
- Thread starter Bartholomew Roberts
- Start date
- Status
ClonaKilty
Member
CSPAN reported the vote on kennedy's amdmt as 64 against, 31 for. It's dead.
Reed: Nays 63. It's also dead! Hooray!
10 min debate now, I guess on 397 itself.
Reed: Nays 63. It's also dead! Hooray!
10 min debate now, I guess on 397 itself.
ClonaKilty
Member
Reed shows graph of declining lawsuits vs Ruger (or S&W?). As if the decline shows there is absoltuely no threat of a killer lawsuit to the industry.
It's like his version of "pay no attention to the man behind the curtain."
Now he's regurgitating the irrelevant cases (MD snipers etc) and going emotional on us, saying we're not open to lawsuits against negligent distrubutors.
He has no freaking ears, has he not listened to Craig or Hutchinson?
It's like his version of "pay no attention to the man behind the curtain."
Now he's regurgitating the irrelevant cases (MD snipers etc) and going emotional on us, saying we're not open to lawsuits against negligent distrubutors.
He has no freaking ears, has he not listened to Craig or Hutchinson?
SmershAgent
Member
And I have a chart showing that he's an idiot.
Dan from MI
Member
Agreed to is a typo from THOMAS.
http://www.senate.gov/legislative/L...ote_cfm.cfm?congress=109&session=1&vote=00217
Kennedy Amendment
Grouped By Vote Position YEAs ---31
Akaka (D-HI)
Bayh (D-IN)
Biden (D-DE)
Boxer (D-CA)
Cantwell (D-WA)
Carper (D-DE)
Chafee (R-RI)
Clinton (D-NY)
Corzine (D-NJ)
Dayton (D-MN)
Dodd (D-CT)
Durbin (D-IL)
Feingold (D-WI)
Harkin (D-IA)
Inouye (D-HI)
Kennedy (D-MA)
Kerry (D-MA)
Kohl (D-WI)
Lautenberg (D-NJ)
Levin (D-MI)
Lieberman (D-CT)
Mikulski (D-MD)
Murray (D-WA)
Nelson (D-FL)
Obama (D-IL)
Reed (D-RI)
Rockefeller (D-WV)
Sarbanes (D-MD)
Schumer (D-NY)
Stabenow (D-MI)
Wyden (D-OR)
NAYs ---64
Alexander (R-TN)
Allard (R-CO)
Allen (R-VA)
Baucus (D-MT)
Bennett (R-UT)
Bingaman (D-NM)
Bond (R-MO)
Brownback (R-KS)
Bunning (R-KY)
Burns (R-MT)
Burr (R-NC)
Byrd (D-WV)
Chambliss (R-GA)
Coburn (R-OK)
Cochran (R-MS)
Coleman (R-MN)
Collins (R-ME)
Conrad (D-ND)
Craig (R-ID)
Crapo (R-ID)
DeMint (R-SC)
DeWine (R-OH)
Dole (R-NC)
Domenici (R-NM)
Dorgan (D-ND)
Ensign (R-NV)
Enzi (R-WY)
Frist (R-TN)
Graham (R-SC)
Grassley (R-IA)
Gregg (R-NH)
Hagel (R-NE)
Hatch (R-UT)
Hutchison (R-TX)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Isakson (R-GA)
Jeffords (I-VT)
Johnson (D-SD)
Kyl (R-AZ)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Leahy (D-VT)
Lincoln (D-AR)
Lott (R-MS)
Lugar (R-IN)
Martinez (R-FL)
McCain (R-AZ)
McConnell (R-KY)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Nelson (D-NE)
Pryor (D-AR)
Reid (D-NV)
Salazar (D-CO)
Santorum (R-PA)
Sessions (R-AL)
Shelby (R-AL)
Snowe (R-ME)
Specter (R-PA)
Stevens (R-AK)
Talent (R-MO)
Thomas (R-WY)
Thune (R-SD)
Vitter (R-LA)
Voinovich (R-OH)
Warner (R-VA)
Not Voting - 5
Cornyn (R-TX)
Feinstein (D-CA)
Roberts (R-KS)
Smith (R-OR)
Sununu (R-NH)
http://www.senate.gov/legislative/L...ote_cfm.cfm?congress=109&session=1&vote=00217
Kennedy Amendment
Grouped By Vote Position YEAs ---31
Akaka (D-HI)
Bayh (D-IN)
Biden (D-DE)
Boxer (D-CA)
Cantwell (D-WA)
Carper (D-DE)
Chafee (R-RI)
Clinton (D-NY)
Corzine (D-NJ)
Dayton (D-MN)
Dodd (D-CT)
Durbin (D-IL)
Feingold (D-WI)
Harkin (D-IA)
Inouye (D-HI)
Kennedy (D-MA)
Kerry (D-MA)
Kohl (D-WI)
Lautenberg (D-NJ)
Levin (D-MI)
Lieberman (D-CT)
Mikulski (D-MD)
Murray (D-WA)
Nelson (D-FL)
Obama (D-IL)
Reed (D-RI)
Rockefeller (D-WV)
Sarbanes (D-MD)
Schumer (D-NY)
Stabenow (D-MI)
Wyden (D-OR)
NAYs ---64
Alexander (R-TN)
Allard (R-CO)
Allen (R-VA)
Baucus (D-MT)
Bennett (R-UT)
Bingaman (D-NM)
Bond (R-MO)
Brownback (R-KS)
Bunning (R-KY)
Burns (R-MT)
Burr (R-NC)
Byrd (D-WV)
Chambliss (R-GA)
Coburn (R-OK)
Cochran (R-MS)
Coleman (R-MN)
Collins (R-ME)
Conrad (D-ND)
Craig (R-ID)
Crapo (R-ID)
DeMint (R-SC)
DeWine (R-OH)
Dole (R-NC)
Domenici (R-NM)
Dorgan (D-ND)
Ensign (R-NV)
Enzi (R-WY)
Frist (R-TN)
Graham (R-SC)
Grassley (R-IA)
Gregg (R-NH)
Hagel (R-NE)
Hatch (R-UT)
Hutchison (R-TX)
Inhofe (R-OK)
Isakson (R-GA)
Jeffords (I-VT)
Johnson (D-SD)
Kyl (R-AZ)
Landrieu (D-LA)
Leahy (D-VT)
Lincoln (D-AR)
Lott (R-MS)
Lugar (R-IN)
Martinez (R-FL)
McCain (R-AZ)
McConnell (R-KY)
Murkowski (R-AK)
Nelson (D-NE)
Pryor (D-AR)
Reid (D-NV)
Salazar (D-CO)
Santorum (R-PA)
Sessions (R-AL)
Shelby (R-AL)
Snowe (R-ME)
Specter (R-PA)
Stevens (R-AK)
Talent (R-MO)
Thomas (R-WY)
Thune (R-SD)
Vitter (R-LA)
Voinovich (R-OH)
Warner (R-VA)
Not Voting - 5
Cornyn (R-TX)
Feinstein (D-CA)
Roberts (R-KS)
Smith (R-OR)
Sununu (R-NH)
Reed: S.397 is not about the facts, there is no litigation crisis. Trots out S&W declining case numbers. There is no threat to mil weapons. This is not about legal principle. The principle of negligence is being stood on it's head. We've had talk about intervening criminal activities removing liability, but that isn't the case in law. States have been handling this. It's about sheer power by the NRA, to take us off the Defense bill, the power to take us away from stem cell debate. It's not about principle. If S.397 passes, what will be the incentive to act reasonably (how about BATFE raids? 
) If they're reckless now, what will they do when we say nobody can touch them? We're silencing the voices of gun violence victims. It's not about trying gun mfgs for somebody else's fault, it's about their own responsibility. It's about the DC sniper victims. We're telling those victims the NRA is more important. This is wrong.
Craig: Last year I promised co-sponsors we'd return for a fair opportunity, and attempt to establish a clear record on a very important decision. Thanks Frist and his colleagues. This bill is intended to do one thing, to end the abuse in the court system against law-abiding businesses that violate no law, but because the product they sell ultimately ends up being used in criminal act, they are liable. I think the Senate will say they ought not be. What we have crafted is a very narrow kind of exemption from predatory lawsuits. That's what S.397 is about. The reality is very clear, and the legislation simple.
) If they're reckless now, what will they do when we say nobody can touch them? We're silencing the voices of gun violence victims. It's not about trying gun mfgs for somebody else's fault, it's about their own responsibility. It's about the DC sniper victims. We're telling those victims the NRA is more important. This is wrong. Craig: Last year I promised co-sponsors we'd return for a fair opportunity, and attempt to establish a clear record on a very important decision. Thanks Frist and his colleagues. This bill is intended to do one thing, to end the abuse in the court system against law-abiding businesses that violate no law, but because the product they sell ultimately ends up being used in criminal act, they are liable. I think the Senate will say they ought not be. What we have crafted is a very narrow kind of exemption from predatory lawsuits. That's what S.397 is about. The reality is very clear, and the legislation simple.
ClonaKilty
Member
FINALLY!
Calling roll now for the final vote. Stay tuned.
Calling roll now for the final vote. Stay tuned.
armoredman
Member
Finally is right....sheesh....
RealGun
Member
Hard core against the bill:
Akaka
Bayh
Biden
Bingaman
Boxer
Cantwell
Carper
Chafee
Clinton
Corzine
Dayton
DeWine
Dodd
Durbin
Feingold
Harkin
Inouye
Jeffords
Kennedy
Kerry
Kohl
Lautenberg
Leahy
Levin
Mikulski
Maurray
Nelson - FL
Obama
Reed - RI
Sarbanes
Schumer
Stabenow
Wyden
That's an unofficial tally of the Reed amendment. I don't think it alone makes them anti-gun but does make them in favor of lawsuits without concern for the cost of being in business (litigation insurance).
I think the final vote on the bill will likely be these folks voting NO.
Akaka
Bayh
Biden
Bingaman
Boxer
Cantwell
Carper
Chafee
Clinton
Corzine
Dayton
DeWine
Dodd
Durbin
Feingold
Harkin
Inouye
Jeffords
Kennedy
Kerry
Kohl
Lautenberg
Leahy
Levin
Mikulski
Maurray
Nelson - FL
Obama
Reed - RI
Sarbanes
Schumer
Stabenow
Wyden
That's an unofficial tally of the Reed amendment. I don't think it alone makes them anti-gun but does make them in favor of lawsuits without concern for the cost of being in business (litigation insurance).
I think the final vote on the bill will likely be these folks voting NO.
Andrew Rothman
Member
Reed Amendment vote:
----------------------
X=no vote
I clearly missed one vote -- anyone know which?
Y Akaka (D-HI),
N Alexander (R-TN),
N Allard (R-CO),
N Allen (R-VA),
N Baucus (D-MT),
Y Bayh (D-IN),
N Bennett (R-UT),
Y Biden (D-DE),
Y Bingaman (D-NM),
N Bond (R-MO),
Y Boxer (D-CA),
N Brownback (R-KS),
N Bunning (R-KY),
N Burns (R-MT),
N Burr (R-NC),
N Byrd (D-WV),
Y Cantwell (D-WA),
Y Carper (D-DE),
Y Chafee (R-RI),
N Chambliss (R-GA),
Y Clinton (D-NY),
N Coburn (R-OK),
N Cochran (R-MS),
N Coleman (R-MN),
N Collins (R-ME),
N Conrad (D-ND),
N Cornyn (R-TX),
Y Corzine (D-NJ),
N Craig (R-ID),
N Crapo (R-ID),
Y Dayton (D-MN),
X DeMint (R-SC),
Y DeWine (R-OH),
Y Dodd (D-CT),
N Dole (R-NC),
N Domenici (R-NM),
N Dorgan (D-ND),
Y Durbin (D-IL),
N Ensign (R-NV),
N Enzi (R-WY),
Y Feingold (D-WI),
X Feinstein (D-CA),
N Frist (R-TN),
N Graham (R-SC),
N Grassley (R-IA),
N Gregg (R-NH),
N Hagel (R-NE),
Y Harkin (D-IA),
N Hatch (R-UT),
N Hutchison (R-TX),
N Inhofe (R-OK),
Y Inouye (D-HI),
N Isakson (R-GA),
Y Jeffords (I-VT),
N Johnson (D-SD),
Y Kennedy (D-MA),
Y Kerry (D-MA),
Y Kohl (D-WI),
N Kyl (R-AZ),
N Landrieu (D-LA),
Y Lautenberg (D-NJ),
Y Leahy (D-VT),
Y Levin (D-MI),
N Lieberman (D-CT),
N Lincoln (D-AR),
N Lott (R-MS),
N Lugar (R-IN),
N Martinez (R-FL),
N McCain (R-AZ),
N McConnell (R-KY),
Y Mikulski (D-MD),
N Murkowski (R-AK),
Y Murray (D-WA),
Y Nelson (D-FL),
N Nelson (D-NE),
Y Obama (D-IL),
N Pryor (D-AR),
Y Reed (D-RI),
N Reid (D-NV),
X Roberts (R-KS),
X Rockefeller (D-WV),
N Salazar (D-CO),
N Santorum (R-PA),
Y Sarbanes (D-MD),
Y Schumer (D-NY),
N Sessions (R-AL),
N Shelby (R-AL),
X Smith (R-OR),
N Snowe (R-ME),
N Specter (R-PA),
Y Stabenow (D-MI),
N Stevens (R-AK),
X Sununu (R-NH),
N Talent (R-MO),
N Thomas (R-WY),
N Thune (R-SD),
N Vitter (R-LA),
N Voinovich (R-OH),
N Warner (R-VA),
Y Wyden (D-OR),
----------------------
X=no vote
I clearly missed one vote -- anyone know which?
Y Akaka (D-HI),
N Alexander (R-TN),
N Allard (R-CO),
N Allen (R-VA),
N Baucus (D-MT),
Y Bayh (D-IN),
N Bennett (R-UT),
Y Biden (D-DE),
Y Bingaman (D-NM),
N Bond (R-MO),
Y Boxer (D-CA),
N Brownback (R-KS),
N Bunning (R-KY),
N Burns (R-MT),
N Burr (R-NC),
N Byrd (D-WV),
Y Cantwell (D-WA),
Y Carper (D-DE),
Y Chafee (R-RI),
N Chambliss (R-GA),
Y Clinton (D-NY),
N Coburn (R-OK),
N Cochran (R-MS),
N Coleman (R-MN),
N Collins (R-ME),
N Conrad (D-ND),
N Cornyn (R-TX),
Y Corzine (D-NJ),
N Craig (R-ID),
N Crapo (R-ID),
Y Dayton (D-MN),
X DeMint (R-SC),
Y DeWine (R-OH),
Y Dodd (D-CT),
N Dole (R-NC),
N Domenici (R-NM),
N Dorgan (D-ND),
Y Durbin (D-IL),
N Ensign (R-NV),
N Enzi (R-WY),
Y Feingold (D-WI),
X Feinstein (D-CA),
N Frist (R-TN),
N Graham (R-SC),
N Grassley (R-IA),
N Gregg (R-NH),
N Hagel (R-NE),
Y Harkin (D-IA),
N Hatch (R-UT),
N Hutchison (R-TX),
N Inhofe (R-OK),
Y Inouye (D-HI),
N Isakson (R-GA),
Y Jeffords (I-VT),
N Johnson (D-SD),
Y Kennedy (D-MA),
Y Kerry (D-MA),
Y Kohl (D-WI),
N Kyl (R-AZ),
N Landrieu (D-LA),
Y Lautenberg (D-NJ),
Y Leahy (D-VT),
Y Levin (D-MI),
N Lieberman (D-CT),
N Lincoln (D-AR),
N Lott (R-MS),
N Lugar (R-IN),
N Martinez (R-FL),
N McCain (R-AZ),
N McConnell (R-KY),
Y Mikulski (D-MD),
N Murkowski (R-AK),
Y Murray (D-WA),
Y Nelson (D-FL),
N Nelson (D-NE),
Y Obama (D-IL),
N Pryor (D-AR),
Y Reed (D-RI),
N Reid (D-NV),
X Roberts (R-KS),
X Rockefeller (D-WV),
N Salazar (D-CO),
N Santorum (R-PA),
Y Sarbanes (D-MD),
Y Schumer (D-NY),
N Sessions (R-AL),
N Shelby (R-AL),
X Smith (R-OR),
N Snowe (R-ME),
N Specter (R-PA),
Y Stabenow (D-MI),
N Stevens (R-AK),
X Sununu (R-NH),
N Talent (R-MO),
N Thomas (R-WY),
N Thune (R-SD),
N Vitter (R-LA),
N Voinovich (R-OH),
N Warner (R-VA),
Y Wyden (D-OR),
Secret Master
Member
Oh, thank goodness! I thought you guys meant "Reid" ammendment. Boy was I mad!
ClonaKilty
Member
While they're making sausage on the Senate floor, let's discuss a topic:
Would the passage of 397 potentially mean an opening for further tort reform (not just for firearms industry)?
Discuss.
Would the passage of 397 potentially mean an opening for further tort reform (not just for firearms industry)?
Discuss.
Andrew Rothman
Member
Not in this thread, please. Start another.
Dan from MI
Member
Is the final vote up now?
And $100 says Carl Lenin and Debbie Stabmenow vote Nay on the final bill.
And $100 says Carl Lenin and Debbie Stabmenow vote Nay on the final bill.
sturmruger
Member
I wouldn't take that bet!! They voted for the Kennedy Amendment didn't they?
armoredman
Member
The aye votes sound like a full roll call!
Ravenslair
Member
- Joined
- May 9, 2005
- Messages
- 65
WooHoo!!!
ClonaKilty
Member
Not fiished voting yet but I've counted at least 58 "ayes" so far...looks good.
- Status
