Laid down the law on my anti-gun girlfriend...success!

[thumper723]

Jbraun,

I am in what you describe, but 4 years post marriage.

She "didn't like" stuff, and tries to regulate what I do. If I had known how much she would try to control stuff, like you know NOW, I would have bugged out.

Now I am in a miserable situation, and my CO will trash my career if I file for the big D.

The way I am able to have my way most of the time is we have no kids, and she does not work. I drop the "you dont like it, file for divorce" when she tries to have UNREASONABLE controls. (Like demanding I transfer to a different department, because there is a Female pilot working for me now)

This is just the tip of the iceberg. Trust me, been there, and still there, but trying to leave with my career intact.

 

[thumper723]

Thankfully for me, guns are one of the things she does like, but the control issue comes up EVERYWHERE else it seems.

Work, Hobbies, Recreation, Your Friends. She will end up wanting at a minimum, veto power on all the above.

 

[Werewolf]

Sigh. Still thinking...

If you're still thinking about it then you've already lost. Just sell what ever guns you've got, cut your nuts off and marry her.

Either that or just REALLY do what the title of this thread said you did - lay down the freaking law but even that is fraught with peril as others have noted. She may seem to accept your ultimatum but that won't mean diddly at the inevitable divorce proceedings and then it'll be the court cutting your nuts off. My advice to you is to end the relationship and get the heck out of Dodge NOW! Don't look back, don't call her or accept calls from her. If she sends you e'mail delete without looking at it and do the same with snail mail. Any other course of action will eventually lead to much misery for you (unless you do cut your nuts off and accept that she is your lord and master).

Your description of this woman can lead us to no other conclusion than she is a controlling monster who is compromising (not really) just long enough to get you where she wants you (nutless and under her thumb). I doubt if that is a place you really want to be.

Breaking off a relationship is always hard but as the saying goes time heals all wounds. If you marry this woman the wounds she can inflict at will will give lie to that saying as the consequences of what she can do can for all practical purposes never be undone.

Make a decision! We can't make it for you.

 

[bruss01]

Hawkmoon, at least we're talking that a loaded gun at home is OK. It's just that "one gun, loaded in a bedside safe, no more other guns, no CCW" is what she thinks represents a compromise, when I don't think this is in her sphere at all. I agree in that I think her fears of accidents are what's driving her here to project her fears on me. Sigh. Still thinking...

jbraun -

Sir, with all due respect, the "thinking" you are doing consists of 33% listening to your own wishful thinking, 33% listening to her, and 33% listening to your "nether manhood" and the "thinking" process consists of trying to mentally shoehorn the facts into the shape of what you wish were true. You've had some EXTREMELY GOOD ADVICE and perspective from other board members here. You aren't really listening to any of it, you're thinking "Yeah, I really should draw the line, but she's so cute, I love the way her eyes twinkle, the shape of her nose, her girlish laugh... is sacrificing my God-given rights such a high price to pay? Maybe she'll get better, maybe I can MAKE her better with time and love... " Again, with all due respect sir, your male hormones are going to make a monkey out of you. She came back, put you under stricter limits than most European gun owners have to live under, and you are going to "think about it". Wrong answer. You should have said "We broke up because you think you can ask me to surrender my inalienable rights, now you're back asking me to do it again. What makes you think I've changed my mind and my rights are now up for negotiation?" Oh, wait, she thinks that after a week with no woman, you'll be h0rny enough to agree to almost anything she lays down.... Um, dude, please don't be offended but are you really that homely, or that much of a dweeb that you think this is the only gal who would want to go out with you? Get some self esteem, get some thick skin, get some True Grit. Please for the love of all that is Holy, snap out of it and sever this relationship. Go back and read my previous post to you, and know that it was written with a true concern for your welfare and your future. As the saying goes, you can lead a horse to water... no one can force you to accept good advice, all I can say is you will prove to yourself what kind of man you are by how you choose to deal with this situation. We all wish you the best and hope to high heavens you don't make a foolish mistake that will affect you the rest of your life.

 

[Green Lantern]

By all accounts, divorce is a NASTY affair, but there could be more at stake than that if you accept her "controls."

Like Hawkmoon said, what good is living by HER rules going to do you in a "SHTF" situation anywhere but in your bedroom...provided you can open the safe in time?

There are more fish in the sea (and living single ain't that bad, ain't killed me yet!). If you get financially gutted in the divorce a relationship like this will probably end up in, well, you can always earn more money.

But if "IT" hits the fan out there....bad....well, sorry. The 007 movie title was wrong...you only live once.

There's a lot to consider when deciding to get a CCW. But by God, it needs to be your choice to make!!!

I understand you've been with her a while....maybe if you take a closer look back you might find more examples of a "controlling" nature from her?

Or, maybe we're wrong and it IS just about fear of guns. But even if that's the case...in my book, there are some things in life you just don't compromise on.

My safety, and that of my loved ones, is one of those things.

jib, I know we're probably coming off like you should just pull the plug on this like turning off a switch. I've never been in your shoes, but I know it can't be that easy. But I know that I think ending the relationship is for the best. I don't know you from nothing...I've barely been here for 24 hours yet. But, I'd really hate to see you marry this woman and have our most dire predictions come true!

BTW, I have a sister-in-law like Barbara. She moans about the cost of bro's CCW. More about the cost of his bikes! But for all that, she lets him carry his gun and ride his chopper!

Oh, and the poster that said antis are fun to have around to debate. They ARE - but preferably as a faceless set of words here on the net. NOT preferable in your house, especially in your bed!

Good luck to the OP...

 

[Tsonda]

Well I was

going to keep quiet but her offer of a comprimise is horrible. Get out now she is going to control you forever. I know I am not the first to say this but damn man this is wrong.

 

[bruss01]

OMG. Still thinking? About what?

MRS.Bruss01 here. DH had to show me this thread and I feel compelled to add my 2 cents.

CUT YOUR LOSSES NOW AND GET OUT.

As a woman who had major control issues as well, I can tell you that every stitch of advice you've been given on this board is "spot on". (it is also true that a man with some nads is waaaay sexier than a spineless dweeb, k?)

You cannot negotiate with someone like this. This is not about the guns, this is about power. I'll say it again: THIS IS NOT ABOUT THE GUNS, THIS IS ABOUT POWER. She wants to control you and is starting with a social hot-button that is very important to you. This is Step 1 of the downward spiral you'll be on if you cave on this issue.

She's doing this under the guise of "feeling safe", but what she's afraid of isn't the gun, it is the power and control that it represents. People with guns are powerful people and she feels so emotionally and psychologically powerless herself that in order to feel "safe" she needs you to be as powerless as she feels. She needs to reduce you to her level of dysfunction. She doesn't need a long term relationship right now with anyone but Dr. Phil (or one of his clones). Her "empathy" is just window dressing to make it more socially acceptable for her to try to control you on this issue and abdicate the responsibility for for her true motives.

Keep in mind, she may not be able to articulate the real reason - she just knows that she feels "unsafe" around people of power. For you to have power and live in proximity with her (and her feelings) has got to unnerve her terribly. If it wasn't the guns, it would be something else.

Is this making any sense? Are you getting that this is not about the guns but your personal, emotional, psychological power vs. hers? Please continue to read and reread the posts in this thread. Think about what advice you'd give a buddy in this situation. Well? What would you tell him?

Zanna, Mrs. Bruss01

 

[JohnKSa]

Reread the thread man!

You're fooling yourself if you think that what just happened changes anything.

She's still the same, and she's bending precious little. What's more, if you want my honest opinion based on experience, that little bend will snap right back out at some point in the future.

This has already been addressed, but you are going to lose a TON of leverage after you say "I do", and even more when kids come along. I know guys who have gone into marriage in LOTS better shape than you and who ended up TOTALLY gun free when kids came on the scene.

I think you're already beyond hope on this, so I'm already into I told you so mode. One day, I can promise you that you're going to remember what I wrote and what you're reading right now.

There will come a day when you realize that you were given LOTS of very good advice and that you ignored it and followed your hormones instead and made a very bad decision. When that day comes, it's going to be a very hard thing to accept and harder yet to live with.

Good luck and I hope you make the right decision.

 

[EvisceratorSrB]

How do I deal with my parents for these next 5 months?! lol I wish it were that easy for the parents, especially when you live in their house! :banghead:

 

[The Guy]

A true story

Edited by author to delet post and to say this;

Good luck buddy, your going to need it. I didn't listen to anyone either.

 

[PATH]

jibraun,

Women don't respect a fellow they can manipulate and push around. It is not about the firearms it is about control. It is a long thread but I think the concensus is to move along if you want your guns and your self respect.

I am married almost 19 years and the wife asked me to leave once and I did. I was back three months later for my little girl's sake though. I told the wife if asked to leave again I was gone for good. The argument was about money and how it was spent. My wife told me it was her way or the highway. Life is too short to be threatened in such fashion. You must be the master of your own destiny!

I am not leaving my manhood in a pickle jar by the door and asking my wife's permission to do anything in life. I pay the bills and save money for the future. I am faithful and do what a husband should do as best I can.

I'll compomise on most things but I won't on things that are important to me.
Being dictated to by anyone should be unacceptable.

My poor .02 cents is that you move on and let it go. You are being told what to do against your will and I can assure you it won't get better.

 

[Beren]

I've been following this thread for awhile now, and I really have only a few comments to make. Keep in mind I am no expert at relationships, though we'll leave the details unsaid. Anyway, serious advice to follow in as simple a form as I can make it:





The only way this will work out for you is if a) you give up your guns or b) she agrees she respects and trusts you, and if you ever have an accident she will /then/ come down on you like a ton of bricks.

 

[jlbraun]

Good advice here.

@Hawkmoon, bruss01

My "Still thinking" was referring to the exact way for me to tell her that I'm not changing my mind on what I want. I haven't ever backed down on things that are important to me, and I'm not about to start now.

Something along the lines of "What I do in this one matter is not up for negotiation. I am a safe and responsible person, I do not drink, I have not had a car accident since 1997, and I pay my taxes. I cannot be in a relationship with a woman who instead of facing her fears herself, admits that she is incapable of controlling her feelings and attempts to control the actions of others instead."

Oh, and I went and got the CHL anyway.

 

[NineseveN]

Much better answer.

 

[ARTiger]

My wife doesn't like guns, but then again she has good martial arts training and keeps a garden implement under her side of the bed that'd scare me if on the other end. It's kinda like an axe turned sideways on one side and a three pronged cultivator on the other. Weighs about 5'lbs of solid iron on a two foot hickory handle.

All I'll say is anyone breaking into our house and threating our kids would really wish all she had was a gun.

On my side of the bed there's a S&W Model 21 .44 special and under the matress is an 870 12 gauge pump with pistol grip and magazine extension. That way they'll beg me to shoot 'em after she's done hacking away.

 

[C96]

jlbraun - You should re-read this thread slowly. What Mrs. Bruss01 said is really what this is all about.

I don't believe your true love is salavageable, although she may think you are.

I think it comes down to two simple choices, eject or cut your nuts off and sell your soul.

You may choose to sell your soul slowly and perhaps painfully but that appears to be one of the two choices.

allan

 

[History Prof]

My "Still thinking" was referring to the exact way for me to tell her that I'm not changing my mind on what I want. I haven't ever backed down on things that are important to me, and I'm not about to start now.

Something along the lines of "What I do in this one matter is not up for negotiation. I am a safe and responsible person, I do not drink, I have not had a car accident since 1997, and I pay my taxes. I cannot be in a relationship with a woman who instead of facing her fears herself, admits that she is incapable of controlling her feelings and attempts to control the actions of others instead."

Oh, and I went and got the CHL anyway.

JL, I gotta say here, that there should be no thinking - period. What you've said above leaves me the impression that you're thinking of a way to tell her it is your way or the hiway, hoping to salvage the relationship. Son, she's not gonna accept your way. The "no recreational shooting" comment made that one VERY obvious. The only thought process here is do I end it, or do I go HER way. You're the one with the on-ramp coming up. GET ON THE HIWAY. I would change what you've written above to "I cannot be in a relationship with a woman who wants me to give up a fundamental part of myself. GOODBYE. PERIOD."

 

[Q-Lock]

jlbraun,

Congrats on the CHL! Personally, I believe you're handling the situation pretty darn well. I know I wouldn't want to be in your shoes...luckily my wife of a little over a year is all for firearms and personal protection/CCW. It seems you know what to do, although it may be difficult for you to go through with it.

Good luck, and if you don't mind, keep us updated.

Regards,

 

[steelhead]

There is a definite level of maturity that is required from both of you on this subject.

It is all about compromising but neither of you can or want to compromise on this subject. 1 gun, by the bed, will turn into a safe full as you push her. Likewise, she will push you back to get rid of just the 1 gun..... Based on your comments, and portrayal of events, I only see this ending in a break up. Hopefully it will happen before there are any kids involved.

You question how much she loves and respects you but how much do you love and respect her?

Do you love and respect her enough to give up your firearms or agree, for life, on that 1 handgun and no CCW (that is no different than what you are asking her to do with her convictions)?

Do you, at least, love and respect her enough to tell her that this relationship will not work and both of you need to move on?

This is grown up time and things do not always work out.

 

[The_Antibubba]

At least you aren't married.

JL,

I can't add much to what has been said, although Mrs. BRuss and Greybeard 7 have said it best AFAIC. I think you understand, but "walking out the door" for real is hard, no matter how necessary it is.

I dated the same woman for 12 years. If I'd been right in the head, it would've been three, max. Her problems make your GFs sound like a dream come true. The basic truth is, most people do not change. Sometimes there is something dramatic, like a religious conversion, or something mundane, like seeing your daughter for the first time, but change is usually slow going. And we usually don't do it unless something pushes us into it.

Compromise is 2-way. Your GF is not compromising. She has given you permission. Anything that an authority can give can be taken away. That's why the Bill of Rights is so amazing-no ONE can take away G-d Given rights. They can be given away, though. As crazy as it may seem to us, your GF has every right to feel the way she does, and to live by those rules, even if it gets her killed. She has "generously" told you of what your rights are, in her sphere of influence.

You haven't wasted three years. Sometimes I feel as though I wasted twelve, but when I consider who I've become and where I'm at, I don't know if I'd be doing so well without them (I was a Philosophy major, too ). It'll only be wasted if you fail to learn from it.

I know you know it is over, because you'll never be able to trust her until she's competing in IDPA with her own race gun! For all of her problems I knew my GF would cover me as far as her own psychological horrors would let her, and sometimes past them-which is why I stayed so long, because there was growth and change. But it would have taken her 200 years to get to good place, and I didn't have that long.

You really seem to be rational and on top of the situation, so I'm not worried about what you'll do. The doing is still hard.

 

[abearir]

A

gun is nothing more than iron and wood in its basic element. Just as a hammer is iron and wood. Both are capable of great acomplishments and great distruction. The difference is the craftsman or idiot holding it........I would rather be the craftsman. I use this very statement when confronted by anti's as a firearms instructor.

 

[JohnKSa]

I think this represents a major giving in on her part...

This is so messed up I don't even know where to start. This is not giving in the least, let alone major giving. She's still dictating the precise conditions to be in effect which means she hasn't given up any control at all, she's just trying to maintain control by softening her initially wildly unreasonable stance a tiny bit.

When you're walking the dog and you let out an extra foot of leash, are you giving the dog control? Nope, you're just letting him FEEL a little bit more in control.

What I do in this one matter is not up for negotiation

I don't believe you have told her this for the simple reason that she's still negotiating with you.

And I don't believe that you really believe that the matter is not up for negotiation because because you're posting her negotiations here like they're progress.

If the matter is not up for negotiation then negotiation is NOT progress. In fact, it's the exact opposite of progress.

You're fooling yourself--both about your girlfriend and yourself.

 

[Aguila Blanca]

Let me repeat something that was touched on earlier in this thread, but appears to have been forgotten:

Mr. Braun, you and this young woman are discussing (or were) the possibility of living together, so I'm probably not going too far out on a limb to surmise that your relationship is, ah ... "intimate." Remember the mention of restraining orders, and losing your right to even touch a firearm -- FOREVER. You don't have to be married for this to occur -- anyone in an "intimate" relationship can go to the cops at any time and claim to feel threatened, and it's all over but the shouting.

If your personal dignity and your personal rights are important to you, there is no need and no reason to risk this. And don't even think "Oh, but she'd never do that," because she could well surprise you. I wouldn't have believed that my first wife, whose thousands of dollars in credit card debt I paid off after we married, would go into court two years later and claim that I had embezzled thousands of dollars [that she never had] from her ... but that's exactly what happened.

You, sir, are playing with a live hand grenade. The pin has already been pulled, and now we're just standing around to see if the spoon has been released or if she's still holding onto it ...

 

[BergaminoCAV]

good work, Im glad my girl doesnt mind me owning guns

 

[TimboKhan]

My take on this as a divorcee 5 years past his divorce? Well, there are some extentuating circumstances with my ex-wife, but the end result is that the person that threw me out of the house was just miserable to live with, and I am thankful that she pulled the trigger on our relationship. Because of that experience, at this point in my life, I simply have not the time, desire or patience to be in a relationship that requires me to "change". I just don't have it in me anymore to go through all the nagging and bitching and complaining that the women that I seem to attract put me through. Guns, watching the Broncos and the Rockies play, going hunting and fishing and shooting with the boys, playing my guitar and reading books are all parts of me that may seem like somewhat superficial reasons to disqualify a potential mate, but dammit, those are the things that I like to do and things that are important to me. Ideally, it would be nice if some of those were shared activities, but at a bare minimum, any girl that I go out with is going to have to understand that those are things that are not gonna change with me. I am pretty bad at playing the guitar, so I will make the concession to turn it down, but thats it....